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Moderators
Registered: Nov 2010
Posts: 32 |
Release id #189442 : Free Ammo!
Submitted by GH/MSL/Toondichters [PM] on 30 March 2020
There is a logical explanation for everything.
Waiting patiently...
User Comment
Submitted by Slator [PM] on 30 March 2020
as if corona was not silly enough...
User Comment
Submitted by Linus [PM] on 30 March 2020
WTF. Mr. Ammo? Seriously?
User Comment
Submitted by ZeSmasher [PM] on 30 March 2020
cool one!
what? Mr.Ammo banned? he's the nicest dude on planet Earth. |
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Style
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 498 |
OK, fess up people, did someone sleep with someone's sister or something? |
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Compyx
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 631 |
Something called "free ammo" should at least be NTSC compatible =) |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1045 |
Why did Mr. Ammo get banned? |
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Golara
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2018
Posts: 212 |
csdb is a gun free zone lol |
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Didi
Registered: Nov 2011
Posts: 488 |
First of all: Cool production!
Communication is not all moderator's ability. Had these problems myself years ago. All finally cleared up by one more silent moderator with a few mails. Have to admit it was a different moderator team back then. |
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macx
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 255 |
Excellent! 11/10! |
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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1940 |
Quote: Why did Mr. Ammo get banned?
Violation of rule 1.3 and 1.9 especially.
IMHO its not a good idea to paste a PM by Perff into IRC as the first thing on receiving it. Someone being on here for nearly 18 years should just use the reply button.
Other sentences mentioned in our discussion which we indeed had before hitting the ban button included:
"he has undermined CSDb by posting deleted links and info from within CSDb to the public."
"Destructive, and not supportive, attitude." |
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Smasher
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 521 |
not commenting the reasons (except for "destructive".. come on, Mr.Ammo destructive is the world upside down...)
so whatever the reason was I hope you guys will clear up and problem will get solved very soon.
well, if my opinion matters something to someone: this story is not good for the scene. |
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ChristopherJam
Registered: Aug 2004
Posts: 1409 |
This should probably be a production note, but comments are closed, so...
Mad props to Shine for creating the logo for this demo in under an hour from Burg saying 'we should make a "FREE AMMO" demo!' to Shine emailing me the finished graphic.
I was a tad slower. 13 hours from repo creation to feature complete, half of which I was sleeping. All new code aside from the stable interrupt, but no new ideas really. I had plans for a 3D effect, but a quick draft looked shit so I canned it.
The sliding doors effect is a little optimised by only loading A when the value to be written changes, only writing colour ram values for non-spaces, and only writing values to screen or colour ram if they have a different neighbour to the left or right. There's plenty of room for improvement - I don't group multiple runs of the same value, and don't take advantage of each half only scrolling one direction.
The scroller uses a 32x4 grid of chars as a bitmap that can be easily scrolled by writing new character indices to the screen. Masks are expanded from the ROM font at startup, then composited with the pattern fill as they are brought on screen.
Music selection was Burg's idea :)
Apologies for the lack of NTSC compatibility; I didn't even think of that.. |
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ChristopherJam
Registered: Aug 2004
Posts: 1409 |
Quoting Count ZeroViolation of rule 1.3 and 1.9 especially.
IMHO its not a good idea to paste a PM by Perff into IRC as the first thing on receiving it. Someone being on here for nearly 18 years should just use the reply button.
hrm, probably not, no. But, I never saw any grumbles about "the rules" per se - and I'm on IRC constantly. Just exasperated concern that a much loved site may be in danger.
Was he actually warned he was skirting close to being banned?
(FWIW, I get that you're under no obligation to justify the moderators decision - but transparency is always appreciated. As much as anything, it helps the rest of us to understand what sort of behavior is considered ok here :) ) |
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TheRyk
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 2268 |
I hope you don't interpret this as violation against 1.3 but isn't this rule 1.3 like the new Hungarian rule that basically lets government interpret what is "fake news" and enables it to jail every critic? I'm just asking a question but if some mod feels I "whine in public", I'm out... seriously? |
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hedning
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 4734 |
These issues are not public issues. It's between Ammo and the moderators. And I am sure a warning from the site's owner prior to the ban could be seen as a pretty good indication that you are on thin ice. Publishing the warning on IRC and obviously not taking it very seriously, instead of answering it, might not be the best move. |
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hedning
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 4734 |
Quote: I hope you don't interpret this as violation against 1.3 but isn't this rule 1.3 like the new Hungarian rule that basically lets government interpret what is "fake news" and enables it to jail every critic? I'm just asking a question but if some mod feels I "whine in public", I'm out... seriously?
