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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Which 6581 revision...
Hi!
Which -> 6581 <- revision sounds best? Which one has the best sounding filters?
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Soren
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 547 |
I've had different revisions of 6581 but for many years I've used R4. I prefer the filters it has. both when talking about the cut-off range and the sound of the filters... they can sound so warm and yet you can also do cool things with the saturation.
I've heard other revisions that have lower cutoff range, which I think is too low... but still any 6581 filter is (to me) better than 8580. The filterrange is so odd and not logic at all on 8580. the cutoff is generally too high... just going one step up (using highbyte) is too rough for most standard music players that don't use the lower bits of the cutoff.
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Sidder
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 56 |
[OT]
The best one is just... 8580. :> $5 and $6 waves sound nice and let composer create more (unusual) instruments. Old SID doesn't support AND between waves and it's in my opinion the biggest sin of 6581 chip.
Filters? In old SID they are so subdued... Yes, I know that a lot of scene people love them. But why?
Samples in 8580 are hardly audible, but this bug may be corrected by (seemingly) simple chip modification.
So there's no reason to use old chip.
[/OT]
Quoting Jeff
the cutoff is generally too high...
It is advantage. Take a look at this tune: http://www.c64.org/HVSC/VARIOUS/S-Z/Shogoon/Timsoft_Intro.sid - this is model of great new SID bass. :) |
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Laxity
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 459 |
Funny, I find that the bass sounds the best on a 6581 of the song you linked to! |
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Sidder
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 56 |
Sounds best for you. For me sounds best under 8580. So it's rather subjective feeling.
Besides that, under old chip you don't hear intro lead in this Shogoon's zak.
PS. Sorry Laxity, I've sent you private message because of little mistake. :] |
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Hate Bush
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 453 |
Depends on what you're used to, I suppose.
I'm a 8580 fan because of its magnificent highpass filter -with proper settings, it somehow boosts some frequencies above the cutoff point instead of sucking out below it. Which can be helpful in drum programming, if you set the filter resonance & cutoff (highpass or highpass+bandpass - the latter sounds even better) to certain values ($F, $02 for bassdrums, for example). |
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V-12
Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 206 |
teh emulatar users speaks about which sid sounds da best. /me laughs! |
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Sidder
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 56 |
Quoting Murdockteh emulatar users speaks about which sid sounds da best.
Ooo, man_who_knows_five_sounds (a, a#, b, c, d)?
Murdock, have you learnt how to create own instruments? Because your all "tunes" have - what a miracle! - stolen instruments. Sometimes not only instruments:
- Murdock's "tune": http://www.c64.org/HVSC/VARIOUS/M-R/Murdock/Intro_Zak_Remix.sid
- Touldie's song: http://www.c64.org/HVSC/VARIOUS/S-Z/Touldie/Intro_Zak.sid
Quoting Murdock /me laughs!
We "laughs", too. |
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Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
Well.. I've tested around 20 6581 R2 and R3. I haven't yet compared them to R4 or R4AR as I don't have any of those :(
But, so far it's my distinct impression that the R2 generaly has a lower cuf-off frequency than R3. I have one R2 with a distinctly more relaxed filter though.
One of the tests I put them through is Lightforce and so far the only chip that plays it (almost) correct is the R2 with the higher cut-off. All the other ones simply miss the really high-notes. However the other R2s can make a really cool bassssssss! ;-)
8580? ..oh it simply cannot compete with the charme of 6581... :-P
@jeff: is it an R4 og R4AR you have?
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V-12
Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 206 |
SIDDER: fuck you! you even are not a real scener so stick up into your emulator baybe.
We all real sceners started from something. Alot of composers used others tunes to compose their own or simply to learn how to compose. But of course you don't know that because you are not into real scene (and also HVSC doesn't mention about that sadly for you). No need to explain why the remix of Touldie's song got released. I confessed everything in my music collection (or STIL in hvsc) so your post is useless.
