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SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Release id #94766 : Defender +6Gfx
Why did you remove my credit for the intromusic ?
Does this mean, that no cracks at all have credits for intro tune ?
Weird, if you ask me.. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
the credits for the intro belong into the entry for the intro and shouldnt be duplicated in every crack entry that uses said intro. (and no, i didnt do it :)) |
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daison
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 90 |
I removed it, for the reason Groepaz just mentioned.
If your name is in the credits, it would as if you would have done the game music (although there is none hehe)
But do not worry, I will upload a stand alone version tonight with full credits including myself (yeah! :)
The crack release will have a link to the intro by then and all is good again..
And at least the nufli decrunches for quite a while so our names are shown for quite some time after pressing space :) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
Quote:If your name is in the credits, it would as if you would have done the game music
err, no. credits for the game do not belong into the crack entry either =) |
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daison
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 90 |
Quote: Quote:If your name is in the credits, it would as if you would have done the game music
err, no. credits for the game do not belong into the crack entry either =)
Unless we would have added some music to the game... right?
Anyway, I think Rambones has a point regardless.
I can understand the cracktro being a entity on it's own. Absolutely. But still, wouldn't it be nice to have intro credits on a crack without having the cracktro itsself linked, per-sé?
In my humble opinion, the cracktro is a part of the crack.
Especially when you'd have a trainer menu intergrated for example (which is not the case here, but for the sake of argument...) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
Quote:Unless we would have added some music to the game... right?
ofcourse, then its part of the crack :)
Quote:I can understand the cracktro being a entity on it's own. Absolutely. But still, wouldn't it be nice to have intro credits on a crack without having the cracktro itsself linked, per-sé?
not really.... its mostly a problem of the presentation layer here (eg, credits for the intro could be _shown_ on the crack entry page too). mixing them up in the same entry is bad, because then you dont know what credit belongs to what.
and like said before, there is no need to duplicate that kind of info to tons of releases. having the same intro credits on 500 fairlight or triad cracks is kinda pointless =)
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daison
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 90 |
Ok, fair enough... |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2894 |
We've done it this way for years here ... intro credits go in the intro entry not the import/crack release entry.
I'm having trouble understanding why this must be brought up every five or six months. Can't people remember simple rules?
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The Ignorance
Registered: Apr 2006
Posts: 85 |
And the next calling it "cracktro" on a C-64 hp will be axed! |
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daison
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 90 |
@Moloch: "We've done it this way for years here". Besides "It is so, for it is written in the Bible" that's one of the weakest arguments I have ever heard.
@Ignorance: Lol, didn't know you were so sensitive about what abbreviations should be used around these parts of the web. Golden Axe me, because I find crack intro is too much too type =P |
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Skate
Registered: Jul 2003
Posts: 490 |
I solved this issue with giving a "help" credit for Avatar's previous crack release. Coding an intro for them means helping them, right? :) Of course I'd prefer credit options like "intro code, intro music, intro credits" etc. But please don't start this "didn't you read CSDB crack manifesto?" shit 'coz i did but i don't remember a word. I'm not a cracker after all... :) |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2894 |
Quoting daison@Moloch: "We've done it this way for years here". Besides "It is so, for it is written in the Bible" that's one of the weakest arguments I have ever heard.
@Ignorance: Lol, didn't know you were so sensitive about what abbreviations should be used around these parts of the web. Golden Axe me, because I find crack intro is too much too type =P
The rules are the rules, you can't get around them by stating your opinion.
Also, cracktro isn't a c64 term ... true sceners (non-lamers/non-n00bs) know this and don't use that PC/Amiga term with the c64. The correct term is intro, only in recent years did demo people try to change it to "crack intro". It is, and will always be, simple intro.
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daison
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 90 |
while(rules==rules)
rules=rules;
//have fun remaining in your endless scene-loop
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Rough
Account closed
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1829 |
I Just want to point out that the different terms 'crack intro' and 'intro' is only used in the database to distinguish between intros linked before cracks and standalone intros which were mostly released to the public around 89/90. e.g. Orion Intro |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2894 |
Quoting daison//have fun remaining in your endless scene-loop
There is no endless loop for me, this is a hobby and nothing more. Dealing with idiots, unfortunately, is part of said hobby.
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
Quote:Dealing with idiots, unfortunately, is part of said hobby.
admit it, thats why you doing it ! |
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SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Well, the system is flawed i think.
It results in x number of tunes/whatever, not showing up on a profiles release list.
It could be that I have released 12 tunes in various intros, but none of them are linked to me, and you cannot see that i did them, so this means that released stuff goes into the thin air.
So if CSDB was meant to record everything about who did what and when, then this strange rule is preventing that.
A simple example: Cooperation Demo tune by Future Freak, is likely in 100+ intros. So my statement is, that you should see those 100+ cracks on Future Freaks profile.
Else i dont see the point of CSDB anyway... |
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V-12
Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 206 |
I agree with Jan, because I think that the intro is a part of crack and credits should be listed. I can understand if in the past there were 500 cracks using the same intro with same music but nowadays nobody is doing like this. People are doing exclusive tunes for intros etc.
