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2005-04-06 05:32

Slartibartfast
Account closed

Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230

Release id #17672 : Subsonic+3+NTSC+Fix

"Slarti downloaded my version within 30 seconds of my uploading it, then gave me a kind '1' vote. People, please vote for the QUALITY of the work, not your own INSECURITIES and personal feelings. Time to let go and move in with your life Slarti."

This is what Wanderer has put into his release info, after changing it several times. He also sent me a PM:

"Message sent by: Wanderer on 2005-04-06 07:18:17.138639+02
thanks for the 1 vote fuckface"

This is *not* what CSDb is for.

I have *nothing* to do with that downvote. I was online when you posted the release, that is all. My voting is set to public, my votes are seen publicly.

Whoever did downvote you, they did it anonymously.

I'm not your problem Mike, neither is Onslaught, or the scene.

So just stop it with this behaviour, and think before you use the CSDb in this way.

2005-04-06 06:35

Wanderer
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478

Wow. You were the only person online at the same time as me. Just two people and within 30 seconds of my uploading it, it was download AND a 1 vote cast. Must have been that Secret Man you spoke about.

In any event, I'm not interested in arguing the issue with you in a 40 reply long diatribe. If you have an issue with me, I have an email address that is easily available.

This is the only response you will receive. I'm tired of these Onslaught idiots downvoting and leaving messages about my releases. You don't see me doing it to you.

The scene is NOT my problem and I don't think I ever said it was. Please quote me as saying I did.

You ARE a problem because you brought to light one of my releases and attacked me for it, without any just cause. You also downvoted because you said and I quote "I made you angry". Good reason.

Another member of the SAME group also voted a '1' which was ridiculous AND left negative remarks that were not called for.

Take off the blinders, this is an Onslaught issue for sure.

The two of you really need to leave my releases alone, and stop making them a public affair. I don't care what crap you put out, so why does it effect your life what I put out?

2005-04-06 07:03

Fungus

Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 619

Your just a complete moron, and it's fun to get you going. If the , and I quote you here "the scene is dead", why the hell do you care? It is all rather funny. Go ahead and re-crack all you want, no one cares about you. We all just laugh at you and everytime you post something even MORE moronic the laughter gets louder and louder. MWHAHAHA

I salute you, king of the obscure and forgotten.

2005-04-06 14:19

Wanderer
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478

I go about my business, improving games the same way you do. The only difference is, you choose to downvote and leave negative comments and vote with your fake hidden accounts. When you release something, I remain quiet. Also I wouldn't be too proud of releasing those 1983 games. It doesn't take any effort to crack a simple JSR $FFCF disk-error protection.

Envy, jealousy, an inability to let go of things I said against you... only you know for certain but I think you need to let it go. You're embarassing yourself.

The funniest part was you actually trying to defend yourself ("I don't look that way any more") getting a haircut. That was priceless and the laughter was a whisper.

Now you are STILL whining about that, "the scene is dead" comment. That was almost a month ago. Someone has severe issues. The laughter is a dull volume.

Oh and when you say "your just a complete moron", you are implying possession. Example: "your red car". So yes, I do own a complete moron and his name is Fungus. You are owned indeed, thank you for admitting this. The laughter is deafening at this moment.

No charge for the following spelling lesson :) Just remember it and you will do fine in future writing.

"YOUR calling someone else a moron shows YOU'RE an idiot. YOUR mother should have taught you how to spell and kicked you out of her basement a long time ago. YOU'RE a shame to your group"

==================================
Signature:
"I salute you, king of the obscure and forgotten."
Fungus - who released Space Taxi from 1984

2005-04-06 14:57

Slator

Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 273

Normally I dont care much for people having some silly pseudo problems but somehow I dont like the idea to be involved.

If you have any problems with single persons then please dont acuse all the other too. I am in Onslaught too and if you dislike Slarti then dont fuck with the whole group.
Actually there is a big difference in doing some pseudo releases to get some ppl's bloodpressure higher and honestly cracked and properly trained, documented, fixed games. We dont do the stuff for you but for ourselves. It is pretty nice to see if someone else likes our hobby but I dont care if someone thinks we are a bunch of wankers.

I dont think that you actually suck or something but it is just strange to me that someone that has to have some kind of brain (you did some very nice stuff in the past, which I pretty much enjoyed)and the behaviour you have nowadays.

If you think we all suck then please ignore us and just stay away from this database with having us all as lamers in mind.

