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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1065 |
Party compo machines
We're busy getting everything ready for DATASTORM, and one of my tasks is to provide good machines for the compo. Of course one 6581 and one 8580 machine is needed, and they both need to handle VSP. I'm a little unsure about a few details though:
* Should the 6581 be of a specific revision (R4/R4AR?), or is any fully working 6581 OK?
* The entries will be run from a 1541 Ultimate, unless someone absogoddamnlutely needs a genuine drive. But which 1541U firmware should be used? I currently have 1.7b from the homepage on my rev 1.
* Should the graphics entries be displayed on an old VIC, with its softer display, or on a new VIC, with its sharper display and clearer colors (but with banding and gray pixels in d021, etc)?
If you have super specific needs, please contact me in advance. I will try to make the compo machines available for testing on friday and early saturday, to avoid nasty surprises. |
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Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
Regarding the 6581, I'd say that any chip capable of playing Lightforce with satisfactory result should do... but that's just my oppinion.
Announcing the chip revision, would allow people to adjust settings somewhat using emulators or even real hardware.
For the 8580 it might be interesting for some to know if it plays samples at reasonable volume or not.
I'd prefer the old VIC for gfx entries.
I'm curious as to how you plan on testing for VSP stability?
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11296 |
SID: i would use a R3. or simply not care at all :)
1541u: i used it at BP - and i can only advice you to be certain to have a working real drive handy for the compo, and also to prepare all demos on real disks. (which makes using the 1541u a bit pointless indeed). 1541u is kinda picky about certain loaders, and the freezer/menu still isnt completely stable. for a 2-side demo, you want to use the real drive and not pray in the compo that the thing doesnt crash when flipping the disk.
VIC: old vic whereever possible. the board revision contributes more to the sharpness of the image than the actual vic btw =P |
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 727 |
Not the *super*-old VIC with weird luminaces (5 levels instead of 9).
Real 1541 drive.
You'll also need lotzz of beerzzz! |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11296 |
Quote:Not the *super*-old VIC with weird luminaces (5 levels instead of 9).
yes ofcourse :) |
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1065 |
Right, a real 1541 is a must for demos that swap disks - you don't want the freezer screen to interrupt the demo. Real disks will of course also be kept for the entries.
For 8580, they don't play samples at a reasonable volume unless the machine has been modded, right? Or do some play OK as is?
And good to know that SID revision isn't critical, I'll simply see what I have and what works.
GPZ: which board revs are fuzzy, and which are sharp? Naturally only machines with 8-pin video connectors will be used, and connected with S-Video.
Devia: I've been running a few VSP intensive demos for a few hours here, without any signs of problems. That should be good enough.
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Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
Quoting MagerValpFor 8580, they don't play samples at a reasonable volume unless the machine has been modded, right? Or do some play OK as is?
I have 2 8580 which plays samples at acceptable volume regardless of which machine they are put in.. For me that's 2 out of 6, but I dunno if thats 2 out of 2000 on a greater scale i'm afraid.
Quoting MagerValpI've been running a few VSP intensive demos for a few hours here, without any signs of problems. That should be good enough.
Hmnjae.. I believe this has been discussed several times already, but in my experience a c64 running VSP code with no problems, might fail after a power cycle while continuing to run stable between resets. Also one VSP routine may work while another crashes, while it may be the other way around the next day... really annoying!
On my new setups it looks as if the $d02x gray-dot "feature" is somehow linked to this VSP "bug" (never saw any VSP crashes on old c64) - If the $d02x bug is active, VSP code is prone to failure, if the $d02x bug is gone VSP code works flawlessly - or at least it works as designed ;-)
You can use Emusuxx0r+ to easily see the $d02x feature's "stability"/current state.
If you during your testing should discover the same link between these two "features" as I seem to have observed on my machines, please let me know! also I'd like to know if you see no relation of course ;)
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1065 |
I've powercycled the machines in between tests, and I've used three different VSP routines. I'll be running more demos on them in the following weeks, but it should be as safe as it gets.
Interesting about 8580 samples, I'll try a few sids on it.
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SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Most 6581 in sceners C64 is an R4.
It came 1985.. |
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Frantic
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 1641 |
I would go for 6581 R4 and 8580 without bothering if the 8580 can play samples or not. As I see it, a standard 8580 "cannot" play samples.
Compatibility between various models and revisions etc is fucked anyway, so I would consider it overkill to care more than this.
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ready.
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 441 |
in case of real 1541, use 1541-II with Chinon mechanism (direct drive system). a lot of demos fail on the Mitsumi 1541-II drive (possibly due to the loose belt).
Also I have two C64c (new board with 85xx components that crash on (and only on) Bomberman C64 and Catollica
I still have not found out why. They work 100% on everything else, including VSP. |
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gregg
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2005
Posts: 56 |
I'm with Frantic here. Don't overdo it; you can't please everyone and sometimes you also can't avoid that stuff goes wrong, no matter how well you are prepared. |
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SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Just remember to unplug RR cart, then all should work :D |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11296 |
"Just remember to unplug RR cart, then all should work :D"
you love to share your sympathy for certain products do you? :o) that doesnt change the fact that this is bolloks though :o) |
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Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2942 |
Quote: I've powercycled the machines in between tests, and I've used three different VSP routines. I'll be running more demos on them in the following weeks, but it should be as safe as it gets.
Interesting about 8580 samples, I'll try a few sids on it.
One demo featuring VSP that has crashed on me particularly often is Arcanum/Xenon, the big scroller part which i believe uses 2 or 3 DMA delays per frame. |
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1065 |
Thanks, I'll add it to my test suite.
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