And since which time you are "we" ? Back off simply! |
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CyberBrain
Administrator
Posts: 392 |
I for one am in the 8580 camp. Maybe i'm biased because it's the one i've allways had since i was a kid, so the more "muddy" sound (intentional provocation) of the 6581 just sounds wrong to me. :D
While playing around with sid chips in emulators, it has even surprised me that old tunes which was obviously made for the 6581 very often sounds much better on the 8580! The filters sound totally different, but they get a grooovy electronic feel to it imo.
(yea, ok - this was totally offtopic subjective shit)
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5017 |
I had a c64 with old sid for many many years. And I hated the lamely sounding tunes on my friends c64s.
later I got used to the new sid. Now I say it sounds better. To me oldsid has an oldschool sound :)
So its simply a matter of taste, and what r u used to. |
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Intensity
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 337 |
I also prefer the 8580. The new waveforms and the special filter cut offs are a must for me since I am Trance-Musician. :D |
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Laxity
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 459 |
Quote: teh emulatar users speaks about which sid sounds da best. /me laughs!
;) Laugh away... How'd you know we're "emulator users" all of us?..
Well. shit.. you got me Murdock, I apologize.. I don't know which sid version/revision is the best!.. I just know that the SID is the best... Eh.. yeah!.. Oh, and 6581 was the original one that I used back in the old days, so the replacement (read: 8580) must be a fake and degenerated sid. ;)
(No flaming guys.. I hate it.. I'm made of snow!)
I hate the fact that there the 8580 can do stuff the 6581 can't do.. It annoys me - what's the reason for this?.. Someone must have had a brainfart when they desided to update the 64!
Peace!
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Yodelking
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 189 |
I agree that C-64 music sounds a lot different on real SIDchips compared to emulated SID, but saying that you're not a scener because the use of emulator is rather ridiculous. |
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SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
And once again Murdock goes forward with his god sword, hacking down lamers!
What chip is best ?
Probably the one you used the most.
Once you're turned, there's no way back.
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
Quote:SIDDER: fuck you! you even are not a real scener so stick up into your emulator baybe.
We all real sceners started from something. Alot of composers used others tunes to compose their own or simply to learn how to compose. But of course you don't know that because you are not into real scene (and also HVSC doesn't mention about that sadly for you).
Mention what? That Sidder uses an emulator to compose? Does he? Does that make him less a scener than you are? Are you the one to decide who's a scener or not? And who would give a wet fart anyway?
I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding about HVSC and the scene in general. We're just a bunch of collectors trying to collect sids and preserve a little bit of C= history. We're not defenders of anyone's whacked scene ethics. And you just put your foot in it once more and proved your ignorance, just when people thought you'd be probably halfway grown up now... |
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Ooooh nooo! I didn't want the usual discussion about 6581 Vs. 8580. :-(
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Hate Bush
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 453 |
Nata: It just had to be this way, I'm afraid. :)
I guess not many of us have enough experience to tell the differences between 6581 revisions, while that's a wider available entertainment to discuss 6581 vs. 8580. |
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Raf
Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 343 |
6851 are just soooo different among various production series , not only revisions , so there is no direct answer to your question. we may consider 8580 as great update to this issue as there is no noticable difference beetwen 8580s, maybe except some series capable of playing digis loudly - like 6581 (I had c64 1991 with BN/E board and 8580 playing digis loud and my dying 1988 128Dcr can do loud digi also with his 8580r5) .
