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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Side border scrolling
Here's a question that I've had on my mind for almost 20 years now.
How do you think side border scrolling was invented?
Do you think someone had sprites on the screen while a scroller was moving and they noticed a gap?
Perhaps someone was watching a depack routine and noticed that the side borders opened up by one raster line. You know the crunchers that used to increment $d016 as it uncrunched.
Or did someone simply break out the programmers reference guide and figure it out?
This is speculation but I'd like to hear your comments.
Oh and here's another... in the early 80's when there were no cartridges I always wondered how games were cracked. You would reset the computer by grounding the first and third pins on the far left port but you'd also lose data in the process sometimes. How would they have done it??? Granted much of it was simple disk error protection but it would still require you to reboot and load a monitor to view.
p.s. I think the easiest crack of all time had to be Flight Simulator in which, if you viewed the sectors it read "23 READ ERROR". You changed the 23 to a "00" (for OK) and it was cracked.
Mike
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 727 |
I go for the depack effect, or possibly someone wrote a crap program like inc/dec$d016, jmp back. Found something strange and started to investigate. I think most vic-tricks were invented that way. I accidentally found what is nowadays called sprite-crunching somewhere in 1994-95. A bug that is a bit harder to trigger, and thus it wasn't used until relatively late. |
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: Here's a question that I've had on my mind for almost 20 years now.
How do you think side border scrolling was invented?
Do you think someone had sprites on the screen while a scroller was moving and they noticed a gap?
Perhaps someone was watching a depack routine and noticed that the side borders opened up by one raster line. You know the crunchers that used to increment $d016 as it uncrunched.
Or did someone simply break out the programmers reference guide and figure it out?
This is speculation but I'd like to hear your comments.
Oh and here's another... in the early 80's when there were no cartridges I always wondered how games were cracked. You would reset the computer by grounding the first and third pins on the far left port but you'd also lose data in the process sometimes. How would they have done it??? Granted much of it was simple disk error protection but it would still require you to reboot and load a monitor to view.
p.s. I think the easiest crack of all time had to be Flight Simulator in which, if you viewed the sectors it read "23 READ ERROR". You changed the 23 to a "00" (for OK) and it was cracked.
Mike
I'd imagine that, once removing the upper/lower borders was figured out (which probably did happen due to either random poking of depack effects - since you have eight lines in order to do the modification, it's going to happen randomly often enough to be noticed), that how sideborder removal works would have been a logical progression - only held back by having to work out the timing of the vic, and the effect of sprites thereon. |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
Since upper/lower border routines were invented around 4 months before, I'd assume they had just taken the idea from $D011 to $D016. |
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Cruzer
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1048 |
so, who invented upper/lower border opening? |
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H.O
Account closed
Registered: Oct 2002
Posts: 70 |
Cruzer: The most common opinion is that Flash (of Flash Cracking group, Light Circle, etc) was the one who opened the top/lower border first.
At least that is what 1001 crew claimed, and since they (together with Sodan) were first with sideborder it seems quite likely.
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
I think the inventor is Holger Gehrmann (later boss of reline), he published an article about upper/lower border in a late '85 issue of the 64'er magazine. The first demos with open vertical border appeared in december 1985, short after the article has been released. |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Quote: Here's a question that I've had on my mind for almost 20 years now.
How do you think side border scrolling was invented?
Do you think someone had sprites on the screen while a scroller was moving and they noticed a gap?
Perhaps someone was watching a depack routine and noticed that the side borders opened up by one raster line. You know the crunchers that used to increment $d016 as it uncrunched.
Or did someone simply break out the programmers reference guide and figure it out?
This is speculation but I'd like to hear your comments.
Oh and here's another... in the early 80's when there were no cartridges I always wondered how games were cracked. You would reset the computer by grounding the first and third pins on the far left port but you'd also lose data in the process sometimes. How would they have done it??? Granted much of it was simple disk error protection but it would still require you to reboot and load a monitor to view.
p.s. I think the easiest crack of all time had to be Flight Simulator in which, if you viewed the sectors it read "23 READ ERROR". You changed the 23 to a "00" (for OK) and it was cracked.
