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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Balloonacy 2 idiocy
I have to feel so bad for Richard, being brave enough to release his own game without trainers.
Within 24 hours of his releasing a game, there appears a 2 trainer version. An hour or two later a 3 trainer version. The next day there's a 4 trainer version and finally a 6 trainer version.
I'll hold out for the Nostalgia +20 version with hi score saver. *groan*
Richard must feel like Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie feel when the National Enquirer vultures swoop down upon them. Granted you're open game when you release something but it's pretty laughable to see so many people pounce upon Richard's game like a homeless man chasing a bagel rolling down the street.
Let's clear this up to save time:
MEGA TRAINER
=============
Change $7003 to JMP $2c00
2c00 jsr $70a1
2c03 jsr $ffe4
2c06 cmp #$2a
bne XX
inc $09
XX rts
This plays the music while giving you the key when you hit the star key.
======================
Infinite Lives: EA EA EA (three NOP's) at $394e
==========================
Infinite time: EA EA EA at $3ba1
==========================
Sprite Collision off = RTS at $3a9d
Save $e000-$f000 when you go to save the memory.
We need a starting level option and a button to hold down for temporary sprite collision bypass. I'd laugh but I'm sure in a day this WILL happen. Mark my words.
*sighs* Note to Richard, perhaps in your next game you could include a hidden trainer with every conceivable option. Granted your game was difficult to play but I hate to see it re-released without your intro and directory tree.
PS. All the above was done without looking at any of the versions out there. I became bored :) |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Richard found a supporter, nice! :) |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Well... uhm....
1) Richard continues to produce software for the C64 in an era where so few other programmers do.
2) I've written games that have found there way back into the scene with trainers. Nobody likes to have their intro ripped off and replaced with someone elses. If the intro is left intact, that's somewhat consoling.
3) This business of, the more trainers the better, is pretty lame. Who needs 20 trainers, I mean come on... you know as well as I do it's for bragging rights. There are no real games so any public domain game or fellow scener game gets ripped to shreds so someone can call it a release.
4) There is no reason not to support Richard. He writes his own music, codes his own demos and makes his own graphics and releases these to the scene.
5) It takes very little skill to train. It takes more to code.
So there :)
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
All of the releases are from lamer labels... clearly a sign of how people support Richard... the guy is a fuckwit.
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5022 |
richard is a strange guy, but you'll cry him back when the scene will have no new releases for years. |
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Richard is not a real person.
I still suspect TMR is playing a trick on us. |
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cba
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 933 |
Quote: Richard is not a real person.
I still suspect TMR is playing a trick on us.
Question is, why didn't you add those trainers
on your SCROTUM version ?
Niels
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iopop
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 317 |
Quote: Richard is not a real person.
I still suspect TMR is playing a trick on us.
3 - nill - to me! :)
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HMVDVA
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 20 |
Well, you are giving Richard too much credit here by comparing him with Angelina Jolie.
After seeing Wanderers Scrotum (release) I saw that more trainers could be done.
Troep topped my release so if you take that thumb out of your ass you can see that this wasn't a pisstake on Richard but some oldschool competition a la Gamers Guide.
Now please go collect some suxx0r ntsc crap intro's for your site and let us do our thing. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quote: 3 - nill - to me! :)
i don't know what to say, iopop... well actually i do, but it's *very* rude so i'll save it for IRC! =-) |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quote: All of the releases are from lamer labels... clearly a sign of how people support Richard... the guy is a fuckwit.
One of the releases is by Fortress, Bayliss treats *himself* that way so who is anyone else to argue? |
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iopop
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 317 |
TMR: I was refering to the fact that more and more people think that richard is a fake, something I have considered since 2001. |
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: Question is, why didn't you add those trainers
on your SCROTUM version ?
Niels
Me? I haven't "cracked & trained" a game since 1988 .. |
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cba
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 933 |
Quote: Me? I haven't "cracked & trained" a game since 1988 ..
I am shocked! you actually cracked a game before your
'DEMO' making period , ai ai !
Niels |
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: I am shocked! you actually cracked a game before your
'DEMO' making period , ai ai !
Niels
I deny everything!
I was forced!
It wasn't even a real crack!
Also: I did demos long before that my friend. On the other hand, I started out by changing texts in other people's cracks & games .. |
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cba
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 933 |
Quote: I deny everything!
I was forced!
It wasn't even a real crack!
Also: I did demos long before that my friend. On the other hand, I started out by changing texts in other people's cracks & games ..
I also changed text in cracks like that, amazing, we've all done it.
I still recall trying the ECA packer and not knowing
what to put for value $01 ?, it turned out to be 37,
37 tries ;)
Niels |
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1568 |
Quote: I also changed text in cracks like that, amazing, we've all done it.
I still recall trying the ECA packer and not knowing
what to put for value $01 ?, it turned out to be 37,
37 tries ;)
Niels
You mean $37 tries =)
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://forum.siliconlimited.com
Commodore 64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.blogspot.com/ |
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Spinball
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 87 |
Quote: You mean $37 tries =)
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://forum.siliconlimited.com
Commodore 64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.blogspot.com/
maybe he didn´t know anything about hex-numbers back then and just tested 1-37 in decimal :) |
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5022 |
I remember trying $ff different acc value for the init routine when trying to ripp a tune.... guess it wasnt the init routine, or it needed some other regs to be inited :) |
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cba
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 933 |
Quote: You mean $37 tries =)
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://forum.siliconlimited.com
Commodore 64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.blogspot.com/
well yeah I tried more than 37 times,
I tried alot of codes, my god it was terrible,
it was like scanning for a routing code at some c5 line.
Niels :) |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: All of the releases are from lamer labels... clearly a sign of how people support Richard... the guy is a fuckwit.
There is difference between being a fuckwit and act as a fuckwit. Where I can agree that Richard acted like fuckwit in past, how can you call him fuckwit for creating of a new game even when it's not anything extra special. Moloch I would have never expected such words from coming from your direction... |
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1568 |
Quote:Moloch I would have never expected such words from coming from your direction...
You should hear him on IRC... :D
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://forum.siliconlimited.com
Commodore 64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.blogspot.com/ |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: Richard is not a real person.
I still suspect TMR is playing a trick on us.
Richard Bayliss of course *is* a real person. And am I the only person to see the major improvement of his behaviour since the year or two ago? |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: I also changed text in cracks like that, amazing, we've all done it.
I still recall trying the ECA packer and not knowing
what to put for value $01 ?, it turned out to be 37,
37 tries ;)
Niels
Now if only you could tell me what the SKIP does in ECA Linker. I've never been able to get an answer. It doesn't allow for a range (eg. $e000-ffff) only a four digit input.
And HMVDVA, I've got all the intros I possibly can for my site. There are simply no more to collect. It's nice when you can set up a site to show what you've contributed over two decades. I'd hate to look back and *cough* say I was only able to contribute some very poor quality trainers that a blind cocaine-snorting Xanax popping monkey from a jungle in Tanzania could do in his sleep. To have your work used on over 200 releases beats infinite lives on Richard's game. I'll leave it at that, you have to go return that monkey to it's natural habitat :)
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cba
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 933 |
Quote: Now if only you could tell me what the SKIP does in ECA Linker. I've never been able to get an answer. It doesn't allow for a range (eg. $e000-ffff) only a four digit input.
And HMVDVA, I've got all the intros I possibly can for my site. There are simply no more to collect. It's nice when you can set up a site to show what you've contributed over two decades. I'd hate to look back and *cough* say I was only able to contribute some very poor quality trainers that a blind cocaine-snorting Xanax popping monkey from a jungle in Tanzania could do in his sleep. To have your work used on over 200 releases beats infinite lives on Richard's game. I'll leave it at that, you have to go return that monkey to it's natural habitat :)
Wish I knew what it is, so far I've also found nobody that
could explain me.
Niels |
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
To be fair, balloonacy2 isn't actually completly terrible (I enjoyed it, at least). and gridzone remix was actually pretty good, for a budget game.
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: I remember trying $ff different acc value for the init routine when trying to ripp a tune.... guess it wasnt the init routine, or it needed some other regs to be inited :)
LDA #$00
JSR $1000 (whatever)
Sometimes you can be pleasantly surprised and find that LDA #$01, #$02 will bring up a second tune, even three, depending on the tune.
LDA #$FF would surely never work :)
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Btw. in the end it turned to nice debate about beginnings. I also did that intro ripping and text rewriting.. only problem is that I started in 1992.. too late ;-))) |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: Quote:Moloch I would have never expected such words from coming from your direction...
You should hear him on IRC... :D
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://forum.siliconlimited.com
Commodore 64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.blogspot.com/
Aha.. so there he moved. And I wondered where all that energy go. |
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HMVDVA
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 20 |
Quote: LDA #$00
JSR $1000 (whatever)
Sometimes you can be pleasantly surprised and find that LDA #$01, #$02 will bring up a second tune, even three, depending on the tune.
LDA #$FF would surely never work :)
Oh! you're such a skilled coder!
Which monkeytribe tought you that? |
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hollowman
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 474 |
Quote: Richard Bayliss of course *is* a real person. And am I the only person to see the major improvement of his behaviour since the year or two ago?
deleting entires in csdb, and therefor forcing locking of entries is an improvement? |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: deleting entires in csdb, and therefor forcing locking of entries is an improvement?
How many times, which entres, when, and possibly why oh why? But ok, let's call him a fuckwit if there is no other chance.
On my side I experience a lot less e-mails (about 1 per 2-3 months). And even less trash news on c64.sk (from his side). Maybe because I didn't join IRC gaychannel for about half a year already? Did that influence my moods? Don't know. I felt that like a major improvement. At least I don't have to think about retard scene that often. |
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1568 |
Quote: How many times, which entres, when, and possibly why oh why? But ok, let's call him a fuckwit if there is no other chance.
On my side I experience a lot less e-mails (about 1 per 2-3 months). And even less trash news on c64.sk (from his side). Maybe because I didn't join IRC gaychannel for about half a year already? Did that influence my moods? Don't know. I felt that like a major improvement. At least I don't have to think about retard scene that often.
We were just pulling your leg by saying that the C64 scene was in #gay.
Just join #c-64 and you'll cheer up.
Trust me...
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://forum.siliconlimited.com
Commodore 64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.blogspot.com/ |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
Are you saying that's not the C64 scene in #gay??? Hey wait, you tricked me for years!!! |
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: Are you saying that's not the C64 scene in #gay??? Hey wait, you tricked me for years!!!
You & me both, lover. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11130 |
Quote:
Are you saying that's not the C64 scene in #gay??? Hey wait, you tricked me for years!!!
ofcourse it is, dont let them fool you! |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Oh! you're such a skilled coder!
Which monkeytribe tought you that?