If I remeber properly from c64 schematics... the resistor connected to AUDIO_IN used with 6581 was removed with 8580 (and about 200-400k resistor connected beetwen AUDIO_IN and GND with 8580 is known as digi boost) ... maybe it was just the mod which removed the volume change click and just disallowed loud digis?
one tune by Booker came to my mind - he composed it on real 6581r4 (ar?) and as I suppose his chip is so strange that it sounds rather close to 8580 . you may hear this in his "Are You Satisfied ? (idleness)" tune. I have OGG recording from his sid chip if anyone is interested.
comment from that stream:
"A preview of this tune was sent to www.c64.sk SID COMPO 4. Funny that I had to spread it as written in 8580 because reSID played filters at too low frequency with some icking, but originally it has been made with 6581R4. This tune has been recorded from my C-64, therefore you might notice a background noise generated by originall VIC & SID chips." |
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Cruzer
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1048 |
I think musicians should limit themselves to tunes consiting of only simple beep sounds and white noise drums. Then they gotta sound the same on all SID chips. :o) |
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Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
I believe I once heard or read somewhere the the 6581R4AR chips should be just as equal in quality as the 8580. Can anyone confirm this?
Unfortunately it's not easy for me to get my hands on say 10 AR chips to actually test this myself :-/ |
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Soren
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 547 |
@sidder: waves $50 and $60 works just fine on my 6581r4.... but those waves are quite boring... you don't need those to do something special.... just check what I've been doing sondwise over the years... only used wave $50 a few times.
but 6581 or 8580... seems to be a matter of taste or what you're used to... I just hate the stupid cut-off curves in 8580... makes no sense at all.
Also one more thing, which again has something to do with what you like or are used to... 6581 filters sound more "warm" to me, whereas 8580 sound a bit more "plastic".
A positive thing about 8580 is that you can switch filtertypes more smooth than on 6581, it seems.
But I know what I like..... www.6581.dk
;-)
@Cruzer: I think coders should limit themselves to only using ASL,BRK and NOP ;-) |
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Hein
Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 933 |
Quote: I think musicians should limit themselves to tunes consiting of only simple beep sounds and white noise drums. Then they gotta sound the same on all SID chips. :o)
Or accept the fact that the tunes sound differently on different sids. |
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Laxity
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 459 |
Quote: @sidder: waves $50 and $60 works just fine on my 6581r4.... but those waves are quite boring... you don't need those to do something special.... just check what I've been doing sondwise over the years... only used wave $50 a few times.
but 6581 or 8580... seems to be a matter of taste or what you're used to... I just hate the stupid cut-off curves in 8580... makes no sense at all.
Also one more thing, which again has something to do with what you like or are used to... 6581 filters sound more "warm" to me, whereas 8580 sound a bit more "plastic".
A positive thing about 8580 is that you can switch filtertypes more smooth than on 6581, it seems.
But I know what I like..... www.6581.dk
;-)
@Cruzer: I think coders should limit themselves to only using ASL,BRK and NOP ;-)
But you mean all emulated, right? ;)
Waveform $51 works on my old 6581r1 (At least I think it's a r1, cause the filter is bizzar!) too, so possibly that one was always ok.. It goes mute when the pulse width goes above .. eh dunno.. 2^8 or something (from the top of my head!).. You probably know this anyway!..
What's the story about the 6581r4AR anyway?.. I've never before heard about that particular revision?.. |
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Sidder
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 56 |
Quoting Murdock
SIDDER: fuck you!
Jestes zerem...
Quoting Murdock
stick up into your emulator
... i hipokryta.
It's funny that Murdock is always so "brave" only in virtal reallity. When I wanted to talk with him at North Party in 2004, I heard only silent whisper "sorry" and saw Murdock runnig away into next room.
Quoting Murdock
Alot of composers used others tunes to compose their own
Yes, but not for 8 years, "baybe"...
Quoting Murdock
you are not into real scene
It's just your imagination, your imagination, your imagination...
Quoting Murdock
No need to explain why the remix of Touldie's song got released.
'cause there's no rational explanation to release such crap "tune".
Quoting Laxity
Someone must have had a brainfart when they desided to update the 64!
Especially this silent samples in 8580... Samples-playing technique was - if I'm right - known when Commodore started producing new SID.
