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yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 332 |
Allowing JPGs for Screenshots
I do like much the "Screenshots" from a Bigscreen (beamer at a Party), but I cant upload such, because jpgs are not allowed, png is too big, and 256-col gif looks ugly.
I think allowing jpgs would be fine, because that would show a little bit of a party atmosphere into csdb..
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WVL
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 886 |
brrrrrr!!! jpg's!!! please don't do this :) |
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Compyx
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 631 |
PNG-images are much better because they support gamma correction, which makes the pictures look good on all sorts of configurations. They also support transparency and different bit-depths, so I'd say: stick with PNG..
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Trash
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 122 |
Quote: PNG-images are much better because they support gamma correction, which makes the pictures look good on all sorts of configurations. They also support transparency and different bit-depths, so I'd say: stick with PNG..
I don't care about gammacorrection and transparency (not implmented in IE BTW) when I want to look at partyphotos, I just care about the photo and loadingtime. |
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Compyx
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 631 |
I don't understand why people insist on using IE, it's the most insecure and non-standard browser to date. :) |
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Trash
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 122 |
Quote: I don't understand why people insist on using IE, it's the most insecure and non-standard browser to date. :)
Well, easy access, less installing and configuring as my server and fw handles the security, no need for Linux or similar in my world.
I don't understand why people flames others for their choice of browsers... |
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 717 |
It's more like: if you don't choose and if you don't care, you'll get IE. And for the topic, no JPG for me. And btw. How can 256 colors not be enough!? even 16 colors are more than you need! |
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WVL
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 886 |
HCL : you always use less than 16 colors? :) I have to look at your demos again to see which ones you don't use then :) |
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Trash
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 122 |
Quote: It's more like: if you don't choose and if you don't care, you'll get IE. And for the topic, no JPG for me. And btw. How can 256 colors not be enough!? even 16 colors are more than you need!
Actually, at home IE is an active choice of mine. The reason for not selecting Mozilla, Opera or Firefox is plainly that in IE I get a subtle feeling of knowing exactly what I'm doing, that and the fact that my internetbank doesn't support other browsers...
16 colors might enough for you now but in the past it certainly wasn't for you, just check Obnoxius out... |
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Cruzer
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1048 |
JPEGs would make it possible to grab screenshots from a real C64, which looks a lot better than a 16 color GIF from an emulator. So that sounds like a good idea. |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
You mean fuzzy, bleached out digicam shots with light reflexes from the flash and everything? ;-)
Please don't... |
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Twoflower
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 434 |
I can't really understand what the discussion is about? Are you guys on dialup or sth? In which way (save for using destructive compression) is a JPEG superior to a image in a PNG? The size? The colors? In the choice of 1) you having to convert your partyphotos to .png and waiting the additional half second for viewing or 2) having the risk of newbies posting crappy jpg-screenshots in this database, I prefer the first choice. No jpegs. |
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Also, isn't PNG a free format, unlike JPEG and GIF? |
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1568 |
Quote: Also, isn't PNG a free format, unlike JPEG and GIF?
Correct.
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://www.deco-design.com/scl |
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Compyx
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 631 |
That's also the reason why Vice saves screenshots in PNG or BMP format, GIF is pattented (probably by Bill) and could cause problems for the Vice team. Not sure about JPEG, though..
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: That's also the reason why Vice saves screenshots in PNG or BMP format, GIF is pattented (probably by Bill) and could cause problems for the Vice team. Not sure about JPEG, though..
Bas, especially for you: http://www.webwereld.nl/nieuws/21332.phtml |
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Compyx
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 631 |
Een koekje van eigen deeg :) |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
jpg is too ugly, specially about compression.
C64 screenshot looks nice with the right colour palette as GIF.
And about home banking: Those banks who only allow MSIE or even use ActiveX (yes, they exsist!), should get closed down :D
I am also for NO JPG, please!
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Derision
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 69 |
GIF is actually copyrighted by Compuserve (now a wholly owned subsidiary of AOL/Time Warner).