Mike
Side borders opening appear from time to time. I remember I saw this in the game kikstart (or was it kikstart ii) later. The side border opened in glitches, but with no sprite, and I though that this might be how they discovered it. Anyway, if you first found out about how to open the upper and lower border it is quite logical to think that you could possibly (with some luck) do the same trick, but horizontally. The same mechanism for enlarging the border, as you know, exists both for vertical and horizontal borders. |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Quote: Here's a question that I've had on my mind for almost 20 years now.
How do you think side border scrolling was invented?
Do you think someone had sprites on the screen while a scroller was moving and they noticed a gap?
Perhaps someone was watching a depack routine and noticed that the side borders opened up by one raster line. You know the crunchers that used to increment $d016 as it uncrunched.
Or did someone simply break out the programmers reference guide and figure it out?
This is speculation but I'd like to hear your comments.
Oh and here's another... in the early 80's when there were no cartridges I always wondered how games were cracked. You would reset the computer by grounding the first and third pins on the far left port but you'd also lose data in the process sometimes. How would they have done it??? Granted much of it was simple disk error protection but it would still require you to reboot and load a monitor to view.
p.s. I think the easiest crack of all time had to be Flight Simulator in which, if you viewed the sectors it read "23 READ ERROR". You changed the 23 to a "00" (for OK) and it was cracked.
Mike
No cartridges? There have been cartridges for the c64 for a long time. The first one I had was Hesmon which was released in 1983. It was an extension of Hesmon 1.1 from the vic20 (1982). This is very good actually. What is bad about it is that you can't read below ROM and I/O + not at $8000-$a000 (hack protection :P). You can ofcourse always write a little copy routine to get the data you want.
Still, making a small tape-transfer style crack is well within reason to do with this, or even a non-cartridge monitor.
I personally used Per Håkan Sundell's CCS Mon which is a severly hacked version of Hesmon with added disk- and tape-turbo and ofcourse handling of memory below ROM and I/O.
I never had a freezer. |
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Brainwalker
Account closed
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 5 |
Flash/FCG/FAC/TLC/RWE was the first who opened the upper/lower border. i know this from him, so it must be true ;) |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
Any demos or other examples from him? There is a lot of dudes who claim that they have been first, but didn't release anything. |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Quote: Any demos or other examples from him? There is a lot of dudes who claim that they have been first, but didn't release anything.
Flash XI, unfortunately undated but I'd say 85-86 (the other Flash intros where on the same disk)
There seem to be a couple of examples in csdb from the end of 1985. I'll do a search later. |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Quote: Flash XI, unfortunately undated but I'd say 85-86 (the other Flash intros where on the same disk)
There seem to be a couple of examples in csdb from the end of 1985. I'll do a search later.
Rambo Music Selector December 1985 by Sodan, but I don't think this was the first.
This first side border scroll I saw was FC-Intros, also by Sodan. Here he claims he was the first to open the side border, but that he had been saving it for a game (The Vikings I guess, strangely not in csdb), and that 1001 had released it before him. |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
Ok this one might pre-date the 64'er article. The article came out in the middle of november 1985, and Rescue on Fractalus was out in the summer 1985.
EDIT:
Oh and yeps, Sodan claimed to have done sideborder first, like a lot of others (Xakk etc), but 1001 Crew released it first and that's the only thing that counts. |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Quote: Ok this one might pre-date the 64'er article. The article came out in the middle of november 1985, and Rescue on Fractalus was out in the summer 1985.
EDIT:
Oh and yeps, Sodan claimed to have done sideborder first, like a lot of others (Xakk etc), but 1001 Crew released it first and that's the only thing that counts.
