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Forums > CSDb Entries > Release id #159269 : Fugue on a theme by D. M. Hanlon
2017-10-05 06:10
lft

Registered: Jul 2007
Posts: 369
Release id #159269 : Fugue on a theme by D. M. Hanlon

Quoting Scarzix

Really nice. Lovely composition. but... what about:

- tune that covers someone else's composition, cannot be a procedural conversion of any kind - put some effort into process (quote from Jammer)


Yeah, clearly this is lacking in effort. =)

Of course this is up to the organisers, but I think there is historical precedent. Let's dig a little deeper, just for the fun of it. =)

At least among music scholars, a piece of music that quotes, references, or otherwise uses an existing melody as basis for variation, is generally considered a composition in its own right. Whereas if, to a large extent, the piece is recognisable as a new version of an old composition, it is termed a rearrangement or transcription (and we would call it a cover).

So, in publications of Max Reger's Variations and Fugue on a theme by Bach, Reger is listed as the composer. In publications of Bach's Fugue on a Theme by Corelli, Bach is listed as the composer.

Even Gounod's famous Ave Maria, where he added a melody to one of Bach's preludes, is considered a composition by Gounod, even though it is sometimes listed as a Bach-Gounod co-op (released 103 years after the death of one of the members of this dynamic duo).

But in contrast, Myra Hess' famous piano version of Jesu Bleibet..., even though a lot of creativity went into it, is a transcription, and the composer is given as Bach. Likewise, here Mozart merely rearranged Händel (zoom in on the cover).
2017-10-05 06:18
lft

Registered: Jul 2007
Posts: 369
I forgot to draw any conclusions. The rule seems to be that if the large-scale structure is the same, but the details differ, then it is a cover. But if the details are the same, but they have been organised into a new large-scale structure, then it is regarded as a new composition.
2017-10-05 06:45
CreaMD

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3034
Brain food.
2017-10-05 07:59
spider-j

Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 443
Covers aren't forbidden in this compo anyway, or are they?
2017-10-05 08:25
lft

Registered: Jul 2007
Posts: 369
Oh! You are right! The rule doesn't forbid covers. Covers are ok, but automated conversions are out.
2017-10-05 08:26
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2804
They are as of Jammer's no-covers addendum to the rules.

But i second lft here and cannot add much more to his list of references. :)
Except these Wikipedia quotes emphasizing that fugues can very well be compositions in their own right:

"It was in the Baroque period that the writing of fugues became central to composition, in part as a demonstration of compositional expertise."
"Das Schreiben einer Fuge galt zudem als Nachweis besonderer kompositorischer Fähigkeiten."
2017-10-05 08:58
lft

Registered: Jul 2007
Posts: 369
Quoting Krill
They are as of Jammer's no-covers addendum to the rules.


The addendum is what's quoted in the top-post here, right? It can be read as: "Regarding tunes that cover someone else's composition, those tunes aren't allowed to be procedural conversions".

The rule was motivated by Poop Nukem 3D. Here, Jammer wrote:

Quoting Jammer
So it's not really handmade cover, just plain convert from MIDI files or sth? I'm afraid that case might be somewhat problematic :P


Again implying that a handmade cover is ok, whereas the case of a plain convert is "problematic".

Jammer, did you want to rule out all covers or just the bad rips?
2017-10-05 09:45
chatGPZ

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11088
whats the problem with "automatic conversions" anyway? they usually sound like ass :)
2017-10-05 10:38
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2804
lft: Wherever the line is drawn here, i'm sure everybody agrees that your fugue is qualified more than enough to be regarded as a composition in its own right. :)
2017-10-05 10:39
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2804
Quote: whats the problem with "automatic conversions" anyway? they usually sound like ass :)

Valid point. Probably ranks so low in the end that it's not worth bothering with refining the rules for that.
2017-10-05 11:30
Oswald

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5007
love that Gounod piece.
 
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