Personally I don't count ripped intro as separate C64 release. Intro is a part of crack :) |
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Conrad
Registered: Nov 2006
Posts: 833 |
Regarding music in intros... I would prefer to see a single entry of the intro on its own, with full credits including the music... but then have HVSC links to all the SIDs that were used in the same intro, as well as links to all the cracks that use the intro (this is already available).
I disagree with adding music credits to cracked releases directly, because:
1.) It will take ages to add music credits to every single crack on this site. (We're talking about roughly 25 years of stuff here, some of which that are locked as well, and that will put more pain up your arse.)
2.) It will overload the musician's profile with hundreds of releases that are less likely to be viewed by people who are not interested in the cracking scene, as well as focusing out the more important music releases in demos or music compos.
3.) They would still be unreachable if you are in "demo" mode on CSDb ;), and I know a lot are in that mode for past reasons. Besides that, "C64 Intros" can be still viewed in "demo" mode.
Having said that, it will help boost your profile with more credits. Though I'd rather see CSDB optimised with these sort of credits. Having lots of credits doesn't mean you'll get lots of hits, if that is what you're really after. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
Quote:Regarding music in intros... I would prefer to see a single entry of the intro on its own, with full credits including the music... but then have HVSC links to all the SIDs that were used in the same intro, as well as links to all the cracks that use the intro (this is already available).
and thats exactly how its supposed to be, indeed.
and the rest aswell, you got it =)
(except "intro" != "crack intro" =)) |
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Rough
Account closed
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1829 |
Quoting rambonest could be that I have released 12 tunes in various intros, but none of them are linked to me, and you cannot see that i did them, so this means that released stuff goes into the thin air.
So if CSDB was meant to record everything about who did what and when, then this strange rule is preventing that.
A simple example: Cooperation Demo tune by Future Freak, is likely in 100+ intros. So my statement is, that you should see those 100+ cracks on Future Freaks profile.
That's not caused by the CSDb system, but because people tend not to add entries for intros linked to cracks they open up aentries for. |
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
Quote: Regarding music in intros... I would prefer to see a single entry of the intro on its own, with full credits including the music... but then have HVSC links to all the SIDs that were used in the same intro, as well as links to all the cracks that use the intro (this is already available).
I disagree with adding music credits to cracked releases directly, because:
1.) It will take ages to add music credits to every single crack on this site. (We're talking about roughly 25 years of stuff here, some of which that are locked as well, and that will put more pain up your arse.)
2.) It will overload the musician's profile with hundreds of releases that are less likely to be viewed by people who are not interested in the cracking scene, as well as focusing out the more important music releases in demos or music compos.
3.) They would still be unreachable if you are in "demo" mode on CSDb ;), and I know a lot are in that mode for past reasons. Besides that, "C64 Intros" can be still viewed in "demo" mode.
Having said that, it will help boost your profile with more credits. Though I'd rather see CSDB optimised with these sort of credits. Having lots of credits doesn't mean you'll get lots of hits, if that is what you're really after.
I fully agree ..... |
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iAN CooG
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 3132 |
Quote: Regarding music in intros... I would prefer to see a single entry of the intro on its own, with full credits including the music... but then have HVSC links to all the SIDs that were used in the same intro, as well as links to all the cracks that use the intro (this is already available).
I disagree with adding music credits to cracked releases directly, because:
1.) It will take ages to add music credits to every single crack on this site. (We're talking about roughly 25 years of stuff here, some of which that are locked as well, and that will put more pain up your arse.)
2.) It will overload the musician's profile with hundreds of releases that are less likely to be viewed by people who are not interested in the cracking scene, as well as focusing out the more important music releases in demos or music compos.
3.) They would still be unreachable if you are in "demo" mode on CSDb ;), and I know a lot are in that mode for past reasons. Besides that, "C64 Intros" can be still viewed in "demo" mode.
Having said that, it will help boost your profile with more credits. Though I'd rather see CSDB optimised with these sort of credits. Having lots of credits doesn't mean you'll get lots of hits, if that is what you're really after.
What about intros used hundred times but with dozens of different songs, and sometimes a song used only in one? how can you tell which releases uses a particular song? In an intro entry you only see a list of authors and sids, it doesn't say which exactly uses tune x and which tune y... Not counting that no one cares, it seems by just looking at random intro entries, to link EVERY release using that intro. I spend all my evenings and weekends entering sid entries and fixing badly credited music authors - the option to enter sid paths is exceptionally good to find who's really the author and finding real release dates - but how many can tell they care to do the same?
I entered the sid link to this entry
Caveman Ugh-Lympics
because it seemed that NO OTHER RELEASE uses this song. Spank me but it's the only way I have to know where that song is from. The same intro is used by other releases but don't have that tune.
Besides, any solution it's not optimal anyway if even entry owners lock their stuff and don't complete the credits/sid lists themselves.
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
you have a point... however to handle this special case, the database structure must be changed so this kind of relation can be dealt with. |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2894 |
Yeah, that is an issue. I've done this a few times, changed a music in an intro for whatever reason. Obviously the CSDb system currently can't handle that, but certainly something that should be fixed in the "future".
("future" generally meaning YR2065 of something)
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11114 |
we are competing with masons c64heaven on this delay issue =) |