I didn't know that Xakk claimed it... does it say in any of their demos? |
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iopop
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 317 |
Xakk was formed in august 1986 ... and thats after the first sideborder scroller was released, right? |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Quote: Xakk was formed in august 1986 ... and thats after the first sideborder scroller was released, right?
FC-Intros:19 May 1986.
Border Letter I only says 1986, but must predate FC-Intros as the latter refers to the former.
Edit:
Border Letter II: 7 May 1986.
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Brainwalker
Account closed
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 5 |
graham: no, coz i dont have any stuff from the old times left. but there should be some others out there from the old times that can tell you that im right, i.e. alien/antitrax, mws/rwe or irata/trsi. if i remember right, i read somewhere that 1001 crew also said that flash was first in upper/lower border.
anyway, i and other friends of him know that he was first. thats all that counts. |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
Don't depend too much on the memories of old sceners. After 20 years a lot of memories are wrong. The only real source of information is the demos themselves.
Border Letter 1 was released in April '86, same as the "reply" Sodans Letter which also features a sideborder scroll.
iopop: Yeps, Xakk was formed in '86 but I read in an interview with one of their ex-members that he claimed to have done sideborderscroll in '85. Anyway who cares...
The demo where 1001 Crew said that it could be Flash or the Bitstoppers who invented vertical border opening was "Soon". They weren't sure though. |
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Fix
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 54 |
I'm quite sure that Xakk, DIDN'T Invent the side-border scroll.
I remember the first demo from them.. bitmap picture with spritescroll below :-)
I always thought that 1001 and Sodan were among the first.
Maybe it's time to search old disks. |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Here are some more...
In ECA linker what does "TC" stand for when it crunches? Boba Fette once told me that this stood for "The Cult" but I remain very skeptical about this.
Why did you have to bang the RESTORE key to hell in order to Run Stop/Restore? Why couldn't you just hold down Run Stop and lightly press Restore as you would any other key? I remember having to bang that bastard hard to get it to work.
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: Here are some more...
In ECA linker what does "TC" stand for when it crunches? Boba Fette once told me that this stood for "The Cult" but I remain very skeptical about this.
Why did you have to bang the RESTORE key to hell in order to Run Stop/Restore? Why couldn't you just hold down Run Stop and lightly press Restore as you would any other key? I remember having to bang that bastard hard to get it to work.
As to the restore key, it's because the older c64's have a capacitor hooked to the restore key to prevent you accidently pressing it - and hence accidently causing an NMI that fucks up the program you're running. Think like having to press reset with a paperclip on modern systems :)
I think the c64c actually dropped this, and restore is a normal key there. |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Quote: Here are some more...
In ECA linker what does "TC" stand for when it crunches? Boba Fette once told me that this stood for "The Cult" but I remain very skeptical about this.
Why did you have to bang the RESTORE key to hell in order to Run Stop/Restore? Why couldn't you just hold down Run Stop and lightly press Restore as you would any other key? I remember having to bang that bastard hard to get it to work.
I think that TC stands for something like. 'T' - "testing", scanning for codes. 'C' - "compacting", compressing using those codes. Just a thought. |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Quote: I'm quite sure that Xakk, DIDN'T Invent the side-border scroll.
I remember the first demo from them.. bitmap picture with spritescroll below :-)
I always thought that 1001 and Sodan were among the first.
Maybe it's time to search old disks.
It's always time to search old disks! If you look at the statistics here it's probably _way_ to few releases in csdb around 1983-1987. |
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Rost
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 22 |
Hi,
everyone who is intrested in C64-History can read in
CSDb/Discussions/
the thread VIC-II effect history
VIC-II effect history
ok, here is my latest list
effect date who demo
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -
border top&bottom : 11.10.1985 Flash of FCG Intro
- info from www.radwar.com. So it was not Sodan who discovered this first.
sideborder : april 1986 TSI of 1001 Border Letter I
- it was before Border letter II and this was 7.5.86
FLD : 1986/1987? Thomas Larsen Vikings Intro
FLD : 23.12.1986 Kaze / TST Ace of Diamonds
GOOD FLD : 14.08.1987 White/ The Judges Think Twice I
- Did anyone know the date when the game the Vikings was published and who is
thomas larsen? And was it earlier than the version from Kaze. And can we count
the effect from Kaze as a real FLD ?
sideborder with text : 23.01.1988 White/ The Judges Think Twice V
- did it anyone earlier?