It's a bit outside of this discussion, but I interpret it as we have rules here (like on every other forum), accept them or don't, and if you want to change them you should bring it up with the moderators in a constructive manner instead of running a crusade against the rules or how the site works everywhere else where nothing will happen. If you don't accept them you should not be here. Everyone is free to start a database like this with your own rules and guidelines and live happy the rest of your life there. The options are endless. And it's not like the rules are hidden away, either.
Again: it's not a human right to have an account here and say and do whatever you want. It's the same anywhere else on the net for that matter. This is not Hungary, or any other country. Moderators are not political figures that some democratic system elected. We were asked to take this freetime job, that takes a lot of time, because the other mods, and ultimately the site owner Perff, thought we were fit for it. We act and decide stuff for what we think is best for the site, the database and the users here. |
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TheRyk
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 2268 |
democracy != moderating any internet platform
that's old news, though I would appreciate some human rights every now and then here, hehe.
all I'm saying is moderators giving 1.3 violation as reason for ban might frequently be vaguely intransparent to community and thus, rather fuel than prevent drama.
BTT: What you stated in #13 really _IS_ some explanation (no matter if users like it or not). However, I think Ammo! deserves some mercy, at least no permanent ban.
Always remember:
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Smasher
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 521 |
Hedning, it's getting slightly offtopic yes. yup, rules exist on CSDb and on every forum/site, but you can't compare the two really 1:1.
CSDb creates an unique id for every scener who contributed with something in this fab long living digital community through the years. It also collects all the stuff with the excuse "it's just a Db", sometimes ignoring author's will.
If you are one of those sceners you can decide to put a face behind that id, so you can activate your scener-id, which allows you to chat here on this beautiful forum and post your own stuff.
well, imagine facebook creates a user-id for every person in the world, it posts your photos and stuff, then it's up to you to decide if you want to impersonate your id by activating your account or not. of course you cannot remove the photos someone else posted, coz FB it's just a dB :)
ok, I'm getting really offtopic now. let's keep it short: I agree it's not human right to have a voice here. also since we aren't alone you can't walk naked here so I also agree on the point you must use some dresscode, which you call "rules".
but, hey: sceners are friendly and smart persons, most of us (me at least) are here coz we believe in this site. so typing "it's like this, if you don't accept it go build your own site!" it's a bit too hard and a bit too sad to me. sorry, my 2cts. |
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hedning
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 4734 |
Quote: Hedning, it's getting slightly offtopic yes. yup, rules exist on CSDb and on every forum/site, but you can't compare the two really 1:1.
CSDb creates an unique id for every scener who contributed with something in this fab long living digital community through the years. It also collects all the stuff with the excuse "it's just a Db", sometimes ignoring author's will.
If you are one of those sceners you can decide to put a face behind that id, so you can activate your scener-id, which allows you to chat here on this beautiful forum and post your own stuff.
well, imagine facebook creates a user-id for every person in the world, it posts your photos and stuff, then it's up to you to decide if you want to impersonate your id by activating your account or not. of course you cannot remove the photos someone else posted, coz FB it's just a dB :)
ok, I'm getting really offtopic now. let's keep it short: I agree it's not human right to have a voice here. also since we aren't alone you can't walk naked here so I also agree on the point you must use some dresscode, which you call "rules".
but, hey: sceners are friendly and smart persons, most of us (me at least) are here coz we believe in this site. so typing "it's like this, if you don't accept it go build your own site!" it's a bit too hard and a bit too sad to me. sorry, my 2cts.
I didn't want to sound harsh. What I said was: there are rules, if you don't like them you should talk to the moderators, and they will discuss it. If you still won't accept them, then we are sorry, but don't make a scene (heh) about it, or start mess with stuff or break the rules, or go on a public crusade against it. They are there for a reason. And I also said that everyone could make their own project if they think they can make a better one. That's just true. We have Demozoo and Pouët and lots of other places and databases available already, so it's not impossible. Fairlight is trying to make one right now if I am informed correctly.
I wish all sceners could be friendly and smart, and thankfully most are. And I try to be the best I can be (it was easier before becoming a moderator as you sometimes have to make decisions that not everyone will love). The vast majority are wonderful people. That's why I love the scene. But most of the banned people were not so nice to fellow sceners, or tried to trash the database in one way or another, or could not accept the rules even after repeatedly being told to keep to them. It's like life in general, I guess. Thankfully the vast majority of people here are constructive, helpful and nice, and want all the best for this site and for the scene in general. Believe it or not: but we mods do our best to protect the integrity of the database and make this place a friendly, creative and constructive arena. We are not some dark nazi lords sitting in a castle somewhere planning to hurt people. We are you, but asked specifically to help out, in our spare time, with this place to keep it running. |
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Golara
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2018
Posts: 212 |
Quote: I didn't want to sound harsh. What I said was: there are rules, if you don't like them you should talk to the moderators, and they will discuss it. If you still won't accept them, then we are sorry, but don't make a scene (heh) about it, or start mess with stuff or break the rules, or go on a public crusade against it. They are there for a reason. And I also said that everyone could make their own project if they think they can make a better one. That's just true. We have Demozoo and Pouët and lots of other places and databases available already, so it's not impossible. Fairlight is trying to make one right now if I am informed correctly.