You have troubles with slarti ? fine, but why the fucking hell do you mess things up in here? oh, "if I get a negative reaction I will re-enter the release" yeah, cool democratic thinking ;-D

maybe you should ask yourself what most of the ppl in here do wrong what you actually do right...

ps: feel free to downvote me, as I actually dont care about this stuff in here anyway.

best regards

Slator

2005-04-06 17:08

Wanderer
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478

Thanks for your thoughts, let me address them.
1) I have no intention to downvote you for speaking your mind.

2) "If you think we all suck then please ignore us and just stay away from this database with having us all as lamers in mind."

I don't think you all suck. I'm expressing a thought that I think releasing games from the early 80's is sad. It's not my fault some people cannot handle that.

3) "You have troubles with slarti ? fine, but why the fucking hell do you mess things up in here?"

I haven't messed anything up. To this day nobody knows who messed with the entries.

4) "if I get a negative reaction I will re-enter the release" yeah, cool democratic thinking ;-D"

Yes because it isn't being done on the quality of the release. It is being done on a PERSONAL level. When the few people who are voting out of anger, jealousy, hatred, etc. stop doing so, the release will stay. Until then, I don't think I need to hear from some overweight slob telling me I'm recracking - when he's putting out stuff even older than I am. Remember, I am not the one making comments and downvoting. Just to clarify that, I am **NOT** the one putting nagative comments on releases and voting '1'.

5) "maybe you should ask yourself what most of the ppl in here do wrong what you actually do right..."

I think I have addressed this. My complaints with people are left on my own webpage until someone goes looking for my work, and posts comments for others to see. Until then, you won't hear from me on the forum or in the comments area of a release about their releases. I think you should examine the behaviour of your group member(s), and then look at how I'm responding before you point fingers in any direction.

Nobody likes to upload something, only to be attacked for it. If you don't like it, don't download any more of them. But don't take your personal feelings out on the person through their work. That is sad...

And yes, it is very personal when it comes to what is being done to my entries. again, if you don't like them, you are really not obligated to look at them. I don't understand the problem with that concept.

2005-04-06 20:58

Slator

Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 273

Mike, I totally agree with what you say, as long as there are humans we will all have other thoughts and believes.

I just never get the point when ppl act like stubborn kids while it would be pretty easy so sort the stuff out in non-public areas as like you suggested via email. We are not made for living in harmony I believe ;-D

If it looked like I accused you for messing up the database lately, it was not what I wanted to express, I just meant the stuff with re-entering releases and some silly posts, but I am generally willing in accepting or at least listen to other people's opinion, I dont have to agree in all cases though :-D

after decades I even accepted ntsc to be some proper system ;-D

regards

2005-04-07 03:52

Wanderer
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478

>Mike, I totally agree with what you say, as long as there
>are humans we will all have other thoughts and believes.

Hey, I'm human too. Behind the words is a person who eats, breathes, sleeps and shits (now and again). :)

>I just never get the point when ppl act like stubborn kids
>while it would be pretty easy so sort the stuff out in non-
>public areas as like you suggested via email. We are not
>made for living in harmony I believe ;-D

I find it odd that this behaviour still persists 20 years after I left it behind. It all began with an opinion, or statement I guess... that the scene was dead. Okay, I can see where my putting things out might irk a few people but man, it does NOT have to come down to messing with my entries. I have debated messaging all of those involved to see if we could find some sort of resolution.

>If it looked like I accused you for messing up the
>database lately, it was not what I wanted to express, I
>just meant the stuff with re-entering releases

I don't mind if I get a '1' vote or even a '2' but it has to be justified. If it's done out of spite, then I'm going to remove and reinsert the entry. Until the day *hint* comes where Perff allows us to delete comments or turn voting/comments on or off as an option... *hint*

>but I am generally willing in accepting or at least listen
>to other people's opinion, I dont have to agree in all
>cases though :-D

No of course not. I'm one of the easiest going people you will ever meet. I used to be friend to all, and pretty much liked by all. It was competetive, and there were a few morons to deal with back then....

>after decades I even accepted ntsc to be some proper
>system ;-D

And I accepted PAL with all of those games that never worked on our machines... of course I think you had it better with more raster time. :)

I think we're all adults here... and the kind of crap going on, is not what this website should be about.

2005-04-07 21:33

Fungus

Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 619

Ok, if we're all adults then lets act like adults and not like spoiled little kiddies... I can agree with that.