VSP : 30.10.1987 Meanteam VSP&IK+
Full VSP : xx.xx.1988 ASP / Blackmail So-Phisticated 1
- did anyone knows the exact date?
FPP : 26.06.1989 Bones, Triangle 3532, Upfront Random
stretch with D011 : 01.10.1988 BitBuster / Rawhead Partysqeezer
- i don't know the name of this effect.
LineCrunch : xx.11.1988 Exilon / MDT/Horizon Bonanza
- the best effect ever in my opinion.
(pre) FLI : xx.01.1989 Solomon / BeyondForce Charlatan
- there are only 37 'rastersplits' to see, but its the same effect like FLI.
FLI : xx.xx.1989 ASP / BlackMail So-Phisticated 3
- and again no date.
what about sprite stretching? who was the first?
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Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
@Rost:
Actually Wizz made Ace of Diamonds... Coded it about a month before the release date.
The "FLD" effect was discovered by some $d020/$d021 stuff he wanted to do, but typed $d011 instead of $d021.
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
I think So-Phisticated 3 was released on Venlo July 89. Also "Splitter" by Beyond Force which was released short after "Charlatan" has 81 splits. Somewhere around the same time as Splitter and Charlatan there also was So-Phisticated 2 with 75 splits.
Another thing which would be interesting: Who invented $D017 sprite stretching? I thought that this effect is very old, however, all 1988 and also 1989 demos where i always thought they used $D017 stretch only used normal sprite multiplex?! |
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pernod
Account closed
Registered: Nov 2004
Posts: 25 |
In March 1989, several demos featuring d017 stretching were released: take a look at Horizon's release from the Ikari+Zargon party. For the same party I did a DYSP part that utilized D017 for the DYSP (last part of Fairlight's "Digesta" demo).
Later in 1989, we released "Rutig Banan", featuring spritecrunching (3rd part, 0 cycle DYSP :-) ), and also D017+D018 sprite "linepicking" or what you would call it (sideborder flexxer, 4th part).
So D017 tricks were well known in 1989.
The first time I saw D017 stretching was in some game
in 1988.
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TNT
Account closed
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 189 |
Solomon was first with FLI and the effect was found by him. We talked a lot about it on phone, and I started coding Splitter when he was finishing Charlatan. I experimented bit more with the timing and removed the FLI bug. Solomon write nice bullshit story about the effect in the scrolltext of Charlatan :) |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Sideborder with text: 1986, Miki did this in Impossible Demo by Thunderbolt Cracking Crew. |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
@TNT: So-Phisticated 2 was released about the same time as Charlatan and Black Mail also claims to have invented it :P |
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 727 |
@Pernod: Gosh! i never saw that demo before. So, you were such a deep shit coder at that time ;). However, that's not what we mean with sprite-crunching. It's another trick which messes up the way a sprite is displayed. With this you can more or less randomly make the sprite stretch or crunch.. or possibly tilt ;). |
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pernod
Account closed
Registered: Nov 2004
Posts: 25 |
@HCL: Ok, I don't know if it is what people call spritecrunching, but the trick in the DYSP part is that I fiddle with D017 back and forth on a few lines, just before the actual DYSP effect area. By doing so, I got sprites that were 63 lines tall.
Maybe that trick has som specific name?
Anyway, at the time (1989) I was mighty proud of it; people were making dysps and competing who could make the most splits. The theoretical limit (when having up to 8 sprites on the same raster line) was 6 splits, and I acheived it by using a novel trick.
Now noone would care, but back then it was cool.