I wish all sceners could be friendly and smart, and thankfully most are. And I try to be the best I can be (it was easier before becoming a moderator as you sometimes have to make decisions that not everyone will love). The vast majority are wonderful people. That's why I love the scene. But most of the banned people were not so nice to fellow sceners, or tried to trash the database in one way or another, or could not accept the rules even after repeatedly being told to keep to them. It's like life in general, I guess. Thankfully the vast majority of people here are constructive, helpful and nice, and want all the best for this site and for the scene in general. Believe it or not: but we mods do our best to protect the integrity of the database and make this place a friendly, creative and constructive arena. We are not some dark nazi lords sitting in a castle somewhere planning to hurt people. We are you, but asked specifically to help out, in our spare time, with this place to keep it running.
I don't think anything that goes outside the site should affect your account here |
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Adam
Registered: Jul 2009
Posts: 323 |
Quote: I don't think anything that goes outside the site should affect your account here
One would rightly assume that this would be the case but apparently it's not. It's no problem, chat about CSDb will just move to private channels or private messages in the future. :) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11391 |
Quote:I wish all sceners could be friendly and smart, and thankfully most are.
April fools, do you love them? :o) |
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Shine
Registered: Jul 2012
Posts: 369 |
Some Facts:
1) It exists rules on CSDb.
2) The rules are for all users which have an account here.
3) The rules are public accessable for everyone.
Why is it forbidden to refer on it public?
I do not understand it. |
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TheRyk
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 2268 |
Adam: better to Dark Net if you wanna be on the safe side |
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hedning
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 4734 |
Quote: Some Facts:
1) It exists rules on CSDb.
2) The rules are for all users which have an account here.
3) The rules are public accessable for everyone.
Why is it forbidden to refer on it public?
I do not understand it.
One example: If the rules tells you not to post deleted links in public, then don't. |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1045 |
Quote: I don't think anything that goes outside the site should affect your account here
Agree with what Golara said. |
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Shine
Registered: Jul 2012
Posts: 369 |
Quoting hedningOne example: If the rules tells you not to post deleted links in public, then don't.
I can understand this of course.
But my intention was the referring to existing rules.
(I.3) for example.
I have fairly to say, that a Mod told me meanwhile, that is still ok to discuss rules in public. But not in a trolling meaning, which is fine to me aswell. |
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hedning
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 4734 |
Quote: Quoting hedningOne example: If the rules tells you not to post deleted links in public, then don't.
I can understand this of course.
But my intention was the referring to existing rules.
(I.3) for example.
I have fairly to say, that a Mod told me meanwhile, that is still ok to discuss rules in public. But not in a trolling meaning, which is fine to me aswell.
Good. Because if you want to change things, please contact the moderators and discuss it nice and civilized. That is the way to change things. The wrong way would be to spend all your free time trying to prove points by undermining CSDb and force your opinion on others. |
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Shine
Registered: Jul 2012
Posts: 369 |
Quoting Shine
I have fairly to say, that a Mod told me meanwhile, that is still ok to discuss rules in public. But not in a trolling meaning, which is fine to me aswell.
Did you read over "public" maybe?
Sure it is ok to talk with a Mod. But to not allow to make it public is a case, which i can not agree. I don't know any organisation right now, where this is forbidden.
A wise discussion culture should allow this in almost every case. (Except trolling and similar cases!) |
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hedning
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 4734 |
Quote: Quoting Shine
I have fairly to say, that a Mod told me meanwhile, that is still ok to discuss rules in public. But not in a trolling meaning, which is fine to me aswell.
Did you read over "public" maybe?
Sure it is ok to talk with a Mod. But to not allow to make it public is a case, which i can not agree. I don't know any organisation right now, where this is forbidden.
A wise discussion culture should allow this in almost every case. (Except trolling and similar cases!)
It's ok to discuss whatever you want in public, but if you spend all your time undermining CSDb by breaking obvious rules, we have the right to revoke your user status here, as you obviously not appreciate it. |
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Shine
Registered: Jul 2012
Posts: 369 |
I can understand this 100%. Some people like to overuse ...
and this was not my intention.
Thanks for your patience and your reply! |
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Raistlin
Registered: Mar 2007
Posts: 688 |
Quote: I don't think anything that goes outside the site should affect your account here
Unless what’s put outside the site uses information gleaned from the site in a way that breaks the site’s rules. That’s a prettt standard agreement with all sorts of websites - and makes 100% sense to protect the integrity of the site. Without provisions like this, a lot of website developers wouldn’t bother. |
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Raistlin
Registered: Mar 2007
Posts: 688 |
Quote: Agree with what Golara said.