Quoting Randall
I guess not many of us have enough experience to tell the differences between 6581 revisions
But emulation is good enough to see main differences beteen new and old SID. And it's enough to tell old SID has too hard filter (for me) and doesn't support $5/$6/$3 waves.
Quoting Jeff
waves $50 and $60 works just fine on my 6581r4.... but those waves are quite boring...
No, why? :) They are boring same as other waves. IMHO people doesn't use mixed waves also because of old SID - where $5 sounds like taken directly from "Texas Chainsaw Massacre"... |
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Laxity
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 459 |
The $51 waveform goes mute around 12*(2^8).. Forgot the 12 part ;).. I wish I hadn't written that, anyway!.. You all know this, so I feel a bit stupid. Sorry, didn't want to sound like a wanna-be-know-it-all!
Here's an idea: We all go reSid, use the 6581 setting and it all sounds the same..
My wife just walked in.. I had some SID music I'm working on playing, and here's what she said: "I don't get it.. It sounds like crap all of it!.. Those tweeky sounds.. Sound distorted to me..." .. I think from that the conclusion is: Any SID revision is a SHIT revision (or maybe it's just my music!). ;) |
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Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
@laxity: until the next version of reSID ;-)
oh, and MY wife actually likes your music ,-) |
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Laxity
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 459 |
Quote: @laxity: until the next version of reSID ;-)
oh, and MY wife actually likes your music ,-)
about reSid, true..!
She does?.. Cool ;)
My wife likes my acustic music, but that SID stuff she doesn't get. It's a flaw in her upbringing, you have to excuse her ;) |
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Hate Bush
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 453 |
Quote:My wife just walked in.. I had some SID music I'm working on playing, and here's what she said: "I don't get it.. It sounds like crap all of it!.. Those tweeky sounds.. Sound distorted to me..."
Same here.
I would almost admit that my dearest one is right ("YES, this is beep/blip/boing stuff, but I like it, so won't you let me finish this for chrissakes!"), but I think she is just allergic to certain synth sounds. Yesterday evening I was listening to Kraftwerk and she couldn't stand it either.
Eh, women. |
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Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
To get back on topic, check out http://sid.kubarth.com/
anybody got a 6582 btw? |
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Yodelking
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 189 |
Quote: To get back on topic, check out http://sid.kubarth.com/
anybody got a 6582 btw?
Yes, I have one. (It's my photo on that site) :)
I have 6582, 6581 R1 or R2 (those revision are unmarked afaik), R3, R4, and 8580 R5.
I haven't compared a lot though, but I know some chips within the same revision sounds very different.
Someone once told me that 6582 was a lot like the 8580, but digis played on it. |
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Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
Well you _could_ test that 6582 ;-)
I read somewhere that R2 was already in production before the c64, so it would be fairly unlikely to find an R1 in a c64. It would have to be dated early 82.
Looking at the pictures on that site I come to think that maybe my one good R2 is a CSG and not a MOS. All other 6581 I have are MOS. Unfortunately I cannot (easily) check it as I have heat-sinked it, but I can remember the print being more dense and maybe even without a logo.
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
I've got two R4ARs, would trade one for a R4 (for some odd reason I never had one of these). |
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Raf
Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 343 |
6582 is replacement for 6581 , it's actually very 8580 alike (anyway if I remember right , it uses different caps , so 6582 may should have even different filter characteristics)
there is probably no 6582 in Poland however ;-)
I suppose 6581r4ar was introduced when c128 came out... it generally looks that c64 was imporoved (I mean the BN/E board) after C128D cost reduced came out circa 1987 (hence the 8580 and 5v only vic-II IMO) |
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Sidder
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 56 |
Quoting Yodelking
I have 6582, 6581 R1 or R2 (those revision are unmarked afaik), R3, R4, and 8580 R5.