I didn't need to borrow your monkey. I figured it out for myself along with everything else required to make intros and demos. It would be beyond your comprehension to explain it though. When you advance beyond NOP'ing out games in an attempt to train them, then we'll talk. You can borrow the monkey for a few more months but be sure to feed him and empty his cage droppings. He gets very upset when he's forced to step in his own fecal matter.
Bonzo also likes his banannas to be cut into small slices instead of whole. Probably a by-product of his contact with human beings.
We'll compare notes in a month's time to see if you can code any better. At such point you can trade the monkey in for a seeing eye dog. :)
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cba
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 933 |
Quote: I didn't need to borrow your monkey. I figured it out for myself along with everything else required to make intros and demos. It would be beyond your comprehension to explain it though. When you advance beyond NOP'ing out games in an attempt to train them, then we'll talk. You can borrow the monkey for a few more months but be sure to feed him and empty his cage droppings. He gets very upset when he's forced to step in his own fecal matter.
Bonzo also likes his banannas to be cut into small slices instead of whole. Probably a by-product of his contact with human beings.
We'll compare notes in a month's time to see if you can code any better. At such point you can trade the monkey in for a seeing eye dog. :)
I think you have no idea to whom your talking,
coding wise your certainly not as his level.
and enough of this monkey bizznizz ;)
Niels
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Tch
Account closed
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 512 |
Richard is motivated,determined,improving and active.
Fuck it if he gets emotional and removes entries RELATED to his (groups) work.
The scene would be in a much better state if everybody had his DRIVE! ;P |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
TCH: I agree, despite Richard's lameness, I do like his productivity. He is improving. He is learning. The process is slow, but noticable. |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: TCH: I agree, despite Richard's lameness, I do like his productivity. He is improving. He is learning. The process is slow, but noticable.
TCH, Jazzcat - Thank you! |
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Tch
Account closed
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 512 |
No need to thank me CreaMD.
Richard´s got C64-Spirit written on him.
That´s what matters to me. ;) |
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Radiant
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 639 |
I also don't understand why so many are picking on Richard. I mean, if he's really that bad, don't you think everybody's got it by now? And if he isn't, then again what's the point in all this shitthrowing business?
I guess it's easier to make fun of others than doing something constructive, but that's no excuse for being some kind of lame ass scene-bully. Don't you have anything better to do at all? It's all jolly great to poke fun at somebody from time to time, in reasonable doses (I laughed my ass of to the Game Over note) but there's a point where it stops being fun and just becomes sad. |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: I also don't understand why so many are picking on Richard. I mean, if he's really that bad, don't you think everybody's got it by now? And if he isn't, then again what's the point in all this shitthrowing business?
I guess it's easier to make fun of others than doing something constructive, but that's no excuse for being some kind of lame ass scene-bully. Don't you have anything better to do at all? It's all jolly great to poke fun at somebody from time to time, in reasonable doses (I laughed my ass of to the Game Over note) but there's a point where it stops being fun and just becomes sad.
Agreed.
Also, never had any real problems with him, otherwise he would not be in my group :) |
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
I've just read this topic and would like to mention that I do indeed take this bullying-tactics from other people too seriously. I know I am very easy to wind up, but can't help it. I've been like this since school (And at the age of 26 I'm still easy to wind up).
Secondly, I have a passion of creating games for the Commodore 64. What I saw (As Wanderer pointed out) seems a big joke. A group of fake labels challenging each other to make a better trainer of a Public Domain game. It surprises me that someone done something like that, just like it was in the 1990's (But not fake labels, real groups). To be honest, what I saw of 4 cracks of this game this week was very childish. However, being strong, I won't let this put me off making games for this good ancient machine. I have loved the Commodore C64 since I first had it.
I am pleased with my result of this game, and was pleased that I did not release *more* than one version of this game.
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: I've just read this topic and would like to mention that I do indeed take this bullying-tactics from other people too seriously. I know I am very easy to wind up, but can't help it. I've been like this since school (And at the age of 26 I'm still easy to wind up).
Secondly, I have a passion of creating games for the Commodore 64. What I saw (As Wanderer pointed out) seems a big joke. A group of fake labels challenging each other to make a better trainer of a Public Domain game. It surprises me that someone done something like that, just like it was in the 1990's (But not fake labels, real groups). To be honest, what I saw of 4 cracks of this game this week was very childish. However, being strong, I won't let this put me off making games for this good ancient machine. I have loved the Commodore C64 since I first had it.
I am pleased with my result of this game, and was pleased that I did not release *more* than one version of this game.
Richard,
Given that there are so very few releases coming out, people will pounce on anything that is trainable. I'm biased of course, given that a dinky little 17 block game I wrote and uploaded to the scene was re-released as a 'crack' and trained.
So here's what I suggest you do... simply add in a hidden trainer of sorts. Extra life key, 5 second invincible key, skip level key, infinite lives, no sprite collision, etc.
My personal opinion has always been that trainers spoil a game, knowing the capability to cheat is there. However if you include your own little +10 trainer, this should avoid the re-releasing.
Mind you, given the sorry state of the scene I'm sure you'd wind up with a +11 version with high score saver.
But hey man, you can certainly try... or even put in some protection to prevent against training. It could be done in theory, and make it a tad harder. I think the best defense is to put your own trainer in though, as if you don't, the vultures will :)
Your efforts in creating games is appreciated by some, though not all... keep it up!
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
I'll keep up the good work with the games :) |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: I'll keep up the good work with the games :)
Good! :)
And I am still waiting for that rumoured Turrican III crack with fixes for the _stock C64_ never seen it out.
I would prefer people force all energy on that than 4 x cracking Richard's games... |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
Funny read... and it seems that some people don't understand what a lamer label is for...
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: Funny read... and it seems that some people don't understand what a lamer label is for...
for putting onto diskettes? :) |
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Quote: Funny read... and it seems that some people don't understand what a lamer label is for...
A lamer label was meant for games/prods that lacked in quality and very unplayable. Or games that were created using game-creating tools, like SEUCK, Game Maker, etc. It was so that other groups did not put their real group to shame. I thought you would have already knew that, being that you were in the scene longer than I was. :P |
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Tch
Account closed
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 512 |
My definition of a lamer "someone only able of changing texts" doesn´t apply here.
Sure,the game is bullshit,I won´t play it.
Ah,I must be missing something here..
I am 31 years old,that might be it. |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
Yes, I'm quite aware of what a lamer label is... I created one of the more famous ones.
From your postings in this thread and under release entries it seems you don't understand. You somehow have confused cracking groups and lamer labels, even going to the point that you seem to think these releases are some badge of honor.
Someone like you would have never survived in the proper pre-internet scene. Too much cuddling and asskissing these days...
http://iancoog.altervista.org/PACKERS.TXT
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
IMO there is big difference between snailmail scene and internet scene. Here you can't "fuck-you" anyone at instant. Internet brings people closer to each other . Maybe even closer than in board-days and therefore some kind of netiquete should be followed because anything you spit against the sea of internet can return to you as a big wave in few hours/minutes. But I wouldn't mind if the old spirit returned.. nowadays you get every kind of respons immediatelly and unfiltered and that can be quite disappointing for some weaker personalities.
roman |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
/me waits for a wave with a surfboard in hand
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Tch
Account closed
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 512 |
You are totally right.
I was a complete nobody in the early 90´s.
The difference between when lamer-groups appeared and the NOWADAYS,is that those old games were commercial releases.
Selling crap,abusing consumers!
New stuff comes from ´amateurs´ just trying to have some fun.
Slag whatever you want,standards have dropped.
As for my comments,I don´t think I´ve made that many on ´cracks´,if any at all.
If you refer to my other comments..
Screw you,it is my opinion and I don´t care what you think about those.
When I like a demo/music,who are you to say I am wrong?
I don´t give negative feedback anymore,if you want some of that, read some "Brutal Recall" issues.. ;P
If something rates below 5,I draw the line...
Hmm,this stuff is ment to be fun.. |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
To be clear, my recent comments are directed towards Richard's response.
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
This thread is boring... |
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Tch
Account closed
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 512 |
Haha,don´t leave me time to change my post at all,did you?
Keep surfing.. ;) |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: This thread is boring...
I would say.. Thanx God, finally some thread where I'm not being accused of being nasty on oldcomers. ...and not respecting the old principles. ... and well.. for the rest of accusations read the breakpoint forums about executable music compo ;-)))) |
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Dipswitch
Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 42 |
i'm just a c64 scene "watcher", and probably i don't know something essential, but what is wrong to release a _trainer_ for a pd game? trainer is trainer! game is game! |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1153 |
Yes. Ideally IMO game coder could/should 100% disregard what goes on in the cracking scene, especially as it isn't now even a question of real piratism / lost profits.
Hidden selfmade ingame cheats (usually activated by typing something) are however good idea, not to discourage training, but to act as safeguard for bad/lazy players to get to the end even in case the game never gets trained.
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: i'm just a c64 scene "watcher", and probably i don't know something essential, but what is wrong to release a _trainer_ for a pd game? trainer is trainer! game is game!
That's a valid question and it goes back to my original post.
Okay you need a trainer, infinite time or sprite collision. But it just never ends... you get +3, +4, high score saver, IFFL versions, and even +20 (I've seen one game with this many).
I've been around for almost 20 years and I think I can form an opinion that this is no longer about making a trainer to play the game but just to better the last person and get "your" release out. I highly (and I posted this almost a year back) doubt anyone's going to care if Quest for Tires or Pac Man has an extra 4 trainers or not.
The games were released 20 years ago, played to death, and now they are played no more. But that's only my thoughts.
If one group releases a trained version, fine.. but do we really need +6 followed by a +10 version a week later?
I could, in theory, go through all of Gamebase's games and put out 2000 new games with 20 trainers in them. Does the 64 scene need it? No. Will a lot of people see it? Likely not. Will the game actually be played? I very much doubt it.
I realize there is nothing but hours and hours of free time now that the game scene is dry. In my time, you had no time to make many trainer versions because you were too busy working on the next crack. One day we put out 6 games, so time was limited on the cracker.
In the old days once you put out the version you were done. You didn't go back to make a +3 followed by a +10 version. There were standards, today there are none.
It's your right, but AFAIC it's really just very sad and lame to see 4 version of a new game in 24 hours.
Richard, I call upon you to end this madness. Include an in-game trainer. I remember one of the first games I played was Blue Max and it had a secret code you'd enter to cheat. I never did figure it out but the trend of cheating is not new.
Save us Richard, save us :)
Okay this thread is too long. The fire marshall is threatening to close it for too many people are in here. So I'm going to vacate the building.
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: That's a valid question and it goes back to my original post.
Okay you need a trainer, infinite time or sprite collision. But it just never ends... you get +3, +4, high score saver, IFFL versions, and even +20 (I've seen one game with this many).
