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Forums > CSDb Entries > Release id #17586 : Jumpman Junior+2

2005-03-25 23:43

Slartibartfast
Account closed

Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230

Release id #17586 : Jumpman Junior+2

This has been released by Wanderer, apparently as a fake release. This is after he made sarcastic comments like this on the Driven forums (http://drivenonline.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=12):

"Yes the scene needs more previews and one filed games that were history twenty years ago. What's next? Jumpman Junior megatrainer?"

"I don't see any respect for anybody who feels compelled to put out Sammy Lightfoot because they can train it. I know I'll be first in the download lineup when Onslaught releases the fully trained version of Jumpman Junior."

He also has a whole page dedicated to his dislike of the current scene on his self indulgent homepage - http://www.ontarioghosttowns.com/c64/oldies.html

When Wanderer first put this on CSDb, he released it under his own handle. Then apparently deleted the entry along with it's reviews and re-released it under a fake handle.

What's worse, it's a recrack, and it doesn't even work properly. What point was trying to be proved here is beyond me.

The intro is a crippled version of an old intro by the same idiot, possibly from back in the days when he wasn't a complete asswipe.

Funnily enough, after the trolling flame thread on driven, and checking out the one demo I have here on CSDb, he's used the tune from the first part of that demo in his own intro. 20cc tune, and yes I borrowed it myself in the first place of course, but why would anyone make an apparently fake "war" release like this in the first place unless they are a complete fruitcake?

Take a break and take your medication Mike.

... 27 posts hidden. Click here to view all posts....

2005-03-26 22:56

Wanderer
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478

Quote: >So I think the matter is closed... this was never >about 'war' or 'vengeance'. It's a computer for God's >sakes. You losers need to get out more often. Your >reactions proved to me what I needed to know.

Ok, I close the matter too. I still think that you did all this for the reaseons I wrote above. About the losers point: I go out, I have a wife a job and a social life. C64 is only an hobby for me, so remove me from your losers' list because I won't fit :D
About the rest I've nothing more to say. Good releasing ;-)
$FCE2

The only reason I released them was as a joke. If it was personal, there would have been some nasty scroll text. Instead there was nothing except 'here is jumpman junior and two trainers'.

It was to prove that anyone can take an old game, train it, even add a high score saver, and re-release it in the year 2005. But in 1983 when I was still not even old enough to drive a car, I was playing these games.

To think that ANYONE really needs or wants a version just because some release-starved group decides to go back two decades and train, is ridiculous.

I don't know why it's just me who feels this way. The idea of an 'oldies' group is... well, you can read how I feel on my personal page :)

If I wanted to, I could release 20 year old games like I did with Jumpman. But my pride (not lack of) keeps me from pulling an 'Onslaught'

2005-03-27 11:02

Merman

Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 140

Wanderer, you are missing the whole point of what Remember are doing. These are "jewel" releases, in many cases IMPROVING on the original game. Bugs are fixed, docs are added (so you can PLAY the game properly) and trainers are added.

As The Overkiller pointed out, your version of Jumpman Jr isn't as good as Remember's.

There are thousands of games I didn't play back in the 1980's, so if an oldie group comes along with their NEW release complete with docs and bugfixes, I look forward to playing it.

2005-03-27 11:38

Nafcom

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588

Quote: Wanderer, you are missing the whole point of what Remember are doing. These are "jewel" releases, in many cases IMPROVING on the original game. Bugs are fixed, docs are added (so you can PLAY the game properly) and trainers are added.

As The Overkiller pointed out, your version of Jumpman Jr isn't as good as Remember's.

There are thousands of games I didn't play back in the 1980's, so if an oldie group comes along with their NEW release complete with docs and bugfixes, I look forward to playing it.

One example here is Choplifter, always had a nasty thick rasterbar/flick on PAL finally, since November last year, it works perfect on PAL 8-)
And same with Afterburner USA, so many cracks and releases, but none has fixed the tune player routine.
or outrun europa, almost any crack crashes in levels, except the Emulators from group "Emulators" version, but this doesn't work properly on real C64, then the tune gets out of sync after ca. 1 minute.