I agree that PNG is the format to go with. Even GIF images can look a bit funky when scaled down, so my personal preference is a full-color PNG (which scales nicely and doesn't make a screenshot look like crap).
If you're concerned about putting pictures from parties up, maybe there can be an option for allowing an image in the party entries, much like you can add a screenshot to a demo entry or a picture to a scener entry. In that respect, I suppose JPEG would be acceptable, much as it's acceptable within scener entries. But definitely not for a demo screenshot.
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 717 |
..and to end the discussion:
* Don't change anything regarding screenshots.
* If your bank forces you to use IE, change bank NOW!
btw. how can one think that PNG and GIF look different when scaling!?!? It's just pixels. It all depends on who is scaling. |
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Trash
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 122 |
If you change bank just because their singleminded IE-support I want to ask you if interest and personal service is worthless when setting it in context to their choice of browser-support?
I won't change bank until sweden have adopted a new international currency, only then my terms will be better..
And btw, why not making it possible to upload images of any format but restrict the type of images to certain types of entries, jpg, png and gif for party-reports, gif, png for csdb-entrys etc... |
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WVL
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 886 |
isn't the 'patent' (iirc, it's not valid in the netherlands anyway) going to run out in a couple of months (or didn't it already?)? Then i say Gif or Ping. |
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yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 332 |
OK, I have a mobile-phone-picture with light reflexes, blurring and all.
Converted to png, it takes ca. 80KB, which is above 30K.
The original jpg is 10KB big.
It might still be argued, that this is not a valid Screenshot, but it looks much better..
If the people here insist on a certain mode for screenshots, i might ask:
Only Emulator Screenshots ?
Emulator with PAL-Emulation Screenshots ?
C64 to Framegrabber Screenshots ?
And why not photographing the Monitor or bigscreen ?
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1060 |
The GIF patent has expired, and can be used freely. Unisys sent out a statement saying the format is free to use shortly before the patent expired, as a sign of good will (utterly lame). PNG is still a better format though, and as long as you don't use transparency you won't have problems with IE bugs.
As for jpg photos - it's *screenshots* we want in the databse not party photos. Emulator snapshots, video grabs of real 64s, or photographed screens - it doesn't matter. A clean screenshot is easily less than 30k when saved as a PNG.
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yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 332 |
Screenshots from a 1084 are allowed, Screenshots from a beamer not ?
Well, with some luminance-fiddling, I might be able to reproduce the "party picture" with a "real" Screenshot.
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Derision
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 69 |
HCL: I don't know if this applies to every system, but a scaled down 256 or 16 color GIF looks... er... "choppy", I guess, on my computer, whereas a full color PNG scales a bit more smoothly. It's difficult to explain, and I may be the exception rather than the rule (damn Mac), but it's something I noticed.
Back to Topic: I think Magervalp knocked this one on the head... we're looking for CLEAN screenshots, not fuzzy "photograph the screen" pictures. The picture as if it was just dumped digitally off the C64. You don't need more than 16 colors for that, you don't need lossy compression... hell, an uncompressed .BMP could probably display what needs to be displayed in 10k or less. Even if you were to take a proper screenshot, the JPEG compression would hurt it simply by existing. So there really is no need for it.
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1060 |
Quote: Screenshots from a 1084 are allowed, Screenshots from a beamer not ?
Well, with some luminance-fiddling, I might be able to reproduce the "party picture" with a "real" Screenshot.
Of course you can use photos of a projected C64 screen - as long as it's a clean photo, that fits in 30k when PNG compressed.
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 717 |
I agree. A screenshot should have no more than 16 colors. In rare cases where the emulator cannot give a good picture of the demo/pic/etc, use photo (converted to 16 colors!! ;). |
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yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 332 |
/me seems to be in a very small minority :-(
OK, I'll upload valid Screenshots, and put my bigscreen-photo on a seperate webpage..
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1060 |
Quote: I agree. A screenshot should have no more than 16 colors. In rare cases where the emulator cannot give a good picture of the demo/pic/etc, use photo (converted to 16 colors!! ;).
Actually, with PAL colour blends you need more than 16, but you knew that :) |
