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Death Demon
Account closed
Registered: Feb 2005
Posts: 68 |
Careful with your email addresses
I've been poking around the nostalgia sites recently popping my email address up hoping to get in touch with old friends from the scene. Instead, old jealousy has found a way of poking it's ugly head out. I can't believe that jealousy like this still exists after, what, 20 years now?
Quote:
From: lkjlkjljk pablo [lkjlkjljkpablo_797@hotmail.com]
raster boy lives again.... total lack of imagination raster boiiiiiiiiii
Only one person who ever refered to me as that. In fact, he has a web page up right now that refers to me as that. Man, can't believe some people can't let go. Hmm, actually it looks like he's updated it in the last few days. Luckily, Google still has it around. If you're interested, do a google search for +"wanderer" +"the survivors" +"raster boy"
Wanderer Commodore 64 c64 NTSC intro demo fbr pe the survivors ...
... I ripped anything after my beginning months in The Survivors. ... a member of FBR who
I call raster boy (DxxxxDxxxx ... did you change your name from Satan to Wanderer? ...
www.ontarioghosttowns.com/c64/c64.html - 84k - Cached - Similar pages
In any event, as I stated, please be careful. It appears that some people out there are still bent out of shape over scene related issues.
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
How did you know I don't play games? :) It's 100% true though.
I wasn't aware I focused on games 'so much'. However the games were the main selling point of the 64. You didn't buy one to make demos, you bought one for the games. They've dried up now and the world has moved on. |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: When "old-and-retired-since-ages"-sceners find a site devoted to c-64 releases, or find out about the still existing (although small) scene of today, they seem to have an urge to go on & on about how dead the scene is or how useless it is for people to continue to make demos or jewel-crack old games.
But at the same time they praise the fact that the c-64 is still alive & remembered...I don't get it.
Either join the few of us or go away!
Don't come here spreading bad vibes...make up your mind instead.
It's all about the audience. I could have continued to make demos but without the audience to see them, it was pointless. The scene *is* dead and there is no point in re-cracking games. The groups who originally cracked them had the glory, the programmers made a profit, the intros were packed on, and the import was released.
I could very well recrack games or rerelease them, but why? The fame and glory is over, the games have already been played, and life has moved on.
You are the next generation of programmers on the c64. I see groups popping up that I've never heard of before... but I think it's truly pointless. Most of the audience has left the building.
I like that I'm able to go back and watch them on the emulator but you're dealing with such a small audience, it is to me pointless.
I don't think it's a bad vibe, it's a personal thought :) My word is not the gospel, it's just one voice saying, "I think it's not worth the effort."
I'll continue to enjoy watching new demos but I feel the audience is too small to justify the time it takes to code a demo. |
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
Quote: It's all about the audience. I could have continued to make demos but without the audience to see them, it was pointless. The scene *is* dead and there is no point in re-cracking games. The groups who originally cracked them had the glory, the programmers made a profit, the intros were packed on, and the import was released.
I could very well recrack games or rerelease them, but why? The fame and glory is over, the games have already been played, and life has moved on.
You are the next generation of programmers on the c64. I see groups popping up that I've never heard of before... but I think it's truly pointless. Most of the audience has left the building.
I like that I'm able to go back and watch them on the emulator but you're dealing with such a small audience, it is to me pointless.
I don't think it's a bad vibe, it's a personal thought :) My word is not the gospel, it's just one voice saying, "I think it's not worth the effort."
I'll continue to enjoy watching new demos but I feel the audience is too small to justify the time it takes to code a demo.
The scene is *not* dead, had it been dead nothing would've been released. What you're talking about is the cracking & import-scene which has basically been dead since the early 90's when the last major game houses "left the building".
But to me & many others the c-64 was not all about cracking games, it was a way to express yourself by creating art.
I praise everyone who's still creating wonderful pieces of art on the c-64, may it be demos, music, gfx or even games.
What I don't praise though is people slagging down on others creativity just because they prefer to release their stuff to a "dead scene with no audience". |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
You are sadly mistaken if you think I've been slagging anyone's creativity. Read my responses and you'll find the opposite is true.
I'll retract the statement that the "64 scene is dead" because demos are still being released. This doesn't change my opinion that I think there are too few people out there to justify the effort of creating a demo though.
If you want to do it, do it. Break the barriers of the 64. In my opinion though, not enough people will see it and it's pointless to me. There will always be those who want to do it for creativity purposes but I wrote demos for people to watch, be inspired by, admire, and just see my work.
You can agree or disagree with me on this, but my opinion stands. Not worth the effort in my opinion.
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Death Demon
Account closed
Registered: Feb 2005
Posts: 68 |
>But to me & many others the c-64 was not all about cracking games, it was a way to express yourself by creating art.
Actually, you shouldn't be surprised to know that it was the same for most of the top programmers back in the hay-day of C64 releases as well. Changeling and I had worked on many different routines and effects. Most were just screwing around to see what manipulating this register might do, or how applying some buffer for rendering might be utilized for overlays, or God only knows what else. But if the routines didn't add to the aesthetic presentation, the routine just sat as source code on a disc somewhere. Having seen The Last Dragon's work and talking to him, I think it was probable the same for him.
The programming was a means to an end. The end was the art. If you could realize a vision of something that looked nice and worked the way you planned (and was small enough to be tacked onto a release), that was the height of programming achievement.
In the end, I (as well as others) outgrew the programming capabilities of the C64 and was forced to move on to continue my studies with more powerful hardware. I had done a vertex transform engine and rasterizer for the C64 but couldn't really do anything useful with it due to performance issues with the machine (and possibly the efficiency of my engine). But it served me well in terms of research for what I eventually wound up doing. But that was the point. To create art. It's really cool to see people out there who actually appreciated what we did too.
And I think it's cool to see people still using the platform as a canvas to express themselves. It's not so much the audience being able to appreciate what you've done (although that is a big plus, IMHO), but more about the satisfaction you get at tackling such a feat. And doing it with hardware as simplistic and underpowered as the C64 adds to the accomplishment. |
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yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 333 |
The next big (although not c64-only) party will start easter, ca. 1000 sceners will show up.
Please dont say the scene is dead, its the NTSC-Scene which is dead and buried (from what i heard)
PS: A Country which reelects Bush deserves a dead C64 Scene.
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
I'm proudly Canadian and if I had been able to vote, it would not have been Bush :)
I respect those who still make demos from North America but I agree the NTSC scene is six feet under. |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2924 |
The NTSC side of the demo scene has always been quite smaller than our counterparts on PAL - even at the peak in 1990/1991/1992.
The NTSC demo scene isn't dead, in fact, five groups are working on productions right now. Any other sort of comment is silliness from uninformed people.
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OEP
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 60 |
I agree - most of the time the best part of a release was the groups intro. They did some amazing things in a very small amount of code. I wish I had the talent to do it.
In fact, I'm now on a mission to collect as many demos as I can for my c64 emulator.
OEP
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yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 333 |
My Group was initially founded to compete in the driven-ntsc-4k-compo, and I loved it!
Maybe the driven team can organize another such event, to prove that ntsc is not dead..
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