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Forums > CSDb Discussions > Ultimate II+ .crt+reu
2020-11-17 14:37
ciccior2003
Account closed

Registered: Jun 2012
Posts: 12
Ultimate II+ .crt+reu

i have tested a demo made to work in .crt + reu. It works in vice but with 1541 ultimate II+ to work i have to start demo,crt than disable reu from menu. Return to demo, enable the reu and reset the system without reload the demo.crt.
I have made the same with RR.crt and Reu doesn’t work until i don’t disable and enable the Reu.
There is a settings to start .crt and use Reu without this method?
2020-11-17 22:06
Walt

Registered: May 2004
Posts: 47
This might be off-topic, but when developing Expand ( Expand ) I had similar issues. Check the note file on the disk for more details.

It is a REU trackmo and if I did not wait some frames (3-5) between utilizing REU and drive access it would randomly hang.

As you experienced, it worked fine in VICE but would fail on 1541 Ultimate II+.

I had some mailing with Gideon but never received an answer about the underlying issue, so this is purely speculation:

"I suspect the memory on the 1541 Ultimate is used for both the REU and drive emulation, carts etc. and as the REU is pretty demanding cycle-wise it can fail when some functions are used at the same time."

Also the timing on the REU is not 100% correct but in most cases it does not matter. See REUTools for further info/test ( REUTools 1.0 )

Even with stuff like this I still find the 1541 Ultimate II+ an amazing product. And knowing the quirks is first step to work around them :)
2020-11-17 22:08
chatGPZ

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11088
Working around emulator bugs should be punished by law though
2020-11-17 22:39
hedning

Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 4552
+1. Real hw should be the only benchmark and goal. Then emulators should follow what's working (and not) on real hw.
2020-11-17 23:19
Frantic

Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 1626
Utilitarists may argue that if some piece of code works on both real hardware and emulators there would be more happiness in the world, all other things being equal, but I'm happy to see that Groepaz and Hednings looks as the issue as A MATTER OF PRINCIPLE!!!! ;D
2020-11-17 23:22
chatGPZ

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11088
The problem with this is that when software is made to work on broken emulators, noone will feel the need to improve those emulators.

The contrary should be true - break emulators loud and proudly. See what crossbow did with VICE.
2020-11-17 23:25
Frantic

Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 1626
I agree
2020-11-18 00:01
Raistlin

Registered: Mar 2007
Posts: 548
The “product” (the demo) should be fine to work around the poor emulation if it can... as a courtesy, the developer of the product could let the creators of the emulator know about the fault and perhaps provide a test case to them?

If we release something that doesn’t work quite right in VICE, that is easy to fix, it will only lead to downvotes on CSDB due to people not using real hardware ...
2020-11-18 00:28
chatGPZ

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11088
If you care about votes then you have bigger problems than your product working in an emulator.
2020-11-18 00:29
ciccior2003
Account closed

Registered: Jun 2012
Posts: 12
I agree with all purists of real hw, but a real Reu is impossible to find and i think that in c64 scene the 95% of people use Vice and less than 5% use Ultimate or other cartridge emulators.
The only way to see decend interlaced effects is to use a real c64. So i think 1541 ii+ and RETROTINK 2X is the best solution price/quality.
2020-11-18 00:34
chatGPZ

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11088
Quote:
in c64 scene the 95% of people use Vice

in the actual c64 scene 100% use real hardware.
 
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