I've been around for almost 20 years and I think I can form an opinion that this is no longer about making a trainer to play the game but just to better the last person and get "your" release out. I highly (and I posted this almost a year back) doubt anyone's going to care if Quest for Tires or Pac Man has an extra 4 trainers or not.
The games were released 20 years ago, played to death, and now they are played no more. But that's only my thoughts.
If one group releases a trained version, fine.. but do we really need +6 followed by a +10 version a week later?
I could, in theory, go through all of Gamebase's games and put out 2000 new games with 20 trainers in them. Does the 64 scene need it? No. Will a lot of people see it? Likely not. Will the game actually be played? I very much doubt it.
I realize there is nothing but hours and hours of free time now that the game scene is dry. In my time, you had no time to make many trainer versions because you were too busy working on the next crack. One day we put out 6 games, so time was limited on the cracker.
In the old days once you put out the version you were done. You didn't go back to make a +3 followed by a +10 version. There were standards, today there are none.
It's your right, but AFAIC it's really just very sad and lame to see 4 version of a new game in 24 hours.
Richard, I call upon you to end this madness. Include an in-game trainer. I remember one of the first games I played was Blue Max and it had a secret code you'd enter to cheat. I never did figure it out but the trend of cheating is not new.
Save us Richard, save us :)
Okay this thread is too long. The fire marshall is threatening to close it for too many people are in here. So I'm going to vacate the building.
Making game with trainers included won't help. There still be someone who to "retrain" it. It's quite weird that even today with all the technological advantages there are, some crackers are able to put up buggy release. Some of Cadaver's games got bugged during the proccess.
It's hard to come up with any way of game releasing that could be considered safe from cracking. It's a wicked circle.. you can make it free.. open source (there was some logic game with source released, and the person stopped development after he realised that there is a crack).. cooperate with crackers in good faith (Newcomer game).. crack it yourself (Cadaver's game).. include please don't crack note (Savage Plattforms).. *anything* and there still be someone to crack it becasue that's how it works since ages. Also even if you release a propper crack of your own game(like Cadaver did) because there are just bugged ones around, there be people complaining that you don't respect the old rules. I'm sure I forgot (or intentionally ommited? ;-) many other real-life examples of how this weird business behave nowadays... The best thing is either not to bother with it, or stop making C64 games. There is no way to avoid it. |
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
This has nothing to do with cracking... |
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cba
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 933 |
Zyron, your right, it has all to do about intro linking and training :)
Funny to see this thread growing and growing while the
only reason TROEP released a +6 version was to annoy
Hema with their +4 release.
All just for good fun and certainly not intended to
take the piss on Richard.
+20 versions of games are in my opinion not worthless,
and back in the earlier days I always kept for example
the jewel versions from Snacky above the +2 trained versions of other groups.
Niels |
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
Quote: This has nothing to do with cracking...
Mainly because there's nothing to crack in Richard's games, these are trainers adding. These releases are lame ? Could be !! But I prefer lame activity than NO activity. |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1153 |
Quote:Also even if you release a propper crack of your own game
As far as I remember, there was no proper release of BOFH V1.0 (only the beta) for months, so it was done for that reason only. In the end it got Triad to release a superior version though. |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: Mainly because there's nothing to crack in Richard's games, these are trainers adding. These releases are lame ? Could be !! But I prefer lame activity than NO activity.
word! :) Silvio I agree with you (as always, heh).
Still so many games that deserve a crack, i.e. working version such as Turrican III or Outrun Euopa (version 2 from 1991 since it has tunes that fall out of sync), a year 2000 fix for LCP, etc etc :) |
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Ninja
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 406 |
Quote: Mainly because there's nothing to crack in Richard's games, these are trainers adding. These releases are lame ? Could be !! But I prefer lame activity than NO activity.
I disagree. This would be like 80-year old people acting as if they were 20. |
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Kyle
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 31 |
I'm still waiting to see a 100% cracked and trained version of Exile ;-) anyway.... |
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Yoko Tv Inc.
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 68 |
Sorry Kyle , We`re all busy making that + 20 version of Balloonacy 2
:-)
NOT IN YOUR WILDEST DREAMS !
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Actually, i'm busy making a one-part raster demo just so i can be active. |
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
Quote: I disagree. This would be like 80-year old people acting as if they were 20.
An hobby has no age time and keeps young. When I'll be 80 years old I hope to be still here ;-) |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: Sorry Kyle , We`re all busy making that + 20 version of Balloonacy 2
:-)
NOT IN YOUR WILDEST DREAMS !
Ah the notorious anonymous voter writing in allcaps.. where did you suddenly find all that bravery. ;-) |
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Yoko Tv Inc.
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 68 |
sure you have the right person ?
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: sure you have the right person ?
Yes. |
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Yoko Tv Inc.
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 68 |
tell you what - i dont gice a damn -
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: tell you what - i dont gice a damn -
No problem. |
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Ninja
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 406 |
Quote: An hobby has no age time and keeps young. When I'll be 80 years old I hope to be still here ;-)
That's the same with me. But I hope I'll be wise enough then to see that making lots of 8x8-plasma-demos won't keep "the thing" alive. But everyone as he pleases... :)
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quote: That's the same with me. But I hope I'll be wise enough then to see that making lots of 8x8-plasma-demos won't keep "the thing" alive. But everyone as he pleases... :)
Don't be silly, of course not... we'll all be doing 6x6 plasmas with gaps between the cells! =-) |
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5022 |
ROTFL |
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enthusi
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 675 |
Quote: Don't be silly, of course not... we'll all be doing 6x6 plasmas with gaps between the cells! =-)
not if I get a patent on it first :) |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quote: not if I get a patent on it first :)
i'm sorry, but any ideas are copyright 2005 Cosine Systems (PLC), official licences can be purchased for the usual fee. And last time i did that joke i said 7x7 cells and spent over an hour on IRC trying to come up with ways to do that with 1 pixel gaps between the cells at full screen! =-) |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: tell you what - i dont gice a damn -
So you don't gice a damn? Nice to see that you gave me your favourite voting score too. IMO, the best treatment for your mental problem would be if you received some nice ammount of "1" votes in return too. Anyone interested? Wanderer? ;-)
P.S.: I know I'm not being very discrete, and I expect to be accused of misusing of the privilege, but in this particluar irrational case I simply couldn't resist. ;-) |
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Yoko Tv Inc.
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 68 |
why dont you just shut up ?
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: So you don't gice a damn? Nice to see that you gave me your favourite voting score too. IMO, the best treatment for your mental problem would be if you received some nice ammount of "1" votes in return too. Anyone interested? Wanderer? ;-)
P.S.: I know I'm not being very discrete, and I expect to be accused of misusing of the privilege, but in this particluar irrational case I simply couldn't resist. ;-)
This will make the 86th response to my original post.
Can we all just clear out and go home? The janitor is waiting with his mop and bucket and wanting to clean up this mess.
CreaMD: I don't usually give out 1 votes unless its retaliatory or a really bad production :) The voting system is flawed and biased. I think that a system should be in place whereby users who contribute (eg. through posts and creating submissions) gain access to vote. New users and users who have not contributed, would not be able to vote.
Think of it like Ebay's feedback system :)
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
Yoko: it is normal for CreamD to continue like this. He directs his time and energy into what he likes best.
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Quote: Yoko: it is normal for CreamD to continue like this. He directs his time and energy into what he likes best.
Wanderer: and why do you think I pointed the finger and mentioned your name? This is not just coincidence.
Jazzcat:This is more like simple action-reaction thing. Yoko gave me 1 for all my scene jobs (which is of course as unfair as with anyone else he did) so I (without much thinking as usual) gave him the same treatment. Since when you became expert on CreaMD? I myself don't know what is the thing I like the best. But at least I thank you for forcing me to ask myself that question. EOT for me.
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
Since you give yourself 1's for all the scene jobs you can't value them very high. |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
CreamD: Keep up your great work. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Oh no, there's another version released - when will this idiocy stop?! It's not even a real +9, so it's another fake release... =-) |
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HMVDVA
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 20 |
Quote: Oh no, there's another version released - when will this idiocy stop?! It's not even a real +9, so it's another fake release... =-)
Correct.
Wandererer is again clueless.
I wonder why he didn't add any VU meters to this release. |
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iopop
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 317 |
Quote: Correct.
Wandererer is again clueless.
I wonder why he didn't add any VU meters to this release.
more like a 16 year old attention whore. if we just ignore him he will hopefully stop? |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: more like a 16 year old attention whore. if we just ignore him he will hopefully stop?
Hi boys and girls, lets practice our math today.
1) Infinite life
2) Infinite time
3) Sprite collision removed
4) Barrier animation removed
5) Skip level
6) Get key trigger
7) Open door trigger
8) View end sequence
9) Start level change
So you are right. It is defintely fake because adding 1 thru 9 numbers does not equal the number 9.
Now I was curious about #8 because it's not really a trainer but according to the other Balloonacy release that counts as one (ps: Richard I was sure to make sure the character set was on).
At best it's a +8 but I'm going for +9. The megatrainer comes from the trainer being in-game as opposed to just before the game. This is what I understand +M to be. Curious programmers will want to look at $9000 and $9200.
I can see that this release is doing exactly what I wanted. Bringing attention to my attention whore fetish about trainer wars being gay.
Quote:
>if we just ignore him he will hopefully stop
It's too late for that as you already not only downloaded it but also chose to post about it.
The funny part is, had any other group released it, it would have been seen as a better version. We had +2, 4 and 6... and now 9. But because I made it clear I think re-releasing with even more trainers is absolutely gay gay gay, you come down on me :)
I'll try to fit the VU meters in next time. :)
/hands out kleenex to iopop and HMVDVA. Don't take it too hard, I did it because I want to see someone make a +10 or +20 version and prove me right.
"Don't hate the player, hate the game" LOL |
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Tch
Account closed
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 512 |
Some argue that 5&9 or 6&7 are the same.
But all I can do is laugh about all this... 8D
The more I think about it,the funnier it becomes.
Does humor belong in the scene? ;) |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Actually you're right about 6 and 7 being similar. I thought about that after I finished training the game. The best way I can see this working is to use #6 from any given area on the screen and see if you can reach the door. Let's face it, some levels of the game make it very difficult to obtain the key.
Trainer #7 follows the same logic as #6.
Skipping a level allows you to bypass levels you may find too easy/difficult or just not interesting enough. The start level provides an easier way to begin a new game at a predetermined level.
I think though, you have to remember the overall purpose behind this release. The release was meant to show how RIDICULOUS the scene is, where groups try to outdo one another based on trainers that are, in all actuality, pretty much useless. We won't get into training 1980's games either, that's another issue I have.
