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Forums > C64 Pixeling > Who needs Timanthes anywy.
2014-06-25 10:25
Carrion

Registered: Feb 2009
Posts: 188
Who needs Timanthes anywy.

First of all... Timanthes rules it's a great tool.

... but lately I started to use a method/process using Photoshop to achieve 8bit pixel art. The technique gives you control over everything from dithering to color rams plus all PS tools/filters.
IMHO the results are amazing. I think It could be a ultimate converting tool or more precisely a great tool for prototyping/sketching.
The only problem for demoscene could be that results are IMO so good it's hard to tell if it's wired or not.

Take a look:
http://crrnpixels.tumblr.com/post/89843863323/using-photoshop-f..
To convert picture made by Made it took me 10 minutes.

more examples here
http://crrnpixels.tumblr.com/

Please keep in mind that in the examples on the blog no single pixel was put by me. All magic was done by Photoshop.

In next few days I'll post more on my blog describing the method itself.
 
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2015-02-27 16:03
Jailbird

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1453
Timanthes is gay. You should pixel like a man.
2015-02-27 16:52
wacek

Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 340
What Mixer said, and what Mixer said ;)
2015-02-27 19:38
Carrion

Registered: Feb 2009
Posts: 188
@wacek, @mixer
I think we (the scene) should start to distinguish between pixel art and scene art.
people tend to think they are the same, but IMO they are not!
scene art comes back to deep '80's when we tried to do pictures look photorealistic on our 8bit machine, to invent new gfx modes (from FLI to NUFLI/MUIFLI) to impress with nice looking pictures in our tech demos.
Pixel art on the other hand for me is a way of pure, symbolic in form creations. Pixel art is mastering minimal form to achieve meaningfull results. Something the demoscene is not ready for and will never be. With no extra FX (like PAL blending) or unusual dither/hatching, or NUFLI/MUIFLI limitations, etc, etc...
Take a look at last 4 meaningful gfx compos. Was it art or some flashy images to entertain the audience at the party?

Pixel art is something you saw in Games, something that started on the Arcade back then (C64 and amiga too to be honset), It's a way to create minimalistic forms. Ofcoz parts of these we have on C64... some game sprites, some game backgrounds, etc, but...

As demosceners we create demoscene art. And this term contains Boris Vallejo copies, late '90's Colages, Own photos retouches, , Own lame Creations and even JSL illustrations. it's much wider container thas just pixel art term itself.
Take a look at Artcity. 95% of images there are lame copies or wireing or some reeeaaaaaaly weird creation that have nothing in common with an art and pixel art whatsoever.. AND THAT'S OK. IT'S PART OF OUR SCENE!

So Wacek and Mixer
Pixeling is Art! Demoscene art is a craftsmanship + good ideas! That's my point of view
2015-02-27 20:09
Hein

Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 772
How about Plain PETSCII Graphics Competition? It's also about using abstract forms to create something meaningfull.

I think the scene has been ready for pixelart for decades. Alot full screen images contain small gems with a couple of pixels representing an object or matter. Even 8x8 charactersets.

I agree that 80s game-artists mastered this best, though.
2015-02-27 20:13
PAL

Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 215
What is art? To me it is to create something and put it into context or not put it into context... Art is a too big area to discuss in a way... because if you just do something it is art in my mind. When that is said - for me it is about making it yours, if you use ref images... to just create a copy is not the greatest art, but if that image fit into a story or line of events it sure will do its meaning for being there... right?

Like in RGB... it is no secret that Cyclops is the ref image for the superhero blasting the light beams at the logos at the nearing of the end... I am maybe lame but to me it felt more natural to create a good looking Cyclops there than a lame look-alike, right? It would just feel wrong there... like inside you would think hey he is not Cyclops... he is something else... maybe it could be fun but it would alter what the idea was for me.

So what is art... I do not know... On the c64 I tend to look at my own pixels as art because it is me, I create them on the c64 for all of my friends and also me. I like to blend it, use ref and use mine and blend it all together in something I like. I think that is my way.

At the X2014 I created my own image as I often do and I think I created a cool one... but if the idea were to create a Donald in a Disney themed demo I think I would have used Carl Barks drawings to create it into my sceneries or something, it would have been more powerful than my own Donald I think... something like that! hmmm...
2015-02-27 20:29
Bitbreaker

Registered: Oct 2002
Posts: 422
It is only art if it is underlined with a huge amount of sermon to explain it.
2015-02-27 20:39
Hein

Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 772
Quoting Bitbreaker
It is only art if it is underlined with a huge amount of semen to explain it.


So typical.
2015-02-27 20:44
wacek

Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 340
Dear cArrion of pEnsion ScheMe group (ESM for short), you are definately getting old and your sight is wearing down. There was a ';)' at the end...

I personally consider a lot of demoscene art - 'real' art. Some is art because of the form, some because of the content or meaning behind it. Some both. I do not limit it to graphics - same goes for demos and music. For example, I try to put meaning behind most of my SID music, because it is important for me to say something.

Similarily to wire-job discussions, I hate most SID covers (own work included) and SIDs with lifted melodies/hooks.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that you shouldn't feel offended or disrespected.
2015-02-28 10:59
Mixer

Registered: Apr 2008
Posts: 213
@Carrion, I understand your point of view.

Personally, I try to avoid self deception and becoming deceived, cynic that I am.

This means that a copy of a picture is a copy of a picture, borrowed motif is a borrowed motif etc. It is ok, as long as authors are honest about such things and no work magically becomes art just because someone spent a lot of effort in converting it by hand or simply just because it was a huge personal achievement. An honest compliment for a good conversion job is to say that it is a good conversion job.
2015-03-09 10:40
v3to

Registered: Feb 2005
Posts: 131
well, imo methods for reducing generic worksteps during the creativity process are always welcome. i also like the 'dither' approach, because this is the usual flaw of conversion tools - though timanthes is advanced in this case.

i am with pal though (as he said in the scarlet comments). those results are more like a basis similar to outlines or color-reduced scans and i'd also spend dozens of hours to get a picture look like as it was planned.

personally i do not believe that my pics or workflow would improve significant, but it is definitely interesting for preparing sketches. guess many artist could save much time here. nethertheless i hope this does not lead to another copy-era with a flood of rushed postprocessed photographs.
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