Hmmm... Maybe you should seriosly think about preparing comparison test for all these five chips? :)
1. Create sid-tune with all "debatable" elements (mixed waves, filters and even samples) included.
2. Play it on each SID chip type.
3. Record it and put result mp3 files into web.
(like done at www.sid.kubarth.com: http://sid.kubarth.com/files/sid_draxish_6581.mp3 and http://sid.kubarth.com/files/sid_draxish_8580.mp3 )
Such comparison would probably stop a lot of unproductive convesations. :] |
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Does someone could record some mp3s/oggs from different 6581 revisions? (8580 is not necasary)
A short filter slide from $00 to $FF should be enough. It would be interesting to hear how it sounds on different 658x rev.
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Quote: Does someone could record some mp3s/oggs from different 6581 revisions? (8580 is not necasary)
A short filter slide from $00 to $FF should be enough. It would be interesting to hear how it sounds on different 658x rev.
Actually, I quite often use $61 waveform for drums. It gives it quite a hard touch.
Depends on what is required even $31 (good for techno-electro sounds), $51, or $71 is used by me. So, it is everything but NOT USELESS!! :)
exemple:
09 00
61 AA
11 AA
11 A5
10 A0
10 98
10 92
10 81
FF 00
@JEFF
jeff wrote : "I just hate the stupid cut-off curves in 8580... makes no sense at all."
hmm, what exactly you mean with "stupid cutt-off" and "makes no sense at all"???????
I can remember, that my first 8580 tunes had very ugly (weak) filter settings.
There are tons of such tunes in HVSC that are afflicted by weakness, but that is a problem of the player & editor.
If you have a 6581 SID you can have the worst player and the filtered bass will always sound good. (since the cutoff is non linear)
To get a "warm" sound with the 8580 you just have to re-programm filters frame by frame... (however, it's only possible with more advanced players)
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Linus
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 638 |
lo,
Quote:it is everything but NOT USELESS!!
Hehe, indeed ... :P
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VIC
Registered: Aug 2003
Posts: 73 |
Quote: Actually, I quite often use $61 waveform for drums. It gives it quite a hard touch.
Depends on what is required even $31 (good for techno-electro sounds), $51, or $71 is used by me. So, it is everything but NOT USELESS!! :)
exemple:
09 00
61 AA
11 AA
11 A5
10 A0
10 98
10 92
10 81
FF 00
@JEFF
jeff wrote : "I just hate the stupid cut-off curves in 8580... makes no sense at all."
hmm, what exactly you mean with "stupid cutt-off" and "makes no sense at all"???????
I can remember, that my first 8580 tunes had very ugly (weak) filter settings.
There are tons of such tunes in HVSC that are afflicted by weakness, but that is a problem of the player & editor.
If you have a 6581 SID you can have the worst player and the filtered bass will always sound good. (since the cutoff is non linear)
To get a "warm" sound with the 8580 you just have to re-programm filters frame by frame... (however, it's only possible with more advanced players)
@Nata>>It's just because of Jeffs poor coding skills and lacking understanding of SID - nevermind him ;) |
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Soren
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 547 |
09 00
61 AA
11 AA
11 A5
10 A0
10 98
10 92
10 81
FF 00
still wondering what those freq values are?
actual highfreq values? or notetable-freqs which you have to
subtract $80 from ?
About the stupid filter curves of 8580.. again... $00-$80 or so seems to do something, but are like $00-$FF on 6581... and after $80 (on 8580) nothing amazing seems to happen(or?) So why was it done like this?
also:
>I can remember, that my first 8580 tunes had very ugly >(weak) filter settings.
>There are tons of such tunes in HVSC that are afflicted by >weakness, but that is a problem of the player & editor.
Sounds more like a problem of the composer to me.
Some tunes here, recorded from a 6581r4...
http://www.6581.dk/files/6581r4/
6581r4 seems to work just fine for those "new techno synth sound" etc...
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
@jeff!