I did it to show: (a) it's all too easy to train, requiring very little skill, (b) anyone can do better than a previously released version if they put enough time into it and (c) sometimes it's best to just leave a release very well alone. In the case of Balloonacy I left the original intro intact, something other versions did not do. I didn't place any intro of my own on it, and I left the directory structure intact.
If Nostalgia released the game with 9 trainers or even 20, it would have been hailed as a wonderful release. Yet when I did it, it was ridiculed. I don't apologize for being old school from an era where re-releasing with more trainers was not done. I won't apologize for approaching this with humour when those getting anal retentive are the same ones who released trained versions themselves :)
I don't care what the new scene thinks of me, I'm old school and I will continue to poke fun at situations that I see as being absurd. People are totally free not to download my stuff if they desire not to.
All I want is for someone to make a +10 or +20 to add to the madness and prove my opinions on the scene to be justified. If that does not happen, you still end up with a decent game and the best version available. :)
That's it for me on this matter.
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
How many times now have you done a release "to show how RIDICULOUS the scene is"? It's not making the scene look any more ridiculous... |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: How many times now have you done a release "to show how RIDICULOUS the scene is"? It's not making the scene look any more ridiculous...
Forbidden Forest - training old games is sad.
Balloonacy - Training and retraining is sad.
All others were legit attempts. But since you were asking rhetorically rather than statistically, I would respond, "Whenever I feel like poking fun at the ridiculous things that I see".
*pokes Slarti*
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
Yes, I can see my point was lost on your befuddled mind. |
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
Quote:If Nostalgia released the game with 9 trainers or even 20, it would have been hailed as a wonderful release. Yet when I did it, it was ridiculed.
I don't understand why you keep bringing Nostalgia into this discussion. This thread, as I've understood, is about how ridiculous the scene is when several fake groups try to beat eachother in who can squeeze the most trainers into a newly released public domain game, where you took the prize. Now explain to me what Nostalgia has to do with this & how you even can imply that we'd do a release like that. |
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
@Zyron: maybe he doesn't understand the difference between fake labels and oldies cracking groups ? |
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
Quote: Forbidden Forest - training old games is sad.
Balloonacy - Training and retraining is sad.
All others were legit attempts. But since you were asking rhetorically rather than statistically, I would respond, "Whenever I feel like poking fun at the ridiculous things that I see".
*pokes Slarti*
Forbidden Forest - training old games is sad.
Maybe it's sad for you, surely not for everybody. Your argument is useless. |
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big piss
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 1 |
Seems like URINE pissed down all our throats lately. Make sure to swallow otherwise you just choke, as they are so much. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quote: @Zyron: maybe he doesn't understand the difference between fake labels and oldies cracking groups ?
No, i'd say it's pretty much guaranteed that he hasn't got a clue about oldie cracking since he's previously said "I could, in theory, go through all of Gamebase's games and put out 2000 new games with 20 trainers in them." Since almost all of the oldie releases are done from scratch using tape and disk originals, it's obviously not the same thing at all.
Still, if he'd like to "poke fun", how about a better version of, for example, Phobia deprotected from an original and with NTSC and bug fixes. |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Yes, I can see my point was lost on your befuddled mind.
I addressed the issue in your post.
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Matt
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 592 |
atleast richard has the guts not to stay anonymous unlike that gangbangbus moron.
it's pathetic. |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: No, i'd say it's pretty much guaranteed that he hasn't got a clue about oldie cracking since he's previously said "I could, in theory, go through all of Gamebase's games and put out 2000 new games with 20 trainers in them." Since almost all of the oldie releases are done from scratch using tape and disk originals, it's obviously not the same thing at all.
Still, if he'd like to "poke fun", how about a better version of, for example, Phobia deprotected from an original and with NTSC and bug fixes.
Oldies groups: These games have already been cracked years and years ago. The games have already been trained as well. The original crackers were often under extreme time constraints to put out these games, today you could take an entire week. Today the knowledge on protection schemes can be found online, trainers pre-exist in other versions, and emulators allow us to break into a ML monitor at anytime. Compare that to the old days where some games wouldn't allow you to use your cartridge. Crackers often could not spend much time on making more trainers. It's become easier to crack, not more difficult.
Yet people still insist on taking originals and putting them out with +20 trainers behind them. They've even taken to training "DEMO" games.
For some reason they are hailed for this act. Rather confusing when you consider these games have been available for two decades in unprotected form.
I'll change my argument then... I could go to SCS/TRSI download all of their originals and release 200 games cracked and trained.
It wouldn't change the fact these games are already out, and have been for 20 years in the same form as I'd be making them. The only difference is the number of trainers.
Is there really any purpose to take an original and crack it, when there are 10 different versions of it? I mean give it up already... you can't find new games so you live in the past.
And on that note... looking at the Urine version, I would hardly call removing the music a "Trainer". I also would hardly call skipping intros a "trainer". I .... must.... beat.... +9.... so I will turn off the music and skip intros. It's a sad sad sad world for many of you. Why not offer alternative character sets and call it a +23?
While it's more of a 'budget' or 'joke' label group, someone did come along and try to beat the +9. Sadly 8 of those trainers were just turning off the music/skipping intros which is *not* considered a trainer whatsoever. That makes it +13.
Do you see my point now? The depth some people will go to, to make better versions is a sad joke. When you have to put out a piece of shit that skips an intro, something you could do by pressing the spacebar, you're scraping the bottom of the barrel.
This is what the scene has been reduced to... cracking 20 year old games and releasing lower quality versions just to beat someone else.
Oh and lets not forget the included "docs" because Balloonacy was a game that was so difficult to comprehend :) Of course I heard Slarti was confused, but he is distracted by shiney objects too. *shrugs*
This thread may make me unpopular but you know what, face the facts. You're desperate for anything to release that you have to crack 20 year old games that nobody plays any more. Even fixes are no longer an issue with the advent of PAL/NTSC emulators.
My original post still stands as true as it was the day I posted it :-) I'm glad I come from an era where originals were truly originals and not 20 year old re-cracks.
Now I have to run. I hear that I am able to download Fort Apocalypse as an original and crack it in 30 seconds and make +30 trainers. Surely someone will need this better version after having played it to death since they were 15 years old. Laaaaaame.
Happy Holidays
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
"Is there really any purpose to take an original and crack it, when there are 10 different versions of it?"
Yes, there's several; to bugfix it when there's no 100% version that won't crash at some point, to make it work with other devices like CMD drives, REU or 1581, to activate features that were taken out but left in the code and no other crack has, to add highscore savers, to get a huge multi-side title down to a single disk side so it's easier to play.
People (as in gamers) want these versions in order to play them; there's no other reason needed to do them. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quote: atleast richard has the guts not to stay anonymous unlike that gangbangbus moron.
it's pathetic.
It's the scene, we all use handles.
Did you check the Urine version before commenting, by the way? It's actually better than any other version including Richard's, some actual work went into that. |
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
Wanderer, I think you need to loosen up a bit & stop taking it all so damn serious. If people enjoy spending their time cracking & making really good versions of old games just let them, if they want to make a +45 of a PD-game just let them. I mean, is it REALLY something to get so upset about? It's all about the fun in doing something you like. |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
Erm, seems someone has forgot why sceners have handles and why there is fake groups with members using fake handles compared to they're real ones.
The lack of scene knowledge such as this is what is compelling me to release my new magazine. Informing people or remind them (some either don't know or have forgotten).
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
Oldies groups: These games have already been cracked years and years ago. The games have already been trained as well.
That's not true !!! Many oldie groups trained games that in 20 years were never trained before. But at least the point is that your 200000 words replies are useless. I can only quote Zyron, it's for fun !!! Nothing more, nothing less ..... |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: Oldies groups: These games have already been cracked years and years ago. The games have already been trained as well.
That's not true !!! Many oldie groups trained games that in 20 years were never trained before. But at least the point is that your 200000 words replies are useless. I can only quote Zyron, it's for fun !!! Nothing more, nothing less .....
Now, at the right place ;)
And as I said earlier before, this is not only valid for oldies, but also for e.g. Afterburner USA (there is no crack as of yet that plays the intro tune on PAL at the correct speed!) (that is, because the cracking group forgot that on NTSC machines, the PAL tunes get slowed down by the player routine in the game as it was never meant to be for the PAL market).
Or Outrun Europa with the damaged tunes in the original. Check GTW64 for Outrun Europa v1 info, etc :)
So, there is a lot more than just re-releasing 20 years old games :)
About 20 years old games: Perfect example is Choplifter that didn't play right on PAL machines before |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Wanderer, I think you need to loosen up a bit & stop taking it all so damn serious. If people enjoy spending their time cracking & making really good versions of old games just let them, if they want to make a +45 of a PD-game just let them. I mean, is it REALLY something to get so upset about? It's all about the fun in doing something you like.
Ahh you are mistaken if you think I'm upset. I have no emotions regarding this, but I do have opinions, strong ones. And if there are too many words for you to read, use a Speak and Spell. We communicate through written words.
I agree it is "fun" to take old games and make them with double the trainers they once had. I tried this once and do you remember what happened? People became upset saying that these games had already been released with trainers. It's a challenge, but do we really need to release them?
Apparently there was some unwritten rule that I had to BEAT the existing version in the # of trainers. So it isn't all about having "fun", it's about having to make it better than someone elses version. I knew it would be a matter of time before some moron tried to top 9 trainers, and sure enough...
Taking a game like Balloonacy 2 and making 21 ridiculous and totally unnecessary options, proves that. I am sure I could offer a version with 10 charsets, expanded X/Y sprites, alternative in game music options, high score saver (with names). But there comes a point you have to look at the game and ask, "is this necessary?" Do we really need to turn off the music when we can simply lower the volume? Do we need to skip intros when you can just press space? I'm baffled at those who praise that release in the comments, like it was some magical mystery they performed. To think of someone NOPing out 3 bytes to cut the music, must take super powers given the praise being poured upon this release.
Even the 9 trainer version was amazingly simple and took no skill. It didn't receive a single vote.
Yet people stare in awe and hail those that make such pathetic releases and offer options that are just absurd. Yah I need to skip an intro, and yah I need the music turned off for me... give it up already. I could have made a +30 version : no enemy sprites, no music, no score, smaller sprites, no side border, blah blah blah but you have to give it up at some point and be realistic... trainers vs massacre a poor game into shreds.
This is just total desperation at bragging rights and that to me is not "fun", it's "gay". them 20 years after the fact.
If you want to take a game that wasn't cracked properly, do so. But taking a 100% working game, cracking it all over again and throwing 20 useless trainers on it so you can give yourself something to release is pathetic.
>if they want to make a +45 of a PD-game just let them. I >mean, is it REALLY something to get so upset about?
Get upset? No... laugh about it, yes because it's pathetic when release starved people jump on a Richard Bayliss release like a starved seagull that hasn't eaten for a week diving for a frenchfry in a parking lot.
