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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5032 |
History Fakers
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,126692-page,14-c,systems/arti..
c64 not even on the top 25 pcs of all time while trash like trs80 is on it.
appleII is the number one pc while pet was released earlier.
great.
thanks apple. I bloody hate you. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Five colours in most char modes and you can push that around a little bit if you use the sprites to underlay stuff Oswald, that's part of what makes the Atari hardware interesting... some of the recent stuff has done things that nobody realised were do-able and there's a nice looking platformer on the way as well...
It's a shame the Atari didn't get a large scene though, it could've done so much more like Bordeaux says - i reckon there's loads of stuff a really hot coder could come up with. |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
Oh well, Atari people always have the problem that they can't understand why C64 ruled and Atari XL did not. Usually they have crappy explanations like "Atari's marketing was lame" or "C64 was supported by companys and Atari was not".
Only lame excuses for the simple facts: C64 can display nicer graphics and have better music combined with far nicer sprites. If you look at Turrican you have a perfect example of this: That game has music the Atari could never do, combined with background graphics the Atari could never do in addition with dozens of big sprites the Atari could never do. It's as simple as that: For typical 80's games, the C64 is just much much better (despite the fact that the Atari "wins" on the specifications, i.e. more colors, more MHz and more sound voices).
The Atari was better in other departments: It had a faster CPU which helped on 3D games, but sadly 3D was never a realm were ANY 8 bit computer was good at, so this is nothing of a competition really. Only very few nice 3D games on 8 bit computers come to my mind... |
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1568 |
From the Introduction-pages of On the Edge - The Spectacular Rise & Fall of Commodore (http://www.commodorebook.com):
The history of early computers has tended to focus on Microsoft, IBM and Apple, snubbing contributions made by Commodore. "There is a lot of revisionism going on and I don't think it's fair," says Commodore 64 designer Robert Yannes. "People wanted to ignore Commodore."
An early-popularized story of the microcomputer revolution was Accidental Empires, by Robert X. Cringely (born Mark Stephens). The former Apple employee perpetuated a select view of the microcomputer revolution, a view that not everyone accepts as accurate.
...
PBS adapted Cringley's book as a popular TV series, Triumph of the Nerds (1996). The adaptation ignored Commodore completely.
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When writers are not ignoring Commodore, they often get their facts wrong. In The Silicon Boys and their Valley of Dreams, David Kaplan descibes the Apple IPO in 1980 and then adds, "But Apple soon bred competition. Radio Shack and Commodore and even Atari, among others, started selling their own personal computers."
In truth, Commodore and Radio Shack began selling personal computers in 1977, and Atari followed in 1979.
---
8Bit Mayhem - The C64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.untergrund.net |
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Tim
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 467 |
@tmr
Recent stuff for Atari? Now that would be interesting to see.. any clue where to find that?
@graham
Oh yeah.. 3d games on 8bit.. :(
Stunt Car Racer does come to mind (http://c64s.com/game/1059/stunt_car_racer/) but I still remember the laughter of my amiga pals back in those days ringing in my head.. hehe.. I guess that was a decent attempt by Micropose at least. (Did it ever sell well on the c64?)
@scout
Actually been thinking of buying that book.. Have you by any chance read it? By reading the bits on their website I find it so hard to judge if it would be a good read or a disappointment for the $$$ it costs.
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5032 |
Bordeaux, if you're interested in commodore's history that book is THE BOOK. The writer has interviewed ppl like Chuck Peddle, Bob Yannes, Leonard Tramiel, and the list goes on and on, it is based on an extreme amount of research, and its a very good read. I have bought it on BP06, have read 1/3 of it before getting home, and I've finished the rest in one go :) |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Bordeaux: probably the best bet is Atari Age, although the really interesting stuff seems to come out of the Polish part of the Atari scene so only gets reported in passing. www.atariage.com
i gave the Atari a few little... erm, shoves with the port of my own game Reaxion; eight colours a scanline for example... that's on the Cosine site. |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
@Bordeaux:
There are only few examples of "good" 3D on 8 bits. Elite and Mercenary come to mind. And games like Driller, but those are so slow that it does not matter if the CPU is twice as fast or not, the game stays slow.
When it comes to games where the A8 shows things the C64 cannot do as nice, mostly the early Lucasfilm games come to mind. Ballblazer, Rescue on Fractalus, Koronis Rift and The Eidolon are much better on the Atari XL than on C64. The 3D is more fluid because the XL has a faster CPU and hardware 2x2/4x1 pixel modes, and Koronis Rift also looks much nicer due to a Z-shading with 16 colors instead of just 4 like on C64. Oh and ofcourse pure CPU games like Mercenary are slightly more smooth on A8. Elite however does not exist for that platform...
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Tim
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 467 |
@oswald
Ok great thanks.. sounds like a nice xmas goodie Ill buy for myself then ;)
@tmr
Thanks for the url. Any suggestions on which emulator and which wares to check out?
@graham
Cool.. interesting.. something to check out, thanks.
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Best emu is Atari 800Win Plus (version 4) but at the moment i'm a little out of touch for wares; Flowers Mania was pretty cool, some amazing footage (but sadly not code right now) of the ongoing Space Harrier port, i'll plug my own game Reaxion because i'm still pretty proud of what i did there and i've totally forgotten the name of the nearly complete platformer that's been previewed recently and looks very nice but it's on Atari Age! =-) Numen is probably one of the best demos going, although it needs a RAM expansion on most models of Atari (i have the emu set up as a Rambo expansion-equipped machine as default).
numen.scene.pl points to the demo and the Atari 800Win as well as explaining how to turn on the RAM expansion. |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
Sadly most recent demos for A8 only work with a 320 KB RAM expansion. It's the typical "small scene"-behaviour: They use weirdo extra hardware to make the small scene even smaller by excluding people with standard hardware. It was the same with the +4 scene in the 90's. I hate that. |
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