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TNT
Account closed
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 189 |
Quote: @TNT: So-Phisticated 2 was released about the same time as Charlatan and Black Mail also claims to have invented it :P
It might have been that it was found at the same time by two groups. I and Solomon spent plenty of X-mas 1988 holidays on phone discussing FLI and other things and I doubt he had seen So-Phisticated II by then :) |
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Rost
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 22 |
@TNT: i made a 80 rastersplit FLI routine also in march 1989 (Argon Grew Up, second side of Argonic 100%) , but it was to late :-(. And i didn't see Splitter or So-Phisticated before.
And thank you all for the input. Here is a new list.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Border top&bottom :
11.10.1985 Flash / FCG - Intro
- info from www.radwar.com. So it was not Sodan who discovered this first.
Sideborder :
xx.04.1986 TSI / 1001 - Border Letter I
- it was before Border letter II and this was 7.5.86
Sideborder with text :
xx.05.1986 Miki / Thunderbolt Cracking Crew - Impossible Demo
23.01.1988 White / The Judges - Think Twice V
(pre) FLD :
23.12.1986 Wizz / TST - Ace of Diamonds
Godd FLD :
14.08.1987 White / The Judges - Think Twice I
VSP :
30.10.1987 JCB / Meanteam - VSP&IK+
Full VSP :
xx.xx.1988 ASP / Blackmail - So-Phisticated 1
stretch with D011 : (i don't know the name of this effect)
01.10.1988 BitBuster / Rawhead - Partysqeezer
LineCrunch :
xx.11.1988 Exilon / MDT/Horizon - Bonanza
FLI :
xx.01.1989 Solomon / BeyondForce - Charlatan
early 1989 ASP / Blackmail - So-Phisticated 2
FPP :
26.06.1989 Bones, Triangle 3532, Upfront - Random
Sprite stretching :
xx.03.1989 Horizon - Looking Good
- did it anyone earlier?
Sprite crunching :
xx.xx.199x Crossbow / Crest
- sorry, i don't know the name of the demo
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
I released this: Blood 'n Guts the same day as Ace of Diamonds.
Someone stated that Wizz coded it about a month earlier.
I don't know when I coded the first version, but it could be a couple of weeks before the Blood 'n Guts release (first version Scroll).
I got a hint about the technique when speaking to 3D on the phone. He said that you probably could have a big side border opening in the middle of the screen (with graphics) if you fiddle with $d011 to move around the lines with bad timing so you never reach them.
I think we used a term similar to "every eigth line" or something like that to refer to the bad-lines.
Apparently he'd heard about it somewhere, but never tried it himself. Could be that he heard it from Wizz or someone in TST on a phone conference. Anyway, that was all the hint I needed. :)
I wouldn't be surprised if someone used that technique earlier though. Didn't 1001 do a higher that 5 pixel scroller in the middle during 1986?
Note that my release actually has some graphics showing on screen at the same time as the scroll! ;) |
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Rost
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 22 |
ok, new entry:
23.12.1986 The leader / Computer Cracking Team - Blood'n'guts Intro |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Stable rasters: TSI of 1001 Crew. Used in ESCOS I. Escos uses stacked interrupt for stable rasters. Second interrupt occurs during execution of NOPs. Correction is done using a branch selected by $d012.
Earlier examples?
Same demo has full screen $3fff enabled. i.e no bad-lines without constantly manipulating $d011.
Earlier eaxmples of this? |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
Quote: I released this: Blood 'n Guts the same day as Ace of Diamonds.
Someone stated that Wizz coded it about a month earlier.
I don't know when I coded the first version, but it could be a couple of weeks before the Blood 'n Guts release (first version Scroll).
I got a hint about the technique when speaking to 3D on the phone. He said that you probably could have a big side border opening in the middle of the screen (with graphics) if you fiddle with $d011 to move around the lines with bad timing so you never reach them.
I think we used a term similar to "every eigth line" or something like that to refer to the bad-lines.
