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Forums > CSDb Discussions > Why releasing small stuff in a whole D64 image?
2017-03-27 21:31
Hermit

Registered: May 2008
Posts: 208
Why releasing small stuff in a whole D64 image?

I'm curious why many of very small (even several kilobytes) of releases are made on .d64 image?
I'm a minimalist (usually with limited internet connection) and if I see a music or one-file demo etc. on ~170kbyte D64 I sometimes don't download it, just because I don't like the 5..10x waste of space and bandwidth in general. (And maybe the pollution it generates in big amounts, a problem nowadays I think, yet not the biggest source of pollution is IT.)

Sorry if my thinking is weird or uncommon (really hope it isn't), but I'm still curious why many people release things on .d64 instead of .prg (or .sid or .tap) if they could fit.
Is it easier to save or load D64 format on their systems or cartridges?
In any way, if you like to release small stuff in .d64, I'd thank you if you at least compress (zip) it or release a .prg beside the .d64, as seen many times, and so they won't distract people like me, and your release will be downloaded and evaluated a bit more times...
 
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2017-03-28 05:02
lft

Registered: Jul 2007
Posts: 369
Also keep in mind that newer modems support compression. Highly regular data, such as a large stretch of null-bytes, will actually be compressed by a factor of 1:4 during transfer, if you are using a V.42bis modem to connect to your ISP. That is the reason they are marketed as e.g. 38400 bps instead of the actual 9600.

It's not as good as using compressed files as suggested, but at least the overhead is on the order of 40 kB rather than 171 kB. In fact, this technology will allow you to transfer an almost-blank .d64 image in less than a minute.

Mind, at these increased transfer rates, the interrupt latency of your machine might become a bottleneck. For instance, if you are using the Amiga's built-in serial port, rates above 9600 are unreliable because the software layer needs to respond in time to grab each incoming byte from the hardware before the next one arrives.
2017-03-28 05:39
bugjam

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 2467
There used to be also a problem with .prgs as download, IIRC - in certain instances the endbytes are cut off because they are misinterpreted by the OS, or something. Ninja told me that many years ago, not sure if that problem is still relevant.
2017-03-28 07:10
Stryyker

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 465
Possibly the increased use of 1541 Ultimate may influence it too.
2017-03-28 07:15
iAN CooG

Registered: May 2002
Posts: 3128
Quote: There used to be also a problem with .prgs as download, IIRC - in certain instances the endbytes are cut off because they are misinterpreted by the OS, or something. Ninja told me that many years ago, not sure if that problem is still relevant.

More likely, the tool that extracted the prg from the t64 or d64, is bugged and doesn't extract the correct amount number of bytes. Loading a correctly sized prg directly or from a d64 doesn't change anything.
2017-03-28 07:21
Dano

Registered: Jul 2004
Posts: 226
As for myself i tend to have problems with WinVice breaking the drag'n'drop of files onto it (going back to default settings fixes it though). I'm just a lazy Windows guy, and i guess there's no option to load a prg from the menu?

So d64 always works flawlessly and that makes the point for me. So yes, i am all in for having everything as d64.

Rambling over some 170kb plus or minus just doesn't cut it for me.

In the end there will always be two sides. And people who use vice from the shell won't care about formats anyway i guess.. ^^
2017-03-28 07:23
tlr

Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1701
Quote: Mainly to preserve the filename I guess, and perhaps because you want to include some kind of dir-art.

I used to gzip d64s because then you didn't have to unpack them before attaching in Vice.


+1

I also prefer gzipped .d64's although not all tools handle them transparently. Coming to think of it, there should be one that extracts .d64.gz with a single file in them. Shouldn't be too hard to write.

The only other "popular" container that supports original filenames is T64 and that is really badly standardized. Even fewer tools handle that transparently.

I guess that if PETSCII was a part of unicode (perhaps it is?) you could have files with the original name directly in the filesystem, but I wouldn't want to rely on that.
2017-03-28 08:24
Compyx

Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 631
PC64 files (ie *.p00, *.s00, etc) support PETSCII filenames. These are basically .prg files with a 26-byte header prepended to them, so they're small but keep the original filename intact.

Many emulators support this file type. (At least the prg, seq and usr files, not sure about relative files)
2017-03-28 08:33
Graham
Account closed

Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990
It's mostly about preserving the filename and maybe having some directory PETSCII graphics.
2017-03-28 10:23
iAN CooG

Registered: May 2002
Posts: 3128
dano: "i guess there's no option to load a prg from the menu?"
file/autostart accepts all supported filetypes including prgs of course
2017-03-28 11:45
Compyx

Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 631
Quoting tlr
+1

I also prefer gzipped .d64's although not all tools handle them transparently. Coming to think of it, there should be one that extracts .d64.gz with a single file in them. Shouldn't be too hard to write.


c1541 image.d64.gz -read '*'


That should read the first file in the d64 and write it to the host filesystem using the PETSCII filename converted to the host encoding as the filename.
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