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Forums > CSDb Entries > Release id #75871 : Timanthes 3.0 beta
2009-02-24 21:26

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 10408
Release id #75871 : Timanthes 3.0 beta

moved from here: Timanthes 3.0 Beta


Submitted by d0c [PM] on 19 February 2009thanks for the update but i am disappointed, why am i forced to install windows vista or net? why cant you make timanthes a standalone pixling appz that dont depend on other program to run?...

if not at least pickout the files that timanthes needed to run, and include them or make them available for download somewhere...


Submitted by Mirage [PM] on 19 February 2009We've done the 'it only runs on windows' rants, if you don't like it then don't use it.
This version needs windows 2000 or higher and dotnet 2.0, which you can download from microsoft


Submitted by Majikeyric [PM] on 19 February 2009@d0c: DotNet is very powerful for PC development nowadays.
Then why not using it ? Because there some "elitist" alternative Oses or mac users out there ?
As a professionnal sofware developer in DotNet, I wouldn't have any interest and time to loose in developing cross-tools for a non DotNet platform.
Sorry guys...


Submitted by Ninja [PM] on 19 February 2009Majikeyric: Could it be that maybe you have an "elitist" attitude? ;)

And Mirage is right...


Submitted by d0c [PM] on 19 February 2009@Majikeyric

if dotnet2.0 is so important then it should be included with the software and not prompt me with a message that more or less tell me to buy vista when i try run timanthes... what you like to develop with i dont care about, as long it works out of the box and i dont need to hunt down files from the net.


Submitted by Marauder/GSS [PM] on 19 February 2009.NET 2.0 is also/already included in windows XP for example and no need to buy vista!
if not you may don't have actual service packs/updates have you?


Submitted by Stainless Steel [PM] on 19 February 2009You dont have (atleast) .NET 2.0 installed ? have you been living under a rock the past few years ? You do realize this is a windows app ?


Submitted by d0c [PM] on 20 February 2009i have no program that use dotnetfx2.0, only timanthes. so you see its an app that i have never used becouse i have no program that need it.

i have installed dotnetfx2.0 now but still it will not run...

i think i just give up this one and just try ProjectOne 0.5, at least it dont depend on dotnetfx2.0 to run.


Submitted by Jammer [PM] on 20 February 2009calm down, boys ;)


Submitted by Majikeyric [PM] on 20 February 2009@Ninja : Erm, probably... :P


Submitted by DeeKay [PM] on 20 February 2009Jetboy, Majkrevic: I'd say "don't piss me off with your requests for ports for other platforms" is quite the elitist attitude, coming from Windows-Users who have the choice of about 10 Bazillion c64 tools, but maybe that's just me...
It's too late now for Timanthes unfortunately, like so often, but there's a lesson to be learned, kids: Don't be a victim in the vendor-lock-in game, don't let them make you their pawn in cementing their own monopolies! Use portable frameworks, languages and tools!


Submitted by Sander [PM] on 20 February 2009Great update Lars!

@DeeKay, d0c, first - a moist yawn in your faces,... have your platform non-discussion here : Mac, Win, Linux etc.


Submitted by DeeKay [PM] on 21 February 2009Jammer: Yes, tried it with Mono, no beef. .NET crossplattform my ass, Java-Alternative, what a joke, Shut the fuck up, de Icaza! .NET is as much of a pain in the ass as all the other proprietary M$-technologies.. However, Mirage said on X he'd look into making it Mono-compatible, whatever happened to that? 8)

Sander: Sorry, but only with constant repetition people will realize it's a bad idea to use proprietary shit for programs that should be for everyboydy, I've seen it happen time and time again. And if we bitch and moan in every thread with a windows-only program, maybe the next person to make a c64 tool will finally choose something portable? <:-)
That is actually not a theory but a reality, I am seeing this right now with Bitbreaker's converter, which is cross-plattform! ;-D We've got it running under Linux, MacOS X and Windows, and I even bet compiling it under BSD, QNX or BeOS shouldn't be a problem either!

All that notwithstanding: Yay for Timanthes, if it gets Carrion and Mirage himself to pixel again, fucking A! 8) I just wanna use it myself, and sorry for not being willing to let myself be forced to use a certain OS for it that i simply reject...


Submitted by Hein [PM] on 21 February 2009No need to hijack this entry with your everlasting crusade. Create some cool graphics instead.


Submitted by Stainless Steel [PM] on 21 February 2009\o/ for Mirage.
\o/ for .NET (im serious, i'm a .net developer myself)
\o/ for VisualStudio (awesome IDE)

PS : What Hein said.


Submitted by Style [PM] on 22 February 2009Id like to use this, but windows only? sorry, its 2009......


Submitted by Medicus [PM] on 22 February 2009I don't get the discussion. A tool like Timanthes screams for .net. It's not just some converter or whatever with text-output. Would you guys have prefered 20% of what is Timathes but cross-plattform?


Submitted by assiduous [PM] on 22 February 2009how about a nice cup of wine


Submitted by Style [PM] on 22 February 2009assiduous: wine is a stopgap at best. Even when the apps run, they still have the feel of windows apps.

medicus: you think rich GUI apps can only be achieved on MS technology? Whatever you're smoking, Ill have some thanks :)


Submitted by DeeKay [PM] on 22 February 2009assiduous: how bout a nice cup of "fuck x86", Mr. Smartass? 8)

Hein: Guess what? I'm just doing that - using crossplattform tools! 8)
Wish I could use Timanthes, too, but well...