There are a lot of desperate people out there and some sad excuses for groups. |
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Wigga
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 1 |
Who be dis lamah perpetrating to be da WANDERER of CANADA ?? Dis muthafucka be a fake azz foo !! Check dis peeps !! Wanderer and Richard doin sum bootytime up in here !! Damn faggot azz white boyz !!
Respect to da mighty muthafuckas in da URINE and da TROEP and da HEMA !! Word and shit auto5000g niggas !!
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Ouch! ;-) |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Ouch! ;-)
I concur. Ouch! ;-) |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
"There are a lot of desperate people out there"
For example, anyone who has to generate vast message board threads on their opinions when those opinions are based on misunderstood facts.
i'd guess the Urine version's trainers were a deliberate piss-take of your version (a crew called "Urine" that takes the piss...?) but they actually did improve on all the previous releases as well; 100% bugfixed (Richard has the source code and couldn't manage that in his version, so "ouch" indeed, how embarassing) and they went to the time and effort of cracking it from the tape image and probably cleaning the RAM out too since the two tape loader "intros" are in there but the file length is still shorter than some of the other versions. |
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
Well, Bangbus make great pornography and I think they should be applauded for taking some time to participate in the oldies cracking scene as well! |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
Bangbus rullar!
Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
ROTFLMAO!
It was all a ruse Wanderer, just to get this thread started so we could all have an uproarious laugh at the way everyone takes stuff WAY to serious! ROTFL!!! I am laughing so hard I almost pee'd myself! weeeeeeeeeeeeee!
as for the skip function in the eca linker... it's to skip a range of bytes. Most likely at the start of a file for games which only reside in high memory.
weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
you want crack instead of recrack? http://tapes.c64.no
there you go, give some cyberload a try!
weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
Bangbus rullar!
Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
ROTFLMAO!
It was all a ruse Wanderer, just to get this thread started so we could all have an uproarious laugh at the way everyone takes stuff WAY to serious! ROTFL!!! I am laughing so hard I almost pee'd myself! weeeeeeeeeeeeee!
as for the skip function in the eca linker... it's to skip a range of bytes. Most likely at the start of a file for games which only reside in high memory.
weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
you want crack instead of recrack? http://tapes.c64.no
there you go, give some cyberload a try!
weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!
I have no doubt it was a ruse coming from a group called Urine and members Bangbus and Rumpleforeskin :) It wasn't a serious release of course but it *was* a sign of what things have become. The Urine version came out after, not before, this thread began, therefore your claim it was a ruse to "start" is untrue. What it was, was proof of what I said would happen.
As you will recall the intent behind my 9+ version was for someone to try to beat it. I said my version was lame, and I believe that it was. I noticed the 2, 4, and 6 versions and I thought if I made a 9 version encapsulating most every trainable option, some idiot would try for a higher version.
It was only a matter of time, and I eagerly awaited to see what insane options would be added. Seeing things like turning off music and shrinking the sprite could only be summed up in one word: desperation.
Unlike many of the sceners today who have only been active in the last 5 or so years, I've been around since the day when 2 trainers covered all you needed. Nowadays people are adding high score savers to games that sucked back in the 1980's and still suck... and games that nobody will play.
One could argue it's all for fun... but it's pretty much wasting time trying to relive the old glory days with cracking games we've all had sitting on our dusty floppies. The high score saver will never be used, for nobody plays these games.
Naturally most people don't agree with me, and I accept that. It's just one of the things I see happening that show things have gone downhill and people are starved for something to put out.
You may be (somewhat exaggeratedly I may add) amused at my response, but keep in mind it was done with the intention of waiting for someone to try to beat 9 trainers and prove that this is what the scene has come down to. It's not about cracking, there's nothing to crack. It's about getting into piss wars over who can make a +40 version of Pac Man with high score saver.
I saw these games released back in 1984-90 and enjoyed a fresh new release. I enjoyed seeing a bug-fix come out later on. What I don't enjoy is seeing some group, 20 years after the fact, blow the dust off a cassette tape, crack it and decide that adding 20 trainers makes it something worthy of releasing under a label. These games are already out in the public domain, accept it and move on. Fun is fun but it's time to stop living in the past :)
Anyway I don't think I can really add anything else to this thread. I think the old-sceners can see where I'm coming from even if they don't necessarily say it.
======================
As for ECA, as I understand it the skip only allows for a 4 digit value not a range of values. So even if you have a game at high memory, LOW-MEM takes care of that. Enter in $c000 LOW-MEM for a game residing at $c000-cfff and you're done.
For a game at $5000-6000 and $e000-ffff you'd put $5000 LOW-MEM and for skip?? It only allows 4 digits. You couldn't put in $6000 because ECA doesn't know where to stop. There is no reason for beginning skip bytes because ECA conveniently fills memory with 0 bytes that is not used between data loaded into it. AFAIC there is still no real answer to what SKIP$ does. |
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
You're really living up to your name, Wankerer. |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
<Message ignored>
Did somebody say something? lol
_______
"And remember... Just say KNOW to drugs!"
Damian Caynes (stoner) - Mary Jane Flashbacks - Sept 1994
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
The skip function is to skip $d000 when linking files below & over $d000. |
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
Quote: <Message ignored>
Did somebody say something? lol
_______
"And remember... Just say KNOW to drugs!"
Damian Caynes (stoner) - Mary Jane Flashbacks - Sept 1994
Hey, would someone who tracks down old posts on Usenet be considered a fan, or some kind of freak stalker?
Either way, I'm flattered, Wankerer. Also, feel free to make me the focus of your insanity again, it must make you feel much better about being considered a pretentious froot loop by almost everyone else here.
BTW, you missed the best one, "Turn on, Tune in and Light Up!" |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3035 |
Wheew and I was afraid somebody will accuse me of hijacking of this thrhead. After all, this is not my show this time. |
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
Quote: Wheew and I was afraid somebody will accuse me of hijacking of this thrhead. After all, this is not my show this time.
Hey, you're hijacking this thread! ;) |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
You fail to understand Wanderer...
No one is desperate for anything to release, when a good release comes along, and they do, we release them.
We also release all the crap and fluff, and sometimes have a bit of good ole scene fun with it.
I also fail to see what some lamer label release which was done as a joke to begin with (haha, jokes on you!) has anything to do with cracking old games... that's a different topic, please keep it to another thread.
You also don't understand sarcasm aswell... why? why are you so damn serious about defending the old scene? what the hell? I don't get it... and seriously, neither do most of the folks ! Do you feel threatened? Well... don't, we're not erasing any scene history or anything... is that it?
lighten up already!
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: You fail to understand Wanderer...
No one is desperate for anything to release, when a good release comes along, and they do, we release them.
We also release all the crap and fluff, and sometimes have a bit of good ole scene fun with it.
I also fail to see what some lamer label release which was done as a joke to begin with (haha, jokes on you!) has anything to do with cracking old games... that's a different topic, please keep it to another thread.
You also don't understand sarcasm aswell... why? why are you so damn serious about defending the old scene? what the hell? I don't get it... and seriously, neither do most of the folks ! Do you feel threatened? Well... don't, we're not erasing any scene history or anything... is that it?
lighten up already!
>When a good release comes along, and they do, we release
>them. We also release all the crap and fluff
Exactly, thank you for being the one to say it.
You release all the "crap".
Games that the world played 20 years ago do not need to be re-released in the year 2005 just because you can find the original protected version. It simply makes no sense unless it is a bugfix. We don't need 20 additional trainers or a level packed copy.
>I also fail to see what some lamer label release which was
>done as a joke to begin with (haha, jokes on you!) has
>anything to do with cracking old games
The joke is on me? Apprently you have to go back and re-read what I said. I understood that Urine's release was a joke. I mean reading the scrolltext alone is proof enough, if nothing else. Yet it indicates what I've said all along. People are desperate for releases. That is what it has to do with cracking old games. I didn't think the c64 scene today would let my version rest, no, someone would feel the need to surpass that - and any other future TND release for that matter. It will never end.
In the old days once the game was released, you moved on to other new releases. Today that is the opposite, once you're done with an old piece of crap you go and find another old piece of crap.
You also seem to forget when I took Forbidden Forest and released that with a trainer, what happened? While it was "for fun" CSDB reacted with hostility. Why? It didn't beat the other versions in trainers. So in essence you have to top someone elses version - that doesn't sound like fun, it sounds like competing.
Let's put aside the bug fix issue. There's an original of Ghostbusters, Maniac Mansion and Cybernoid sitting in your closet. The world has seen these games, played them to death and really doesn't need one more version. It won't make any difference if you had a few more trainers, the novelty is long gone. Why bother? Sure it's fun but it's also the only thing you can release because there is no new software coming in. What else are you going to release? So people live in the past, rehashing and rebashing old old old software. Cripes, I've even seen Compute's Gazette games with intros on them, now THAT is sad.
>why are you so damn serious about defending the old scene?
>what the hell? I don't get it.
I'm not necessarily defending it. I'm comparing it. I'm speaking about the NEW scene. A world in which nothing comes out except old crap. And what new stuff does come out, is so picked through that you see 10 different versions of it in the first 24 hours because people are so desperate to find a release. That is why I feel so strong, I don't see any challenge or really any fun in releasing old (say 1985) shit. None. Why do groups exist to crack what was already cracked? Sounds like scavengers going over slim pickings to me :) I think this paragraph will be your best clue as to why I feel the way I do.
Lastly, no I don't feel threatened. Most of the software out today was not originally released by my groups. Even the games that were, were already played and viewed by the c64 population when it was at it's maximum peak. It's not about erasing history..
I can not explain it any other way or any other number of times. I see what the scene was, and I see what it is today. And really it is quite sad that it has come down to going over slim pickings and rehashing old games, giving self congratulatory pats on the back, and praising one another. Training is no challenge. So when I see all this old software being released I can't help but shake my head in disgust at what the c64 scene has become.
>lighten up already!
I may say the same for everybody else. It is but an opinion, a minority opinion. An opinion much disagreed with, but I've earned my spot in the c64 scene whether you like me or hate me and you should respect the opinion.
I respect those who continue to crack old games and put them out, but I think it's an act of desperation and futility.
On this subject I shall say no more.
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
You also seem to forget when I took Forbidden Forest and released that with a trainer, what happened? While it was "for fun" CSDB reacted with hostility. Why? It didn't beat the other versions in trainers. So in essence you have to top someone elses version - that doesn't sound like fun, it sounds like competing.
Ok, you consider oldie releasing is a waste of time, I totally don't agree but I "could" understand your point of view. But do you wanna know what is REALLY a waste of time ? Your version of forbidden forest. Fun or competition call it as ya want but the final goal is to try to improve even more an oldie, you didn't do that, so accept the critics..... |
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Tch
Account closed
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 512 |
@Wanderer: I understand your standing and mostly agree.