These values are "highfreq values" or "locked values" - whatever you wish. :)
09 00
61 AA ; f#-3
11 AA
11 A5
10 A0
10 98
10 92 ; f#-1
10 81 ; c#-0
FF 00
Well, I will respect your opinion about the 8580 SID and its "stupid filter curves". :)
But I have my doubts, that your example songs will sound as good on other SID revisions, right?
jeff wrote: "About the stupid filter curves of 8580.. again... $00-$80 or so seems to do something, but are like $00-$FF on 6581... and after $80 (on 8580) nothing amazing seems to happen(or?) So why was it done like this?"
Depends, what do you expect from a filter?
Btw. If you use a 8580, then value '$00' does nothing (audible). Ok, maybe there is just a minimal filter output, but usually not useful for composing ...
------
Ok, everyone can try out the following example (8580 SID):
Bass example:
Wave:
09 00
81 c4 ; g#-5
41 00 ; not locked
FF 00
Pulse:
Start value: $200
+ speed $10
- speed $10
Filter:
Low-pass + resonance $F
80 ; cut-off $80, frame 01 (noise)will be filtered
40 ; cut-off $40, frame 02 (pulse)
1A
0A
05 ; cut-off $05, frame 05
FF
---
Btw, it would be really interesting to HEAR a 6582.
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Soren
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 547 |
@Nata:
Well I do respect people prefering 8580 instead of 6581.
(Just so you know) ;-)
I guess my main reason for not liking 8580 as much, is that I don't understand why they have to change it so much. If they atleast had kept the filters more alike, so that the cutoffs sound more or less the same on both chips, then I would have been more happy about it ;-)
It makes it harder for a musician to make filters that sound good on both chips... for instance vocoder-like sounds, which are often very dependant on the filtercutoff, it's hard to get
those to sound good on both chips... Atleast I have some worktune with a quite deep vocoder-like sound, that "says" :
"Viruz"... it's done on 6581r4 and even by chancing the cutoff just +/- 1 it doesn't sound as it should.
:-) |
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V-12
Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 206 |
Quote: Quoting Murdock
SIDDER: fuck you!
Jestes zerem...
Quoting Murdock
stick up into your emulator
... i hipokryta.
It's funny that Murdock is always so "brave" only in virtal reallity. When I wanted to talk with him at North Party in 2004, I heard only silent whisper "sorry" and saw Murdock runnig away into next room.
Quoting Murdock
Alot of composers used others tunes to compose their own
Yes, but not for 8 years, "baybe"...
Quoting Murdock
you are not into real scene
It's just your imagination, your imagination, your imagination...
Quoting Murdock
No need to explain why the remix of Touldie's song got released.
'cause there's no rational explanation to release such crap "tune".
Quoting Laxity
Someone must have had a brainfart when they desided to update the 64!
Especially this silent samples in 8580... Samples-playing technique was - if I'm right - known when Commodore started producing new SID.
Quoting Randall
I guess not many of us have enough experience to tell the differences between 6581 revisions
But emulation is good enough to see main differences beteen new and old SID. And it's enough to tell old SID has too hard filter (for me) and doesn't support $5/$6/$3 waves.
Quoting Jeff
waves $50 and $60 works just fine on my 6581r4.... but those waves are quite boring...
No, why? :) They are boring same as other waves. IMHO people doesn't use mixed waves also because of old SID - where $5 sounds like taken directly from "Texas Chainsaw Massacre"...
Main topic: Asking about what thing is the best is always problematic. Because we all are different and prefer different things. I got accustomed to 8580, because I had it first. But for sure good composer can do everything, no matter which sid-chip is placed inside his Commy.
Offtopic to explain some things to one stranger:
Quoting Sidder
Jestes zerem...
You think that? Really? Why don't you write it in english?
Quoting Sidder
It's funny that Murdock is always so "brave" only in virtal reallity. When I wanted to talk with him at North Party in 2004, I heard only silent whisper "sorry" and saw Murdock runnig away into next room.
