Log inRegister an accountBrowse CSDbHelp & documentationFacts & StatisticsThe forumsAvailable RSS-feeds on CSDbSupport CSDb Commodore 64 Scene Database
You are not logged in - nap
CSDb User Forums


Forums > C64 Coding > Holy Grails
2018-03-18 10:10
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2804
Holy Grails

I've been wondering about them, with some having been finally discovered, others not yet, and some probably going to remain in the realm of the impossible forever.

I'm speaking of things like:
- 320x200x16 graphics without restrictions
- Crash-free all-direction hardware scrolling
- Digi replay of 8-bit samples at one register write per sample and without requiring cycle accuracy

on standard vanilla hardware, of course.

Some examples of discovered grails are:
- Cube rotating at 50 fps about 3 axes
- The 9th sprite (with some restrictions)
- On-the-fly standard GCR block read+decode+checksumming

As for definition, they all satisfy some measure of being perfect or optimal or being possible after all, with no further improvements required, possible or necessary. But i'm not so sure if that definition holds water with regard to some of the examples i listed. :D

The question is, what other Holy Grails are there, already discovered or still elusive?
What are your pet grails you've been chasing after for decades or have found eventually? :)
 
... 109 posts hidden. Click here to view all posts....
 
2018-03-27 09:42
CreaMD

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3034
True Hires/MultiColor bitmap split (without visible gaps to cover bugs) / text wrap around images. Counts as a holy grail to me. See the animated gif screenshot for what I mean.

Dawn #1
2018-03-27 10:37
Oswald

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5007
graffity did mcol and gfxmode split way earlier than this.
2018-03-27 11:58
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2804
Maybe Holy Grails and world-firsts aren't quite the same thing. :)
2018-03-27 12:02
Oswald

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5007
btw VIC does some weird stuff when changing from mc to hires, or when making gaps with d016, anyone ever used those? holy grail :)
2018-03-27 12:35
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2804
I think Crossbow used something like that to have more than 320 pixels worth of char/bitmap graphics per rasterline.
2018-03-27 13:23
JackAsser

Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 1987
Quote: btw VIC does some weird stuff when changing from mc to hires, or when making gaps with d016, anyone ever used those? holy grail :)

Some of the mode bits are delays 2 or 4 pixels due to implementation details in the very undocumented pixel pipeline. I did a fair share of assumtions when coding my emu.
2018-03-27 14:34
Walt

Registered: May 2004
Posts: 47
d016 gaps used greatly in the endpart of Mentallic - initially mistaken for 9 sprites :)
2018-03-27 16:22
CreaMD

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3034
Quote: graffity did mcol and gfxmode split way earlier than this.

Of course. There were many multi/hires splits in past, but I have never seen one that didn't have some kind of overlay over the split to cover bugs. Also I don't remember I have ever seen more than one vertical split per charline. Could you provide link and part where I can check, or screenshot? Unless I'm proven wrong I believe, that Wotnau's splits are something that has never been done before. And if nothing else, Dawn engine is a holy grail of illustrated disk mag engines ;-))))
2018-03-27 16:30
Oswald

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5007
d016 hires / multi split without bugs is nothing impossible. maybe 1 char needed to left empty if switch is delayed by a few pixels as Jacky explains. The main complexity is on the fly speedcode generator for the split in Wotnau's case.
2018-03-27 17:01
Copyfault

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 466
Quoting Oswald
that's by Bubis, and in 4x4 :)
Could someone tell me in which demo/release this 4x4-tunnel can be found? Thx!
Previous - 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 - Next
RefreshSubscribe to this thread:

You need to be logged in to post in the forum.

Search the forum:
Search   for   in  
All times are CET.
Search CSDb
Advanced
Users Online
t0m3000/ibex-crew
hedning/G★P
iAN CooG/HVSC
Matt
St0rmfr0nt/Quantum
Mason/Unicess
Brittle/Dentifrice^(?)
eryngi
MAT64
Guests online: 353
Top Demos
1 Next Level  (9.8)
2 Mojo  (9.7)
3 Coma Light 13  (9.7)
4 Edge of Disgrace  (9.6)
5 No Bounds  (9.6)
6 Comaland 100%  (9.6)
7 Uncensored  (9.6)
8 The Ghost  (9.6)
9 Wonderland XIV  (9.6)
10 Bromance  (9.6)
Top onefile Demos
1 Party Elk 2  (9.7)
2 Cubic Dream  (9.6)
3 Copper Booze  (9.5)
4 Rainbow Connection  (9.5)
5 TRSAC, Gabber & Pebe..  (9.5)
6 Onscreen 5k  (9.5)
7 Dawnfall V1.1  (9.5)
8 Quadrants  (9.5)
9 Daah, Those Acid Pil..  (9.5)
10 Birth of a Flower  (9.5)
Top Groups
1 Booze Design  (9.3)
2 Nostalgia  (9.3)
3 Oxyron  (9.3)
4 Censor Design  (9.3)
5 Crest  (9.3)
Top NTSC-Fixers
1 Pudwerx  (10)
2 Booze  (9.7)
3 Stormbringer  (9.7)
4 Fungus  (9.6)
5 Grim Reaper  (9.3)

Home - Disclaimer
Copyright © No Name 2001-2024
Page generated in: 0.05 sec.