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JackAsser
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 1989 |
Impossaball for C64
Was Impossaball ever converted to C64?
CPC: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPcHyG4S-q4
Speccy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ey5VbkSBSjA
If not, then someone should do it.... (not me)
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Soren
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 547 |
WVL can do it soon.... right after finishing Pinball Dreams ofcourse ;-)
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Radiant
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 639 |
It can't be done since it features advanced 3D effects which are impossible to implement on the limited C64 hardware. CPC and Spectrum both have 4 MHz CPUs whereas the C64 only has 1 MHz. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
they also have much better coders on speccy ! |
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Mixer
Registered: Apr 2008
Posts: 422 |
Quote: It can't be done since it features advanced 3D effects which are impossible to implement on the limited C64 hardware. CPC and Spectrum both have 4 MHz CPUs whereas the C64 only has 1 MHz.
Noooooooo!
Absolutely fakeable. |
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Frantic
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 1627 |
Quote: Noooooooo!
Absolutely fakeable.
?IRONY DETECTION FAILURE
READY.
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5017 |
Quote: It can't be done since it features advanced 3D effects which are impossible to implement on the limited C64 hardware. CPC and Spectrum both have 4 MHz CPUs whereas the C64 only has 1 MHz.
a few parallax arranged SF sprites wont make it to 'advanced 3d effects' in my book. apart from that I'd agree it's probably not possible to make it in a playable speed, counted 18 softsprites on a screen... |
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Perplex
Registered: Feb 2009
Posts: 254 |
If the YouTube videos are anything to go by, it doesn't play at 50 fps on the Amstrad or Spectrum either.
50 fps for the player sprite and 25 fps for the rest should be more than doable, and would be pretty playable, I think.
And no, this is not me volunteering!
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5017 |
cpc is at <~12 fps already, and c64 has less raw cpu power, good luck playing with that :) |
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1055 |
It's running at 12 fps since the CPC and Speccy are limited to rendering both the background and objects in bitmap mode. On the C64 the checkerboard is very cheap, ~1500 cycles gives you 7 x-expanded sprites multiplexed, with d021 for color. One sprite is free for the ball, and rendering ~15 objects is challenging but not impossible. |
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FATFrost
Account closed
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 211 |
Just tell Crossbow he can't do it.... then wait a little while... |
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Skate
Registered: Jul 2003
Posts: 490 |
I wanted to write this message to be a part of Crossbow's new product if he accepts the challenge. I want to be famous!!! ;)
remember this?
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5017 |
Quote: It's running at 12 fps since the CPC and Speccy are limited to rendering both the background and objects in bitmap mode. On the C64 the checkerboard is very cheap, ~1500 cycles gives you 7 x-expanded sprites multiplexed, with d021 for color. One sprite is free for the ball, and rendering ~15 objects is challenging but not impossible.
I dont see why the checkerboard would be cheap? You can animate it at best, raster tricks wont do hence you have to plot bobs in there. Then each object is made of 2 colors B/W in hires, so you need 2 HW sprites to make up for 1 Software, since d021 color wont come trough without ANDing the background manually. also good luck masking the software sprites in with the HW ones, best bet is to only use HW sprites as top prio objects, but then not many top priority bobs are there.
unless the cpc&speccy version is not optimized to the max, the c64 cant match that speed. if the z80 code is somewhat sloppy, then there's a chance. Prerolled sprite & mask data and unrolled bob plotters might do the trick then. Anyhow remember the reflex demo & arcanum with 3d bobs its slow as fuck with some 32 soft sprites where this game displays a checkerboard aswell, and bigger sprites. |
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1055 |
Quoting OswaldI dont see why the checkerboard would be cheap? You can animate it at best, raster tricks wont do hence you have to plot bobs in there.
Do the checkerboard as a sprite underlay, plot bobs on top in char mode.
Quote:Then each object is made of 2 colors B/W in hires
I'd use multicolor on the C64 instead.
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Flavioweb
Registered: Nov 2011
Posts: 447 |
Quote: Quoting OswaldI dont see why the checkerboard would be cheap? You can animate it at best, raster tricks wont do hence you have to plot bobs in there.
Do the checkerboard as a sprite underlay, plot bobs on top in char mode.
Quote:Then each object is made of 2 colors B/W in hires
I'd use multicolor on the C64 instead.
How you think to manage the parallax effect between bobs?
You can put they over chessboards sprites but then? There are free cycles to draw all in real time? |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
looks very doable to me. i'd probably do the chessboard in charset though, and then the objects using sprites - seems easier to me. |
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5017 |
and how do you mask in bobs 'between' sprites and chessboard? the c64 hw just cant help enough. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
that would be pretty much the only thing you need to do in realtime then.... a bit of masking. again, very doable. |
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5017 |
a bit of masking, so need to draw software bobs? or to calculate the mask needed to plot bobs under sprites? no need to erase bobs from the charset chessboard right? just change d018? pfffft :) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
you should think outside your 4x4 math box a bit =P there are infact some games doing it (most prominent example is zakmckrakken i guess). |
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JackAsser
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 1989 |
Quote: you should think outside your 4x4 math box a bit =P there are infact some games doing it (most prominent example is zakmckrakken i guess).
Pinball Dreams, Spindizzy, all those isometric speccy conversions etc.
It's is almost sufficient to mask in the x-direction only to have a descent looking game in this case. And doing that unrolled or even have each image pre masked is quite viable.
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5017 |
all the iso speccy conversions are fucking slow, which clearly show the 6510 is underpowered here. as I said there's only chance if the original game was sloppily coded, then some super duper 6510 optimizing can gain someth back there. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
the reason for why the speccy conversions are slow is often that they are 1:1 translations of the z80 code. |
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5017 |
Quote: the reason for why the speccy conversions are slow is often that they are 1:1 translations of the z80 code.
true, but I've seen enough 4x4 speccy effects from my 4x4 math box to know the z80 at that clock rate can do much more. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
if you dont have any hardware support for anything, correct. |