But C64 games are still being played,believe it or not.
Many people don´t like the nowadays games and enjoy playing ancient shit.
Hence I appreciate the good neo-cracks of today.
Many games have been bug-fixed or improved in some way.
This is to be complemented!!
Not reduced to lameness..
On Lemon64 there are many people searching for an old game.
Most of them,just ´oldtime´ gamers..
Don´t they deserve the best version they can get? |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
Wanderer:
again, your confusing oldie cracking with 1st releasing , please stop.
and BRAND NEW decent games come out from time to time, which NO one has played before, shouldn't there be a nice version of these games coming out? And they do, go check GTW, protovision (although nicer titles aren't out yet), TMR's fine games, COSMOS's nice games, etc... so...
Also, I am not picking a fight with you, just trying to set the record straight. Getting different issue's confused is also a bit off.
I repeat, there is NO desperation. There is NO competition, so no body gives a fuck all about the 1st release pressure of old times, better to make a proper version to begin with.
TCH: Absolutely agree, there is still thousands of c64 gamers, and they deserve to play 100% bugfixed versions which don't take years to load, or take up to many (getting hard to find+expensive!) disks, becuase alot of people are still using real hw, and not just emulators.
And thanks :)
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1057 |
The golden oldie cracks rule. Anyone who thinks that they are useless because some 14 year old did a rush job 20 years ago needs their head examined. Fungus, Zyron, GRG, and the rest of you, keep the perfect versions coming!
PS: How come no one's made the C128 version of Ultima V run on the C64, with music and all? ;)
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
This MagerValp dude made me cry of joy ;-) |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
So what about that Ultima IV version for the 1581, MV? ;-) |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: The golden oldie cracks rule. Anyone who thinks that they are useless because some 14 year old did a rush job 20 years ago needs their head examined. Fungus, Zyron, GRG, and the rest of you, keep the perfect versions coming!
PS: How come no one's made the C128 version of Ultima V run on the C64, with music and all? ;)
Here's a history lesson for those who don't understand why there was a need to fast crack:
In the old days, which some of you may or may not remember, when a crack was made it was done so with a need for speed.
I can remember many nights where there was a race to crack originals and get them uploaded to the American BBS's before a competing group did - not only was the US import group frantically waiting upon the overseas cracker but the cracker was frantically trying to crack it before another European did.
I will never understand to this day why things were done that way. I can't understand why you just didn't release YOUR version if it worked. I remember Boba Fette told me that we would only release our Ikari version *if* the Euro version that beat us, was bugged. In a normal world, you'd release your own version and let the people decide what version to use.. but in the c64 world only ONE version was allowed to be uploaded. Example: three Euro groups cracked Cybernoid II at the same time, if we got our version uploaded first then Zenith's US contact or BROS US contact would not upload their version and the poor Euro who had to rush his crack, would have to resort to slow mail trading to get their copy out.
So yah, buggy versions do exist and there is a reason for it. Should we fix these games? Absolutely.
But uhm I don't remember any bugs in BC's Quest for Tires, nor any bugs in about 80% of the re-cracked shit being put out. You cannot tell me that every release put out by oldies groups was originally bugged.
We justify it with remarks like "this one had 20 trainers, the original had 3", "this is IFFL packed, the original was 30 files" or "this has docs and a high score saver".
You know it's true.
But in a world where you can buy hard drives that are in the hundreds of GIGABYTES, I don't think trimming 500 bytes from a game or reducing it to one file is really any reason to re-release it 20 years after. There will always be excuses made as to why something was re-released. I support the bug-fixed versions but a quick check of 99% of these oldies releases shows nothing to justify a re-release other than boredom, lack of new software and a desire to release something.
I seriously doubt anyone plays the games that are put out, and a quick glance shows that many of these oldie labels who spend time on their +22HS versions, see only 5-6 downloads of their release.
Again, just one person's opinion. We can argue about it all day, all week, all year, but it won't change my opinion that these oldies groups release 99% shit and 1% necessary fixes.
(I'm not going to follow up to this because you know where I stand lol) |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
Ugh, I swear you just try to make us mad...
Want quality? try Defender of The Crown from nostalgia... beat it , I dare you, then, now, in the future. Good luck, as I doubt you can crack it, no group but ESI and US! ESI also left in the fatal crash bug, and removed parts to even fit it 2 (!!) sides. Ours is ONE side, and a good deal LESS than one side, 100% , sure there is trainers, why not...
I hereby challenge Wanderer, oh mighty scener of years past, to take his foot out of his mouth long enough to beat ANY single N0S crack , from release 100 on, in ANY way. Of course, this is a hollow challenge, becuase of course he is unable to do this, he lacks the skills and knowledge to do such things, and surely he would have to rush to get it out on time, buhauha.
The rules of the 1stie scene are quite simple, release a 100% working crack as 1st. Later on it was required to be ntsc fixed, level packed and trained in order to qualify as a 1stie, but hey in 1990 youd already packed your bags. So obvoiusly you wouldnt know that, I mean, history stops when Wanderer leaves the room.
Either put up, or shut up.
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Poor Fungus, you are delusional. This is not a cracking competition. First of all, BC's Quest for Tires doesn't need a fix. Fort Apocalypse did not need a fix. Ghostbusters did not need a fix.
Kikstart II did not need a fix, it worked 100%. Ghosts and Goblins was a 100% game already.
*cough* Gridrunner from all the way back in 1982 was a perfectly working game. 1984's Boulder Dash had no issues with it whatsoever. 720 was working fine.
Oh here's a good one, Popeye with 10 trainers *snarf*
Let's not forget 1984's Space Taxi which needed no fix at all and had a single sector error for protection (a simple removal of the jsr $ffcf:cmp #$30:jsr $ffcf:cmp #$32) but you had to go and one file it and train it too.
Dude, I totally understand the scene has changed and the focus has moved from first, fast releases to fixing games that were never working 100%. I am in agreement there.
* but *
Look at the above games, and look at Nostalgia's own web page. Many many many of those games do not require fixes, they don't even need trainers. But you had to go and take games that were almost 23 years old, crack the easiest protection in the world and train and release them.
Why?
This is where my argument comes into play. You can get into Defender of the Crown all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that you keep cracking and releasing SHIT, utter SHIT.
I mean Fort Apocalypse? GRIDRUNNER?!?!?!?!?!?! How in the world can you even dare justify re-releasing those? You should be humiliated.
Jeezus, I still have an original of Jumpman kicking around and I have an original of a game called P-Man's Revenge that nobody seems to have (not even Gamebase). However as these games are 20 years old, work fine on PAL and NTSC, and were already released I'm not going to re-crack and say "wow look at this, I added 10 trainers to this game... you gotta grab it"
Case in point: 22 people have downloaded BC's Quest for Tires (Hokutu Force) from 2003. That's not even one person a month.
Look, if you want to fix games and toot your horn about being on par with ESI, go ahead. But please stop releasing complete and utter shit like Space Taxi, Gridrunner, blah blah that works fine on both PAL and NTSC and that we don't need to see another version of.
There is no justification at all for most of the games I've seen from you. Oh my god... Sammy Lightfoot has seen one whole download. Maybe that has something to do with the fact it is so old I still hadn't hit puberty when it was first released. But no, you had to release it.
Just because you can crack, you can train, is not reason enough to put out shit like that. I can crack my fair share of games (nothing like Defender of the Crown) and I can train as well as the others, but I exercise what is called self restraint.
If you can't see my point after reading this message you must be related to Helen Keller.
I am baffled how so many people can sit and say this is acceptable to re-release 100% working games mixed in with real bug fixes. It's absurd. No wonder so many people left the scene when "oldies" groups put out crap like you have.
With over ** 2300 ** reads of this thread I have been asked to write about this for a well known disk mag. I don't see any point in hammering out the SAME opinions DAILY to those who cannot understand my opinion. So gather up your members of your oldie groups and validate one another's feelings. It should be in the next issue of this disk mag.
p.s. I'm not trying to make anyone mad. I don't own your feelings, you do. I just think the scene has scraped the bottom of the barrel when you put out Sammy and BC to name just a few. *shivers* |
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
22 ppl downloaded our BC version (and for the hell, we're HOKUTO not Hokutu), so ? We put the link also on Lemon forum and our site, surely will be more than 22, and in any way if only 22 ppl liked our version it's ok for me. Also I don't know how many other versions has the original loading picture, maybe it's doesn't mean nothing for you but means preservation for me. And instead stay here to waste time why don't you release that P-Man's Revenge game ? I'll be the first one to be happy to see your work.... |
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1057 |
Quote: So what about that Ultima IV version for the 1581, MV? ;-)
Yeah, I know, one day I'll get back to work on that... I'm really not a very good cracker, and the disks are in some kind of Apple II format with a translation table. I wrote a util to extract the files, but there are a bunch of crosslinks and some other weirdness...
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1057 |
Quote:
We justify it with remarks like "this one had 20 trainers, the original had 3", "this is IFFL packed, the original was 30 files" or "this has docs and a high score saver".
Yes, and what exactly is wrong with that? I like IFFL packs, 1581 compatibility, title screens, docs, and hiscore savers. If I want to play a game, I first go to Remember and Nostalgia's pages, since they have the best cracks around. Older releases are only worth checking if you can't find anything there.
Welcome to 2005 where quality counts, and not speed.
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11130 |
Oh dear. Another Ex-so called-Elite overestimating their overglorified Past. *rolls eyes* |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Oh dear. Another Ex-so called-Elite overestimating their overglorified Past. *rolls eyes*
You sir, are an absolute idiot. :)
"so called elite"? Thank you for the flattery and I'm happy you feel that way about me. Sadly, I have never EVER referred to myself as "elite". Sixteen year-old boys with modems were NEVER elite (contrary to Death Demon). Mother Theresa, she was elite. I know where I stood in the grand scale of things and it was a programmer on an 8 bit machine, nothing elite about that.
Also please explain how I am overestimating my "overglorified" past when I wasn't speaking about my past? I merely mentioned what it was like for groups in the 80's to operate. I was referring to the scene as a whole, not *my* past. It is a well known fact that ANY group would not re-release software. Perhaps there is some glory in that fact though, for we would never have seen so many shitty re-releases.
For you to say I'm overestimating my overglorified past, shows you are operating on damaged braincells. Are you mayhap ingesting copious amounts of magic mushrooms along with another member of this forum? Your cerebral functions are at a minimal capacity.
It's agreed mutually that cracking for quality is good. Any version less than 100% should be re-cracked and released because the original crackers were rushed.
I realize the game scene is dead and pouncing upon poor Richard's games to make 10 different versions is the only way to go these days. We also need more IFFL versions because most of us are operating with 50 or more gigs of disk space and it's important to shave off 10 blocks from a game. I began to see the decline in the scene when I saw people actually claim to "crack" games I included in my demos. From there, things have gone wayyyy downhill to 1982 game cracks.