2005-03-27 16:28

Wanderer
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478

Bugfixes I agree with.

However simply addind a trainer and hi score saver, to me, doesn't justify releasing something 20 years later. It would have been laughed at when I was on the scene.

My version may not have been as good as Remember's, but... let's not forget that there was a time and a place where we saw many versions of the same game from groups.

Example... Zenith, Ikari, Dominators might all have the same game with different number of trainers. One may or may not have had a saver on it.

Because mine had 2 trainers and Remembers had 3, and docs... does not diminish the effort I put into my version. It also does not justify it as being a 'low quality effort'.

What if Remember had 1 trainer and mine had 2, theirs had docs and mine did not, but I had a high score saver...

You see my point... there is no criteria here. You can't compare games based on the # of trainers. It's ridiculous.

If you don't like my version, you don't have to download it. But don't insult me for putting the effort into it.

The scene used to be about choices... picking what version you wanted. Today it seems to be all about who can make the greatest version - and that just isn't right.

(Also I could have ripped the trainers from Remember, but I chose to do the work myself. And going back to what if theirs had one, mine had two trainers... you would call theirs a low quality effort?)

When people start releasing games from 1983 and 1984 that *worked fine* to begin with, throw in documentation that we've had around for 20 years and top on some trainers and re-release it... that to me is desperation.

If it was buggy, I can see the point. You have all the time in the world now to fix it properly. But to re-release something that worked fine, and you just added a trainer... call me old school, but that is pathetic.

It explains why I'm so unpopular lately. But I'm not going to change my opinion anytime soon so we're deadlocked :)

With thousands of game titles available, quality games such as R-Type, Electronic Arts productions and Hawkeye for example... I just can't see someone jumping up and down exclaiming, "Oh boy BC's Quest for Tires with unlimited lives... I gotta go play that" :)

There are no more games to release as new, so I can see why people are going back to the old. It's still pretty laughable though.

2005-03-27 16:56

Mason

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 459

this discussion is a bit funny as in the first way the scene is dead and in other way its wrong to release old games again. If people think the scene is dead, why care about it then?

Also theres some un-released stuff getting found in the GTW project like games that never got released for several reason - a good example is the finished game Solar Jetman. The only reason it didnt got put out where because the game company didnt thought it could sell enough.

2005-03-27 22:56

Wanderer
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478

Quote: this discussion is a bit funny as in the first way the scene is dead and in other way its wrong to release old games again. If people think the scene is dead, why care about it then?

Also theres some un-released stuff getting found in the GTW project like games that never got released for several reason - a good example is the finished game Solar Jetman. The only reason it didnt got put out where because the game company didnt thought it could sell enough.

Actually I take back my entire statement the scene is dead. I was wrong. I can admit that and own up to it.

There are still many years left on the 64 re-releasing games that have been around for over twenty years, long forgotten by most of us and have already been played to death.

And when our children are older, they too can take these game and re-release them... and their children can re-release them.

Just thinking about it, makes me want to shout for joy. The thought that my grandson could someday be working on Jumpman Junior +20 with high score saver and added speech effects, hotkey to jump into documentation.

I really want to be part of this scene... the one I remember, with new fresh releases just can't compare :)

I'll be quite now before I get lynch mobbed.

2005-03-27 22:58

H.O
Account closed

Registered: Oct 2002
Posts: 70

"There are no more games to release as new, so I can see why people are going back to the old. It's still pretty laughable though."

That is your opinion, and you are entitled to have one.

That being said; the scene is a lot different to when you (or I) was active on it. It doesnt really matter if it's better or worse; the major point is that it is different.

The problem here is that you come with your perspective and complain about how things are done now, without trying to understand how things work now. Having been part of the scene back then your opinion carries weight when it comes to issues regarding the scene back then, but you should realize that someone critizing the scene as it looks now, without making an attempt to understand it or being a part of it looks more like an old timer who cant keep up with how things changes and keeps complaining about how everything was better before.