Ok, so I downvoted you out of spite. I can apologize for that and remove my downvoting. I didn't do it out of anger or jelousy, It is just my opinion that you tromp on my work just becuase of the age of a game and not the actual work I did put into doing that release. Sure, it is from 1984, but I put alot of work into making the game memory iffl and fixing all the graphics bugs and cleaning all the crap out from the game.

Also, we do not re-crack as you did with jumpman. I don't take some elses version and improve it, I crack the game from the original.

As slator said, we do this for ourselves, and if others enjoy our work, then that it is a nice feeling that we get when someone enjoys our hard work.

I have alot of and enjoyed many TS and FBR cracks, and I collect everything. I also really do appreciate the work you've put into your demo collection. It is also great you have made all of it available on your website.

On the other hand, if you come back to the scene and just start being a braggart , and then tromping on other people you don't even know about thier coding or cracking skills, what kind of treatment in return do you expect? Us to kiss your holy than thou elite feet? Come on...

I really don't have any war with you, just having a bit of scene fun, I think your taking it a bit more seriously than you admit. Stuff doesn't have to be this way.

I am also generally a preety friendly guy. I have helped and continue to help alot of people with c64, coding and fixing.
Just want to keep our beloved 64 alive and not throw it away just because it's 23 years old *G*.

Now, can we resolve these issues in a friendly manner?

Fungus - Nostalgia/Onslaught

2005-04-08 04:10

Wanderer
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478

First a comment about recracking. As far as the old era games go, cracking was not a hard thing to do.

JSR $FFCF
CMP #$32
JSR $FFCF
CMP #$39

Keep in mind this is all from over 15 years ago, it's kind of hazy but disk error protection was as simple as changing both values to CMP #$00 and copying it to a disk without sector errors. (I remember Flight Simulator all you had to do was change the '23' to a '00' with a sector editor which was the returned disk error code)

As time progressed, protection become more advanced.

So I can see where you have a point about recracking BUT at the same time, I don't think there is too much of a difference between my improving an already cracked game, and finding an original and changing two bytes to bypass the protection and then improving it. It would have taken me 30 seconds to a minute to crack it. (Again, this is only for the disk error schemes, I'm not saying all cracks are easy - before people begin to froth at the mouth and pounce on me)

If I had the original, I'd use it... sure. I'd love the challenge to crack something a little more advanced than disk errors. However as it stands, I don't have access to those originals.

Does this mean that a better version of a game cannot be made because one lacks an original? I certainly don't think so. If it was a game with really difficult protection, then maybe re-releasing something would be bad courtesy, but for a game with a simple disk error routine like Jumpman had, I don't see much of a concern.

As for Subsonic, it had a major flaw in that the last level was not playable and you couldn't finish the game. I fixed that flaw, and one other flaw... much to the praise of a few people.

You have a valid point about recracking. But I think you should also see my point that these days originals are not easy to come by and with the advent of freeze cartridges that let you instantly jump into the code, it's not a lot of skill to crack some of these games. (note I said SOME, I'm not talking about hiding data beyond track 35, or load routines in the 1541 memory, etc.)

So some tolerance should be given to those who release a better version, not having an original (providing there are a lot of versions of it out there, and it was a simple crack). Jumpman wasn't to piss anyone off. It was (a) for the challenge, (b) because I saw other people releasing things from that year and (c) to prove that I could.

Secondly, and finally...
"Now, can we resolve these issues in a friendly manner"

After reading your message, I believe we just did :)

p.s. Thank you, yes I did contribute a hell of a lot to the scene of yesterday in terms of demos and utilities. I paid into it, too bad there wasn't a retirement fund.

2005-04-08 09:22

Fungus

Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 619

Good glad we solved that then. Heh...

If you want an orignal, I can supply. I have over 1000.

Sure jumpman, and space taxi got easy easy error check protection, but hell we need a break sometimes from the hard stuff. ;) Also alot more work goes into this stuff than just cracking it, easy enough to fast crack 10 games a day... but there is no challenge in that. The challenge is to make the absolute best version possible. And it was a challenge to fit 500 blocks of stuff into memory ;)

re-cracking has always been frowned upon by the scene, and probly always will be... I suggest you don't do it.

If you want to check some stuff that was harder to crack, check a few of the upcoming things on the n0s page in the next 2 weeks or so.

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