It's unfortunate that people are now beginning to take things personally. To me it's all about opinions, not throwing temper tantrums (Fungus and Slarti). Are you people actually in your 30's??
They are just words... it's Christmas, lighten up, enjoy the season and RELAX. Go spend quality time with the family or something.
Peace! |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
The creators of arcade conversions like Airwolf, Ghosts'n'Goblins etc, THEY were Elite :P |
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
I suspect that not many people actually download their games from CSDB anyhow - so that "only 29 downloads" figure is quite unrealistic. At least, I just go straight to the FTP's or the NOS/REM/HF websites (and I get around 10x+ the downloads of almost everything in the database from outside it of my own non-warez stuff, too...) |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
2005-12-15 22:29
Wanderer (Satan)
"On this subject I shall say no more."
2005-12-18 04:20
Wanderer (Satan)
"(I'm not going to follow up to this because you know where I stand lol)"
Yet... the responses keep coming.
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
We had a dl counter on our webpage, in fact, sammy lightfoot is in the top 5 dl'd games, with over 500 dl's since the last reboot of the script. It has been dl'd over 2000 times in total from all the places it can be gotten, again you prove you just don't know what your talking about. weeee! :D
Not that I claim to be proud of cracking such an easy game. Most of the games I do, are requested, or I like the game myself and would like my own decent version to play.
Again, I ask what your problem is with this. You say you don't care, but here your respond everytime. Here you confuse the Issue of this thread with oldie cracking, and again you spurt your load all over the place with no intention of cleaning it up. You say were pathetic, when in fact, it is YOU who looks pathetic.
You don't respond to anything anyone says, you are constantly reminding us of your opinions. It's turned into a big game and laugh fest rather than any SERIOUS discussion.
The Scene does not revolve around csdb. Although it is a valuable and sometimes hillarious part of it. The scene does not revolve around Wanderer in the least bit, and it never did. At least you realize your lack of importance in the scene, we can all leave, and someone may or may not take our place.
But hey this is for fun, not for fame (on an 8 bit computer? get REAL!) Everyone takes things entirely too serious.
All opinions are like assholes, everyones got one, they are full of shit!!! :D
weeeeeeeeeee
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
Wanderer, I've made a handful of very short posts in response to your recent insanity, there's been no "temper tantrums" excepting your wacko cyberstalking antics.
It's clear your still obsessed with myself and Fungus since you first came back to the scene and lost it on the Driven forums.
The CSDb admins have been notified of your recent antics, I'd suggest you keep your obsessive compulsive attention seeking delusional persecution complex and the disturbing stalking that comes with it to yourself.
I hope Santa shits in your stocking, nutjob. |
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trippy
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 5 |
"well... I'd think it's fair to say that nutmeg is to be avoided at all costs... I ate 125g, it knocked me out
for 4 days and I had a plasticiney hangover for a week... i honestly thought i'd permenantly fucked myself up, not a good feeling i tell ya... "
Damian Caynes
(freako.749709849@suburbia)
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trippy
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 5 |
" I had a similar experience to the one you describe on my first shroom trip. It was a very sunny day, and i was in a park with five or six other tripping friends. I was in an extremely happy mood, tho i had one problem... Everyone was shrinking and growing (my trippin mind couldnt figure that they were just going off into the distance). I mean, picture a guy in a town park happily shouting to all who pass by "Hey, you're shrinkin! How dya do that?!?!"
Damian Caynes - chronic drug abuser
<freako.749607214@suburbia>
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
Yes, nice fake account Mike.
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CyberBrain
Administrator
Posts: 392 |
Ok, i've recently been contacted a few times about what's been written here. Maybe we could tune down the drug quotes and the "wankerer" name-callings allready? It doesn't really have any relevance to the topic at hand.
Also exprimenting with various hallucinogens is a nice journey into the spiritual and is what seperates the men from the sheep. :) |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Yes, nice fake account Mike.
Wigga
Pot - Kettle - Black (speaking of black, I do notice a few racist entries, but since you're a cool guy we won't dive into that)
Cyberbrain: I've already written to Perff regarding this matter. I blocked the one individual days ago. I just respond to the <message ignored> lol. I've no idea what is even being said.
I told Perff I would agree to tone it down as it is the Christmas season :) I don't take any of this seriously anyway. |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
haha... Wigga/AFROS is scene related... not sure about your "happysack" account... another one of those accounts you use to down vote people you dislike.
and any racist remarks - OMG! shit talk from a fake label!!
and this is your third or fourth replay after saying twice you wouldn't respond
BTW - All of the above is off-topic
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: haha... Wigga/AFROS is scene related... not sure about your "happysack" account... another one of those accounts you use to down vote people you dislike.
and any racist remarks - OMG! shit talk from a fake label!!
and this is your third or fourth replay after saying twice you wouldn't respond
BTW - All of the above is off-topic
Okay so let me just get this straight Jon. You are criticizing me for the use of a "fake" account when you admittedly use one yourself for a "fake" label.
Then you admit that you are "not sure" about my happysack account, yet claim it is "another one" of those accounts that I use to "downvote people". Please provide an ounce of proof that I ever voted anybody with a fake account, or even the happysack account. What's that? You can't?
I don't downvote people and my votes are public. We all know the voting system here is unfair.
Isn't it rather hypocritical to tell me in a roundabout way that it's wrong for me to have a fake name when you do? I used mine for a release, in the same way that you did.
Finally, what you consider "shit talk" from a "fake label" is really racism from you Jon. Allow me to quote your comments for Balloonacy 2 (which makes this on topic - Balloonacy 2 and idiocy combined)
"MUTHAFUCKA !! DIS IS DA BESTEST MUTHAFUCKIN VERSION EVAR FOO !! WASSUP TO DA PEEPS IN URINE !! DAMN NIGGA !!"
While I am capable of understanding it is a fake label and a fake user, and that it is a joke, repeat those last two words to any African American and they'd likely punch your lights out.
Oh I know it's just a "joke" right? Isn't that what the guy at the water cooler says in embarassment when a co-worker complains that he's racist? We can disguise it all we want but it's still a racist remark Jon.
Sad Jon, real sad.
In your own words, not mine, you're a hypocrite, a racist and you make unfounded claims. I think I've made my point and yes I will leave this thread now. Feel free to justify your racism - here is a shovel, begin digging. If you can back up these claims of downvoting, please send them to me via PM. |
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HMVDVA
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 20 |
A lot of words of mr. Wanderer but in the end he's clueless again.
First he tries to explain for himself (outloud, bothering us) what the crackingscene is all about.
Now he tries to be a moralist trying to accuse people of being racist without knowing about the use of the word 'nigga' in street slang.
Now please Wanderer...go fuck yourself!
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: A lot of words of mr. Wanderer but in the end he's clueless again.
First he tries to explain for himself (outloud, bothering us) what the crackingscene is all about.
Now he tries to be a moralist trying to accuse people of being racist without knowing about the use of the word 'nigga' in street slang.
Now please Wanderer...go fuck yourself!
There's this neat little thing known as a power button. You can use it when reading someone else's words becomes to painful for you. I don't force anybody to read my messages and in actual fact, there's an "ignore" button.
Quoted from Wikipedia:
"While proponents of the neorevisionist use of nigga contend they have "reclaimed" the word and robbed it of its racist connotations, critics dispute this. They claim such usage has not changed the word's centuries-old, racist nature. African Americans generally still consider the term offensive and inappropriate in most, if not all, contexts -- and never acceptable in any context when used by nonblacks"
I think the last ten words put it best. If you were African American you'd have a foot to stand on. As you resemble Chef Boyardee, you have no foot to stand on.
The overall Afros is just disrespectful to blacks and yet to tell me "fuck yourself". Apparently you are allowing my words to influence your emotions. What a power that is.
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HMVDVA
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 20 |
Quote:Apparently you are allowing my words to influence your emotions. What a power that is.
Don't flatter yourself.
I'm having a good time with you as the coding fool.
Please entertain us more oh mighty Googler.
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
Nope, majority of the black people I know wouldn't react in that fashion. In fact, those guys call me nigga and I've used the same slang talk back with them. I believe you're confusing nigga with nigger... which will get a nasty reaction everytime.
and since this thread is now hopelessly off-topic I'm done with it...
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Quote:Apparently you are allowing my words to influence your emotions. What a power that is.
Don't flatter yourself.
I'm having a good time with you as the coding fool.
Please entertain us more oh mighty Googler.
Please forgive my insubordination. My coding skills are far below you. You are the mighty "linker" of Jeffy and "cracker" of public domain game Balloonacy 2. *snicker* Scout
I see your quick backpedal of anger and sudden claim of "having a good time" and I raise you two guilders and call your bluff.
It seems a lot of people on here are driven to emotions over my mere words on a screen. *sigh*
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1568 |
Quote: Please forgive my insubordination. My coding skills are far below you. You are the mighty "linker" of Jeffy and "cracker" of public domain game Balloonacy 2. *snicker* Scout
I see your quick backpedal of anger and sudden claim of "having a good time" and I raise you two guilders and call your bluff.
It seems a lot of people on here are driven to emotions over my mere words on a screen. *sigh*
Hey!
Leave me out of this!
And btw, we have euro's nowadays.
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://forum.siliconlimited.com
Commodore 64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.blogspot.com/ |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Nope, majority of the black people I know wouldn't react in that fashion. In fact, those guys call me nigga and I've used the same slang talk back with them. I believe you're confusing nigga with nigger... which will get a nasty reaction everytime.
and since this thread is now hopelessly off-topic I'm done with it...
Oh I see. So because you have (so you say) friendships with African Americans who allow you to call them 'nigga' it is acceptable to use racist remarks. *rolls eyes*
In the context of walking up to an African American on the street and saying, "hey nigga, can you tell me where to park my car" you'd be slugged.
It's widely accepted that the term coming from a Caucasian is not acceptable. You chose wisely to abandon this topic.
Anger issues, racism and drug abuse... good God where is the love. This is the Christmas season.
I call a truce from now until the New Year even if nobody else abides by it. Beginning... now. |
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HMVDVA
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2005
Posts: 20 |
Yeah, let's grab a beer :) |
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Hahaha, unilateral truce from the #1 aggressor, brilliant. (and ask the peas where the love is...) |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
Of course, everything in his post, has nothing to do at all with this thread.
And he ignored me, when I presented him with facts. As usual.
Weeeeeee!
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
facts are for pussies. innuendo is the real ultimate power!