Apparently he'd heard about it somewhere, but never tried it himself. Could be that he heard it from Wizz or someone in TST on a phone conference. Anyway, that was all the hint I needed. :)
I wouldn't be surprised if someone used that technique earlier though. Didn't 1001 do a higher that 5 pixel scroller in the middle during 1986?
Note that my release actually has some graphics showing on screen at the same time as the scroll! ;)
I just had a look at Extra Ignored. Isn't the scroll a little high up? Apparently he did use it! ;) Looking at the code he does it by picking $d011 values from a table for each line, this way delaying bad-lines.
Though I must say that Extra Ignored, Blood 'n Guts and Ace of Diamonds isn't really FLD. It is just delaying bad-lines for timing purposes. I'd say that Keleline's intro on Tiger Mission (ex: Tiger Mission) is the first real FLD. But it is ofcourse a very important starting point to delay bad-lines. Pre-FLD is the correct term for it. |
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Rost
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 22 |
Tiger Mission was written by Thomas Larsen who has also written the FLD in the Vikings Intro. Which one was the first? Vikings or Tiger Mission? And who is Thomas Larsen? Is there any other demo?
But Extra Ignored seems to be the first Demo. I delete you from the list, ok? :-)
And yes, stable Rasters are very important, but should it be an entry in this list? I would count only real VIC effects.
Write a VIC register at the right time the right value.
If not, we can can count every effect. This would be too much. Or? If you want, we can try it...
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 727 |
@Pernod: Oh!! Sorry. I checked again :), this *is* sprite-crunching. I thought it looked like a normal d017-stretcher, i'm not used to counting d021-splits :). I thought that i found something new myself back in 1993-1994, but i didn't know what to use it for. And then it was well known in the 80's already. What a stopid rookey i am!
@Rost: The Crest-demo with sprite-crunching is Krestage, 1997..something, check that. But it's not the first usage of sprite-crunching, just check out Pernod's posts. |
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Rost
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 22 |
ok, new entry.
Sprite Crunching:
05.11.1989 Pernod / Fairlight - Rutig Banan |
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hollowman
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: |
pernod, i noticed that on pouet ( http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=9801 ) it says that rutig banan was released at Pepsi Hacker Conference in august 1989, i guess this info comes from scenery http://exotica.fix.no/info/scenery/online/1989.html , was the demo shown there first, or is the information there simply inaccurate? |
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pernod
Account closed
Registered: Nov 2004
Posts: 25 |
@hollowman: the three last parts of Rutig Banan were finished in the summer of 89, and perhaps also shown to some people then (I can't remember), but they weren't released until november at Light's party in Bålsta.
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WVL
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 892 |
How come my version of Rutig Banan only has the last 3 parts? I just checked the version in csdb, and it had 3 more parts than the version i have..
hehe.. btw, i distinctly remember checking out the code of part 4 (the shrinking Fairlight logo) and made the all border sprite zoomer I did in Design Overdose in kinda the same fashion (but easier code)...
hehehe.. routine ripping ahoy! I still cant believe i was the first one to make that, arent there any earlier examples? (Glasnosts all border zoomer is something else, imo). |
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ToD
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2003
Posts: 10 |
megajive back in oct86 was the first demo id seen with full screen sprites..
http://www.cosine.demon.co.uk/legacy/files/legacy_pack_2.zip
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Ben
Account closed
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 163 |
Quote: megajive back in oct86 was the first demo id seen with full screen sprites..
http://www.cosine.demon.co.uk/legacy/files/legacy_pack_2.zip
This demo also contains FLD btw! |
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Rost
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 22 |
@Ben: where is the FLD in MegaJive? MegaJive2 seems to be older. In the CSDb the year is 1987. mhhh..
@XrAyZ: i would say the 'Edam Nibblers' (1001,scrolltext megajive) , spread the first fullscreen sprite pictures (ESCOS).