Yea it's funny! How can I talk with you when you are not treating me serious? And what about did you wanted to talk with me? Come on, be brave and send me a PM about your problems. Would be nice to receive a normal message instead of gay message from your friend and groupmate or that extremely stupid fake discmags and low-level articles about stories which never happened.
Quoting Murdock
No need to explain why the remix of Touldie's song got released.
Quoting Sidder
'cause there's no rational explanation to release such crap "tune".
So why there was the reason to release for example /VARIOUS/S-Z/Sanden_Peter/BMX_Kidz_Remix_PSID.sid tune and many more tunes? Plenty of covers, plenty of tunes with borrowed instrumets...but of course you don't know about that or simply you are ignoring alot of facts. I know atleast 1 composer who did his all tunes with using someone's Instruments...Why don't you bug those other people, who released other stuff with borrowed instruments? But well... I'm tired about explaining it, simply back off from me. I don't like you and your attitude and behaviour.
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V-12
Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 206 |
wow, quoting here is really extreme! there should be the preview before submit the new post ;-) |
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Hate Bush
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 453 |
Murdock, I remember you saying: "sitting in my room with a C64 saves me from all filth of this world". It seems like sitting in your room with a C64 kept you safe from the world, and also from eventually getting a life, very efficiently. Cheers. |
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Yodelking
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 189 |
>[Murdock wrote:]
>So why there was the reason to release for
>example /VARIOUS/S-Z/Sanden_Peter/BMX_Kidz_Remix_PSID.sid
>tune and many more tunes? Plenty of covers, plenty of
>tunes with borrowed instrumets...but of course you don't
>know about that or simply you are ignoring alot of facts.
>I know atleast 1 composer who did his all tunes with
>using someone's Instruments...Why don't you bug those
>other people, who released other stuff with borrowed
>instruments? But well... I'm tired about explaining it,
>simply back off from me. I don't like you and your
>attitude and behaviour.
I didn't borrow instruments, I took the whole BMX Kidz tune, and just changed the digis. I did this 1988 when I was 15, and we released it in a demo. For me it was worth releasing, as I thought it was a fun idea back then. Our demos was lame and so were we, but we had lots of fun.
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Yodelking
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 189 |
>[Nata wrote:]
>Btw, it would be really interesting to HEAR a 6582.
I'm not gonna make a SID out of the suggested values, but if you mail me a SID you want me to try on the different SIDchips I have, I can do that.
Note though that they are placed in my HardSID on the PC, and not on a real C-64. |
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V-12
Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 206 |
Quote: >[Murdock wrote:]
>So why there was the reason to release for
>example /VARIOUS/S-Z/Sanden_Peter/BMX_Kidz_Remix_PSID.sid
>tune and many more tunes? Plenty of covers, plenty of
>tunes with borrowed instrumets...but of course you don't
>know about that or simply you are ignoring alot of facts.
>I know atleast 1 composer who did his all tunes with
>using someone's Instruments...Why don't you bug those
>other people, who released other stuff with borrowed
>instruments? But well... I'm tired about explaining it,
>simply back off from me. I don't like you and your
>attitude and behaviour.
I didn't borrow instruments, I took the whole BMX Kidz tune, and just changed the digis. I did this 1988 when I was 15, and we released it in a demo. For me it was worth releasing, as I thought it was a fun idea back then. Our demos was lame and so were we, but we had lots of fun.
Yea the fun is most important! I didn't said that you borrowed the Instruments but simply you did the remix of this song like I did with one too. One stranger called "Sidder" pick on me that I released my own Remix so I had to explain, that I'm not the only one who did that with an original songs.
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
Quote: >[Murdock wrote:]
>So why there was the reason to release for
>example /VARIOUS/S-Z/Sanden_Peter/BMX_Kidz_Remix_PSID.sid
>tune and many more tunes? Plenty of covers, plenty of
>tunes with borrowed instrumets...but of course you don't
>know about that or simply you are ignoring alot of facts.