(on a related note - Facts:
1) Wanderer is a mammal
2) Wanderer trolls ALL the time
3) The purpose of wanderer is to flip out and troll people
:-p) |
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
Quote: Hahaha, unilateral truce from the #1 aggressor, brilliant. (and ask the peas where the love is...)
ask the peas where the love is :D Nice pun !!!! |
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Burglar
Registered: Dec 2004
Posts: 1033 |
Quote: Oh I see. So because you have (so you say) friendships with African Americans who allow you to call them 'nigga' it is acceptable to use racist remarks. *rolls eyes*
In the context of walking up to an African American on the street and saying, "hey nigga, can you tell me where to park my car" you'd be slugged.
It's widely accepted that the term coming from a Caucasian is not acceptable. You chose wisely to abandon this topic.
Anger issues, racism and drug abuse... good God where is the love. This is the Christmas season.
I call a truce from now until the New Year even if nobody else abides by it. Beginning... now.
hypocrit |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Since declared truce is in effect (I told Perff I'd let things cool off) I will respond only to two of the direct remarks to me in the best inflammatatory nature that I can.
FUNGUS
======
You said, "The scene does not revolve around Wanderer in the least bit, and it never did. At least you realize your lack of importance in the scene, we can all leave, and someone may or may not take our place."
I respond - The scene does not revolve around ANY ONE particular person whatsoever. We are all part of a larger picture, where the absence or addition of one person doesn't make or break it. The scene did not revolve around Mitch or JJ The Breaker (Joe), though he certainly contributed a lot to it - we would still have survived without them. None of us can say we were God's gift to the scene. And you know what, I never did say that I was.
I can look back though and say that my work was seen by hundreds of people on many releases from 1986 until 1991. That's six years. Sure some people have had a longer life span and some have had less. I know my place in the scene, and am very happy to have been active when it was at its peak. To have received enough letters from Europeans to fill a garbage bag (literally), made great friends, conferences, and dozens of cracking groups. I have NO regrets. Over 120 demos and my intros on over 200 releases. Not bad for a programmer with a dream, huh? :)
I see that you started around 2000, and by that time most of the groups were gone. The games have dried up and the only new releases (for the most part) are old releases. Those who once played games for the first time with excitement are gone or re-download them 15-20 years after.
I would not give up that era for this one, ever. The era will never again be repeated.
ps. Scott I blocked you because of your the "wheeeeee" childishness. When I see grown adults behaving in that manner, they get blocked. It's a personal choice.
BURGLAR:
=======
It is hypocrite, not hypocrit. And a hypocrite is someone who believes or says one thing and then does another. I don't do drugs and I am not racist.
Fortunately I'm leaving for Christmas holidays and won't be around after tonight. In the meanwhile if anyone still cannot handle the opinion of ONE person and you are driven by emotions to respond, go for it... vent and let it all out. I won't be back until the New Year so say what you'd like about me... or don't.... I particularly don't care. Opinions can't hurt people right?
Peace!
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Style
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 498 |
Ive seen your stuff Wanderer. Its 100% ghey.
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OEP
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 60 |
Not true! I'm with Wanderer on this one...
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5022 |
just a little quote from one of Wanderer's 200 demos: "This is my 3rd WPL demo in 2 days" |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
Well I will respond also in a non flaming nature then.
FYI. I started in the scene in 95. 5 years longer than you think. I too have made many friends, and been in many groups,
conference calls, bbs's etc...
JJ The Breaker, Joe, taught me to crack initially.
Sure you've done your share, so please stop bashing all the people trying to do their share then. It simply makes no sense at all.
Viva la c64.
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1568 |
More news that makes Wanderer happy:
http://tinyurl.com/dgk93
Yay! Case closed!
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://forum.siliconlimited.com
Commodore 64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.blogspot.com/ |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
i'm saying nothing...! |
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OEP
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 60 |
Hmm, I might have to move to Canada now...
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
Quote: More news that makes Wanderer happy:
http://tinyurl.com/dgk93
Yay! Case closed!
---
-= Silicon Ltd. =-
http://forum.siliconlimited.com
Commodore 64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.blogspot.com/
Hmm. Group sex, cannabis cafes, some of the best weed on the planet, AND the opportunity to meet the mighty Wanderer and kick him in the nuts? Maybe we should organise a global scene party in Canada! :D |
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Matt
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 592 |
yeah u aussies need to travel thousands of miles to score some decent cannabis.
poor slarti |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
Hmmm. There is some _really_ good weed already in OZ.
Matt, stop smoking and get back to work on Internal! ;) |
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Matt
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 592 |
you just caught me there jazzcat 8)
anyway, tell me where tha weed is cos I'm coming down under in a few months from now.
ohyeah, and that wasn't a joke btw :)
internal, that's another issue.
?
LOL
anyway, ur right. the only thing I'm good at nowadays is spamming forums 8)
as for the rest... ehm... u need to ask my girlfriend what I'm good at 8) |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
(sings)
My balls are bigger than your balls
weeeeeeeeeeeee
my balls are bigger than your balls
weeeeeeeeeeeee
my balls are bigger than your balls
weeeeeeeeeeeee
but my cock is kinda short
weeeeeeeeeeeee
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
<sings>
I'm ever upper class high society
God's gift to ballroom notoriety
I always fill my ballroom
The event is never small
The social pages say I've got
The biggest balls of all
CHORUS:
I've got big balls
I've got big balls
And they're such big balls
Dirty big balls
And he's got big balls
And she's got big balls
But we've got the biggest balls of them all
And my balls are always bouncing
My ballroom always full
And everybody cums and cums again
If your name is on the guest list
No one can take you higher
Everybody says I've got
Great balls of fire
CHORUS
Some balls are held for charity
And some for fancy dress
But when they're held for pleasure
They're the balls that I like best
My balls are always bouncing
To the left and to the right
It's my belief that my big balls
Should be held every night
CHORUS
And I'm just itching to tell you about them
Oh we had such wonderful fun
Seafood cocktail, crabs, crayfish...
Ball sucker |
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: (sings)
My balls are bigger than your balls
weeeeeeeeeeeee
my balls are bigger than your balls
weeeeeeeeeeeee
my balls are bigger than your balls
weeeeeeeeeeeee
but my cock is kinda short
weeeeeeeeeeeee
my balls... my balls my balls my balls... my lovely manly balls.... check 'em out. |
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1568 |
Suck on my chocolate salted balls.
Put em in your mouth, and suck em!
Suck on my chocolate salted balls,
there packed full of goodness, high on fiber.
Suck on my balls. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Hey, look! [Changing subject before hurts self laughing] There's a new ori of Balloonacy 2 with a bugfix!!1one |
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: Hey, look! [Changing subject before hurts self laughing] There's a new ori of Balloonacy 2 with a bugfix!!1one
I think I prefered the balls... |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quote: I think I prefered the balls...
Possibly, but i needed a rest from the laughing - i'm poorly okay?! =-) |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
Weee richard is a recracker now, weeeeeeee, and hooray for bangbus!!!
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Wile Coyote
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 643 |
c64 game coders are lazy these days. I kinda get the impression that they do some code, get a sprite moving via joystick and add some collision and do all the graphics themselves and call it a game or sorts. Instead of the game being written around a design, the game gets built around what ever code came about at the time while the coder was messing around in a spare 5 minutes he had. That's my take :) |
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Quote: Weee richard is a recracker now, weeeeeeee, and hooray for bangbus!!!
Nope :o)) |
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: c64 game coders are lazy these days. I kinda get the impression that they do some code, get a sprite moving via joystick and add some collision and do all the graphics themselves and call it a game or sorts. Instead of the game being written around a design, the game gets built around what ever code came about at the time while the coder was messing around in a spare 5 minutes he had. That's my take :)
The thing is, that has always been absolutely true in 90% of cases - beacuse building up a team is hard, and having all of the team pull their weight is also hard - even more so these days. |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
Alih: I agree.
Some people however can do it all themselves, and they do. Which is a nice thing... too bad I can't. I can only draw bad looking early 80's gfx and only play music on my guitar or bass... so :)
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Alih: I agree.
Some people however can do it all themselves, and they do. Which is a nice thing... too bad I can't. I can only draw bad looking early 80's gfx and only play music on my guitar or bass... so :)
It's like making a movie. One person directs, one writes the musical score, some act, some cut the film, others create props.
A programmer may be a jack of all trades (eg. Richard) or master of one and rely on other people. Myself, I cannot compose music and my graphics are self-admittedly awful but I try.
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Wile Coyote
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 643 |
Crossbow can code and create graphics to a high standard. God help the scene if the guy attempts music ;P |
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Wile Coyote
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 643 |
Mermaid too can do all 3, code, music and graphics. Graphics being the stronger aspect of the 3 |
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
Kjell Nordbo was an amazing 1-person-team, too bad he's no longer with us. |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
Rest In Peace Kjell!
Yes there is some one-man bands around. HCL is another.
Often these days the boundaries of group-productions are crossed. With musics and graphics and coders from mixed group-backgrounds participating in a single production.
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: Alih: I agree.
Some people however can do it all themselves, and they do. Which is a nice thing... too bad I can't. I can only draw bad looking early 80's gfx and only play music on my guitar or bass... so :)
This is true.... and actually, I conceptually love one-man-bands, since you can get a vision within them that is very difficult to achieve with multiple people - after all, no-one knows your artistic vision like yourself. |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1153 |
Quote: c64 game coders are lazy these days. I kinda get the impression that they do some code, get a sprite moving via joystick and add some collision and do all the graphics themselves and call it a game or sorts. Instead of the game being written around a design, the game gets built around what ever code came about at the time while the coder was messing around in a spare 5 minutes he had. That's my take :)
A design may not do much good on the C64 because it may easily become impossible to realize, or at least impossible to realize at 50Hz :)
Though I agree with you basically, some gamedevelopers could stretch their boundaries of comfortable coding a bit.. |
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Fungus
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 623 |
Speaking of game coding, I have noticed that alot of pal made games are not coded very well. All calculations are done in the bottom border, things tend not to be optimized very well, and the coders are still using the kernal irq routines (ea31).
And the worst is when they re-use old code, which wasn't that good to begin with...
Of course, I don't mind this kind of code THAT much becuase it makes it alot easyer to ntsc fix the game.
Just making some observations...
As for one man bands, TMR is a good one too :)
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
[Curtsey] ta very much, although i'm not a musician. =-)
Thing about games though, as long as the code is above a certain threshold (preferably as bug free as it can get) it doesn't really matter about how they're done, it's more about if they're fun to play. Cosmetic details can always be bolted in later, a spaceship shooting electric death at another spaceship can easily be a triangle, a circle and a cross respectively and it'll still be fun, adding shiny stuff just makes it easier on the eye. |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1153 |
If the multiplexer and rastersplits can tolerate it, using $ea31 ints can simplify integration of the loadersystem a lot (think especially IDE64, with its possibility of pseudo-IRQ-loading if you tolerate a possible delay of 1-2 lines) |