Predictable as always, JC ;-) |
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Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
This is serious shit.
I hope it doesn't cause a long-term dichotomy or ruins the atmosphere at parties to come. |
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hedning
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 4734 |
Quote: This is serious shit.
I hope it doesn't cause a long-term dichotomy or ruins the atmosphere at parties to come.
Please elaborate. |
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Golara
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2018
Posts: 212 |
Quote: One example: If the rules tells you not to post deleted links in public, then don't.
I don't get it, what do you mean by deleted links ? Like for cracked games or something ? Don't tell me you just delete links from the visible site and you still keep the files, lol. If that's the case anyone could just scan the website for valid links and post them somewhere, what then ? What's the issue ? If it was a link to an external site and you deleted the link and someone posted it somewhere then what does it have to do with csdb ?
This whole don't discuss mod decisions in public smells like "Administration is always right" rule that every 12 years old admin makes on their first forum. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11391 |
Quote:Don't tell me you just delete links from the visible site and you still keep the files
Say it isn't so |
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JackAsser
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 2014 |
Quote: Quote:Don't tell me you just delete links from the visible site and you still keep the files
Say it isn't so
Renamed to oldname.hidden |
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Golara
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2018
Posts: 212 |
I just want to make sure if that's the issue here. You delete the link because the game is copyrighted or something, but someone still has a valid link and posts it on other website and gets a ban here ? If so, that's retarded. Instead of banning people for something you should make that bad something not possible to do, i.e just delete the fucking file. I assume you didn't even rename the file, cuz how would he know the filename without just brute forcing all the possible urls ? I just hope It's something else because if this is really it then i'm freaking dead laughing, send paramedics |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1045 |
Golara: for the cracks you speak of. The link is not visible to normal users of this database. It is still visible to "moderators" and "trusted users" (apart from the moderators, unsure who else has access to copyrighted material?). Anyway, more info on this is available here: https://csdb.dk/crackstandards.php |
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Adam
Registered: Jul 2009
Posts: 323 |
Quoting GolaraThis whole don't discuss mod decisions in public smells like "Administration is always right" rule that every 12 years old admin makes on their first forum.
CSDb isn't a democracy and the admins can run the site however they want. so yea, they are always right no matter what we may agree or disagree with. :) |
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Romppainen
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2008
Posts: 40 |
I am digging my own hole here because I have exploited the current system for years, but there is a method to get the hidden stuff downloaded without leaked links: All it needs is some clever thinking, links or filenames are not needed at all. Came up with the solution on my own back in the days so I doubt this one is commonly used tho. Mods can PM me for further details if interested. |
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Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2982 |
Quoting JazzcatGolara: for the cracks you speak of. The link is not visible to normal users of this database. It is still visible to "moderators" and "trusted users" (apart from the moderators, unsure who else has access to copyrighted material?). Anyway, more info on this is available here: https://csdb.dk/crackstandards.php If i got that right, the question was whether the URLs of deleted/invisible links still work. Because in that case, yeah, joke's on CSDb and spreading those URLs really shouldn't be punishable by banning, but the (public) URLs be removed altogether in the first place.
So regarding still-working public URLs of deleted/hidden links: Say it isn't so. =) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11391 |
Hint: +1 |
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Romppainen
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2008
Posts: 40 |
Quote: Hint: +1
Exactly. |
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Golara
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2018
Posts: 212 |
Quote: Quoting GolaraThis whole don't discuss mod decisions in public smells like "Administration is always right" rule that every 12 years old admin makes on their first forum.
CSDb isn't a democracy and the admins can run the site however they want. so yea, they are always right no matter what we may agree or disagree with. :)
I'm not basing my argument on any laws, it's not even an argument, just my opinion on these kinds of rules. |
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Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
Quote: Please elaborate.
What is there to elaborate?
I just hope the people who contributed to banning Mr. Ammo and those who stand by Mr. Ammo can be decent people during some party if they meet in person.
I haven't witnessed the whole circus that led to the ban, so I'm not commenting on that.
Quoting AdamCSDb isn't a democracy and the admins can run the site however they want. so yea, they are always right no matter what we may agree or disagree with. :)
It doesn't have to be a democracy to not be totalitarian, IMHO.
Power comes with responsibility. |
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Adam
Registered: Jul 2009
Posts: 323 |
Quoting hedningOpen a forum thread about it
one already exists. continuing from the oneliners:
:) |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1045 |
Quote: Quoting hedningOpen a forum thread about it
one already exists. continuing from the oneliners:
:)
+1 |