>I know atleast 1 composer who did his all tunes with
>using someone's Instruments...Why don't you bug those
>other people, who released other stuff with borrowed
>instruments? But well... I'm tired about explaining it,
>simply back off from me. I don't like you and your
>attitude and behaviour.
I didn't borrow instruments, I took the whole BMX Kidz tune, and just changed the digis. I did this 1988 when I was 15, and we released it in a demo. For me it was worth releasing, as I thought it was a fun idea back then. Our demos was lame and so were we, but we had lots of fun.
Defiers rocks! :) |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
Quote: Yea the fun is most important! I didn't said that you borrowed the Instruments but simply you did the remix of this song like I did with one too. One stranger called "Sidder" pick on me that I released my own Remix so I had to explain, that I'm not the only one who did that with an original songs.
"Hey I'm not guilty, others have stolen instruments/melodies/(insert material/immaterial term of choice here) before!"
And your way of defending yourself by pointing fingers at others is not especially smart and definitely not the way to win arguments. |
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V-12
Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 206 |
Quote: "Hey I'm not guilty, others have stolen instruments/melodies/(insert material/immaterial term of choice here) before!"
And your way of defending yourself by pointing fingers at others is not especially smart and definitely not the way to win arguments.
hey Steppe! you are the one who wants to defend everyone but me, because of personal feelings to me? I don't need to defend myself, when I confessed everything very long time ago. But simply I must do that, because some people don't understand some things. I had no reasons to keep in secret, that few times I used someone's instruments to create my own songs. If I would never confess that, there would be no discussions about it, nobody would know the truth. More of the composers never did that like me. Please take a look at the 2nd side of this problem. And please Steppe stop annoying me only because I'm "Murdock", okay? Thanx! |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
Don't get me wrong, it's not necessarily a bad thing to use others instruments or to do remixes and I don't condemn that at all. I stole Thomas Deterts drums for my own old Soundmonitor tunes, by the way. ;-)
I just pointed out that your way of argueing is, erm, argueable... |
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Quote: >[Nata wrote:]
>Btw, it would be really interesting to HEAR a 6582.
I'm not gonna make a SID out of the suggested values, but if you mail me a SID you want me to try on the different SIDchips I have, I can do that.
Note though that they are placed in my HardSID on the PC, and not on a real C-64.
Hi!
You got a mail. :-)
I Think, HardSID is no problem. |
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Btw.
@jeff
I miss your "Celestielle Remix" tune. It would be interesting to hear how it sounds on your SID... :) |
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Laxity
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 459 |
Quote: "Hey I'm not guilty, others have stolen instruments/melodies/(insert material/immaterial term of choice here) before!"
And your way of defending yourself by pointing fingers at others is not especially smart and definitely not the way to win arguments.
George W. Bush does.. or what? |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
Well, he can get away with everything. But it definitely doesn't increase his popularity, right? ;-) |
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5017 |
Im tired off all this politic shit about Bush, USA, and etc. Could you be please atleast ontopic here ? |
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Laxity
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 459 |
Yes sir, Oswald sir. Sorry! |
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Funny, this thread remains interesting... |
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Laxity
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 459 |
Yeah.. Well.. I actually agree with Oswald, better leave stupid politics outside this forum and stay on target best we (read: I) can ;).. So, even though I was a bit snotty there, you're right.. sir :) Oh, sorry - I couldn't help myself..! |
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Soren
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 547 |
@Nata: I will try to record it some day... or get Grue/BF to do it, as he's got a perfect setup for that.
:-)
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Ok, thanks in advance! :) |
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ready.
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 441 |
just for completeness I thought it'd be interesting to hear how a 6581 ceramic sounds, some real recordings:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/9wrh1zcrmfhl88s/AAAJLunSdRUwIKXZw3B9.. |