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Ben
Account closed
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 163 |
@Rost: Try wiggling joystick :) BTW.. Pressing reset also gives a nice 'stretcher' :) |
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Zeus
Registered: Jun 2005
Posts: 16 |
Just as an amendment to the FLI debate: X-Rated did the 160 (cheat) splits then in their party winner "Ratio 80". |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1785 |
@rost:
Pre-FLD (sideborder in the middle with $d011 badline delay.)
4th of November 1986, Warlock, the intro to Highlander. Zyron and I are currently investigating whether this is Warlock or Warlock. |
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Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Quoting zeusJust as an amendment to the FLI debate: X-Rated did the 160 (cheat) splits then in their party winner "Ratio 80".
What would that "cheat" be, fli ? |
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ChristopherJam
Registered: Aug 2004
Posts: 1407 |
Nah, a half pixel scroll :) |
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Codey
Registered: Oct 2005
Posts: 79 |
Quote: @TNT: i made a 80 rastersplit FLI routine also in march 1989 (Argon Grew Up, second side of Argonic 100%) , but it was to late :-(. And i didn't see Splitter or So-Phisticated before.
And thank you all for the input. Here is a new list.
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Border top&bottom :
11.10.1985 Flash / FCG - Intro
- info from www.radwar.com. So it was not Sodan who discovered this first.
Sideborder :
xx.04.1986 TSI / 1001 - Border Letter I
- it was before Border letter II and this was 7.5.86
Sideborder with text :
xx.05.1986 Miki / Thunderbolt Cracking Crew - Impossible Demo
23.01.1988 White / The Judges - Think Twice V
(pre) FLD :
23.12.1986 Wizz / TST - Ace of Diamonds
Godd FLD :
14.08.1987 White / The Judges - Think Twice I
VSP :
30.10.1987 JCB / Meanteam - VSP&IK+
Full VSP :
xx.xx.1988 ASP / Blackmail - So-Phisticated 1
stretch with D011 : (i don't know the name of this effect)
01.10.1988 BitBuster / Rawhead - Partysqeezer
LineCrunch :
xx.11.1988 Exilon / MDT/Horizon - Bonanza
FLI :
xx.01.1989 Solomon / BeyondForce - Charlatan
early 1989 ASP / Blackmail - So-Phisticated 2
FPP :
26.06.1989 Bones, Triangle 3532, Upfront - Random
Sprite stretching :
xx.03.1989 Horizon - Looking Good
- did it anyone earlier?
Sprite crunching :
xx.xx.199x Crossbow / Crest
- sorry, i don't know the name of the demo
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The good majority of these effects were first seen in demos. Have any of these effects failed to make the transition to a commercial game release?
-Codey |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
AFAIK Mayhem in Monsterland uses VSP scrolling and there's at least the game Wizball which uses the upper/lower border as status display. |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
Games using AGSP (VSP + linecrunching):
Fred's Back 1-3
Another World
An open upper/lower border is VERY common in games, usually the developers put a score display there (some examples: Paperboy, Warhawk, all SEUCK games etc etc).
Sideborder was used a few times, but usually only for a sideborderscroller in the title screen (Leviathan, Ben).
Also FLI has been used a few times. I remember the title picture of Clystron using hires FLI and I have a vague memory of some polish puzzle games using FLI in-game aswell.
I remember FLD being used on some koala loading pictures, and the title of Predator also uses it to make a text display look more interesting.
I'm pretty sure there is sprite stretching in games aswell. I guess only sprite crunching was never used in games, since it's use is very limited even for demos. |
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Danzig
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 436 |
not to forget fli in motley tetris from cosmos designs... |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
Wasn't there even IFLI in Soul Crystal ingame? Well at least I remember it used interlaced graphics ingame. |
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Wisdom
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 90 |
Quadranoid / Happy Computer's intro had a sideborder logo moving.
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enthusi
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 676 |
Sould Crystal had only interlaced gfx in intro and ending.
Not during game itself.
IIRC it was MC-interlaced but I could be wrong |