I used to be a part of the scene, and I enjoyed those years. In fact, I enjoyed it so much that I these days like to watch and see what the scene is now, and to discuss how the scene was back then and what is different. But, I would never lower myself to critizing the scene as it is now. That simply because I am not a part of it. I am a spectator, or a visitor, and noone has the right to complain about the current state of the scene without being part of it or at least trying to understand it.

You claim that the scene is dead some times, and some times that it suck. If it's dead, then why bother? And if it sucks, then why not just show those active how things should be done?

Complaining is easy; anyone can do that. Showing a better solution -- going from talking to action -- is a lot harder.

And, seriously, where is the problem with a bunch of persons enjoying different things on the c64? So what if Commodore no longer exists, if no new commercial games has been released in 10 years, etc. The point is that they enjoy what they are doing. That is enough justification for the scene as it looks today, just as it was enough justification back then.

You do remember that the main driving force of the scene back then never was about whether how many users the machine had, or how many new games was released each year, but rather about fun, about doing things, this whole DIY (Do It Yourself) atmosphere that built the scene? Or are you telling me you were only it because the c64 was the biggest games computer at that time?

2005-03-27 23:20

Slator

Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 273

I totally agree with h.o,
thanx for this post, seems like there are still ppl trying to think before they shoot.

2005-03-27 23:49

Wanderer
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478

Quote: "There are no more games to release as new, so I can see why people are going back to the old. It's still pretty laughable though."

That is your opinion, and you are entitled to have one.

That being said; the scene is a lot different to when you (or I) was active on it. It doesnt really matter if it's better or worse; the major point is that it is different.

The problem here is that you come with your perspective and complain about how things are done now, without trying to understand how things work now. Having been part of the scene back then your opinion carries weight when it comes to issues regarding the scene back then, but you should realize that someone critizing the scene as it looks now, without making an attempt to understand it or being a part of it looks more like an old timer who cant keep up with how things changes and keeps complaining about how everything was better before.

I used to be a part of the scene, and I enjoyed those years. In fact, I enjoyed it so much that I these days like to watch and see what the scene is now, and to discuss how the scene was back then and what is different. But, I would never lower myself to critizing the scene as it is now. That simply because I am not a part of it. I am a spectator, or a visitor, and noone has the right to complain about the current state of the scene without being part of it or at least trying to understand it.

You claim that the scene is dead some times, and some times that it suck. If it's dead, then why bother? And if it sucks, then why not just show those active how things should be done?

Complaining is easy; anyone can do that. Showing a better solution -- going from talking to action -- is a lot harder.

And, seriously, where is the problem with a bunch of persons enjoying different things on the c64? So what if Commodore no longer exists, if no new commercial games has been released in 10 years, etc. The point is that they enjoy what they are doing. That is enough justification for the scene as it looks today, just as it was enough justification back then.

You do remember that the main driving force of the scene back then never was about whether how many users the machine had, or how many new games was released each year, but rather about fun, about doing things, this whole DIY (Do It Yourself) atmosphere that built the scene? Or are you telling me you were only it because the c64 was the biggest games computer at that time?

>Complaining is easy; anyone can do that. Showing a better
>solution -- going from talking to action -- is a lot
>harder.

Yes, it's called a PC :)

As for c64 demos... let's just say something may surface from me soon :)

2005-03-28 00:25

Nafcom

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588

I toally agree with you, H.O, however even if fewer games, there are still getting new games released.
have a look at Turrican III, Katakis II which is announced for C64, PC, GBA, Newcomer is a great game, too
Metal Dust for the SCPU, and sure more to come.

Yes, and welll, it became harder for us to keep things running, I mean, if you want something new like new 5.25" DD disks no used ones from Ebay, etc.

I think without the newcomers, the C64 scene would be dead, and then people can complain.
But me for my part will stay in the C64 scnene as long as it's exsisting, at least I plan to.
May oldtimer sceners say what they want to say or not =)

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