To get this discussion somewhere: Mono is supposed to be the crossplattform solution for .NET apps. In fact I was able to make the .NET tool TSremux runnable in Mono on OSX/Linux by simply changing a few hardcoded backslashes (I use it to make .m2ts for my PS3 or to demux elementary streams from .m2ts!) - With GUI and all! Feels a bit alien, like X-Apps, but it works, which is good!
Mono 2.0 even supports Windows Forms now, so it *should* be possible to make Timanthes work with it. So if Mirage wants to give this a try, I'll volunteer for testing it in Linux and OS X! 8)


Submitted by Groepaz [PM] on 22 February 2009like sander suggested, please take your crossplatform wineing (pun intended) elsewhere. for example here: Mac, Win, Linux etc.


Submitted by DeeKay [PM] on 23 February 2009gpz: I don't see why I should take a discussion on making Timanthes Mono-compatible to a forum titled "Mac, Win, Linux etc." (great, could it be any more generic? <:-) that was originally a discussion on Oxidy's pixeltool...

... 12 posts hidden. Click here to view all posts....
2011-05-22 14:38

Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 807
Thanks to Lars for sending me a new .reg file that fixed my bug!
2012-07-29 20:20

Registered: Feb 2009
Posts: 303
anyone having problems running Timanthes on VMware (under Mac Os X Lion/Mnt Lion).
The problem is that the pointer (arrow and all the others except brush size circles) disappear when entering Timanthes window.
VMware Fusion v 4.1.3....

any ideas?
2012-07-29 20:42
Account closed

Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 211
It has problems running un windows let alone vmware.. ;) just use photoshop and p1 to import and repixel.. ;)
2022-07-18 09:30
The Sarge

Registered: Aug 2002
Posts: 23
Looking to maybe finally switch from Pixcen to something else and had a look at this. Mostly need to switch because the lack of layer support and proper animation tools in Pixcen.

Thimanthes shows good promise but I would love to see some updates.

- UI needs some overhaul. The pointer is too small on my 2560x1440 screen. The rest of the UI needs to scale up a bit too since for an example the color palette is way too small.

- Able to zoom/pan with the mouse scroll wheel.

- Scale the preview window in any size you like.

- Grid should be white transparent so you see it when on black.

- Dark UI.

- More animation support with onion skinning. A bit like the frame buffers in Pixcen where you just animate the whole canvas which you can set any size you want.

- Animation add, delete or rearrange frames. Play speed and loop and ping pong options.

- Export the animations as bitmap/sprite sheets.

And finally, thanks for a great pixel tool!
2022-07-18 15:29

Registered: Feb 2009
Posts: 303
Timanthes is still my tool of choice and I got used to live with it's ... issues, but
All in all I think you made some good points there The Sarge. I get used to Timanthes that I don't really see it's weaknesses anymore ;)

But... in my opinion to what you ask maybe the Pro-Motion from Cosmigo may be the solution.
- First of all it supports C64 modes (multi + hires)
- It has Layers, and you can combine external project files into layers
- it has onion skins
- it has tileset support
- I'm not 100% sure about spritesheets but I bet it has it too
- dark UI
- ping pong anim play too ;)
+ it has great palette management tools
+ so many more other tools.

it only downside IMO It's not free (not too expensive though). and again I get used to Timanthes' PAL blending preview so much that I do all my fullscreen pics with this tool.

I've heard (and kind of seen ;) ) Mirage may have something cooking in his kitchen that smell's like a new version of Timanthes.... If we ask him nicely maybe he will release it ;) soon-ish

So Mirage? Pretty please ... Give us new version of Timanthes.

oh and you can pan with space and zoom with CTRL + wheel
2022-07-18 16:35
The Sarge

Registered: Aug 2002
Posts: 23
Yes I've tried ProMotion NG several times. It sure has alot of good stuff but the UI and all the icons are a mess (sorry) and its so hard to figure out what they all mean. Some things like setting up a new project and palette is a bit confusing too and I still havent figured it out properly.

Animation tools are rather good. I used it for some anims for Trapped Again just to try the program, and I liked it. It can export sheets of animations and it saves ALOT of time.

One major thing though, is that it does not have real time color clash management from what I have seen. I dont want to have to go into check mode and correct stuff because that will only make the pixeling process much slower. I need it to work like it worked back in the days with spill over etc, that is handled very good in Pixcen.

About the CONTROL+mouse thing in Thimantes, thanks, I will try!

Mirage having a new version sounds very intresting. Lets hope for the best!
2022-07-18 16:52

Registered: Feb 2009
Posts: 303
You are right. The many options of ProMotion may be overwhelming and not so obvious at the beginning. Actually I always have this re-learn stage every time I start using it again. And ... you are right with the color clashes. You have to use CTRL+G to see if there are any errors. The way Timanthes solves this is perfect IMO.
It still has some use cases though, but Timanthes rules - no matter what :)
2022-07-22 14:47

Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 172
For animations I prefer Aseprite to Promotion. It still has a few oddities, but comes with a far more stripped down interface that I find much easier to work with.

You may hit similar walls for more complicated work though.

There are tools to highlight colour limitations (https://github.com/Viza74/c64helperscriptsforaseprite), but as with Promotion you have to click "check" each time, which I agree is really difficult to work with (and is why I use Pixcen where possible).

Also, whilst it has layer support, you can't mix pixel aspect ratios between layers, so it wouldn't be suitable if you wanted to use any kind of hires overlay.

I don't think there is a one-size-fits-all editor unfortunately. If I had the time I'd love to write my own. Unfortunately I really don't have the time.
2022-07-22 17:21

Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 1589
What about grafx2? Perhaps it can't compete with the alternatives already mentioned, but at least I think it has support for animation and layers, and some sort of support for C64 constraints as well.
2022-07-23 17:27
The Sarge

Registered: Aug 2002
Posts: 23
GrafX2. Wierd UI from the Deluxe Paint days.

Would love to design the UI and features for a pixel app to rule them all. :)
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