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Forums > C64 Composing > Vice or CCS64
2009-05-13 09:56
Fredrik
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2009
Posts: 204
Vice or CCS64

Witch of them two programs do you use, if you want to play demos on you pc?
I have tried them both and the sound is more accurate in Vice than in CCS64.
Do you think the same?
Do Vice have another "sidgenerator" that the CCS64?

(And of couse, the real 64 is the best way to look at demos)


 
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2009-05-13 19:08
Kickback

Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 97
I actually use both. I use VICE for timing fixes due to the timing seems alot more accurate then ccs64. Which is close to the end product.

I use CCS64 during the project because the monitor is basically the same monitor I used on the real c64 back in the day and I am comfortable with that.

Unlike the one in vice which I think sucks because to many key strokes to view stuff. I can tell the person who wrote that monitor came over from the PC (debug) because the monitor works and looks closely alike.

But they both have their strengths and weaknesses but in the end I think it boils down to how you programmed on c64 and what tools you used.
2009-05-13 20:09
Inge

Registered: Nov 2003
Posts: 144
Quote: Vice has a built-in monitor as well of course. What do you mean by that?

My vote goes to Vice. But I respect CCS64 and HoXS64 as well.

There also other emulators like Frodo which is suitable for weak console platforms.

Don't forget nocash (no$c64) emulator/debugger. It has a very basic emulation module but an advanced debugger.


The monitor in Vice sucks, that's the problem. But that doesn't mean I don't use Vice at all.
2009-05-14 05:08
JackAsser

Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 2014
The monitor in VICE works fine, better than most, except for a few bugs.
2009-05-14 07:22
Scout

Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1570
Quote: The monitor in Vice sucks, that's the problem. But that doesn't mean I don't use Vice at all.

Well, that's what I thought a few months ago too.
But after debugging some stuff (soon available in your local C64 warez store ;) I found out that the Vice monitor is quite powerful.
I mean, breakpoints, backtracing... we should have those tools years ago :)
2009-05-14 07:40
SIDWAVE
Account closed

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238
Quote: Well, that's what I thought a few months ago too.
But after debugging some stuff (soon available in your local C64 warez store ;) I found out that the Vice monitor is quite powerful.
I mean, breakpoints, backtracing... we should have those tools years ago :)


We had, since 1993: A64 emulator on Amiga
2009-05-14 08:10
Skate

Registered: Jul 2003
Posts: 494
I'm comfortable with both monitors (standart C64 and Vice). But Vice's monitor is more powerful. It's great for debugging like Scout said and also very nice to work between a d64 image and other medias (like hdd, cd, dvd etc.).

Here goes the *best* feature for me. You can debug 1541 (or other) drives using Vice's monitor! Which is impossible (afaik) on the real thing and I'm not sure if other emulators allow this. So, you can debug everything including drive code using Vice. Setting a breakpoint on the drive code was a dream 10+ years ago.

If you say "we never needed this before, we are happy with the old monitors" that's fine. There is nothing wrong with that. We all code for our pleasure. :)
2009-05-14 08:25
Oswald

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094
the thing is that AR style monitor is more friendly than Vice's command line based one. It's more comfortable just to go with the cursor over the commands / bytes / text and simply overwrite them + return, than having to type in stupid commands to do that. the debug features are nice, but still the interface to change bytes/codes is less userfriendly than AR.
2009-05-14 08:28
Scout

Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1570
Quote:
but still the interface to change bytes/codes is less userfriendly than AR


True dat.
To be honest, that's the only thing I really miss in ViceMon.
2009-05-14 08:30
Oswald

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094
add the more userfriendly command parser of AR too. fex. VICE wont let you type stuff like "T100020003000"... I bloody hate I cant write that. AR was so clever, spared you any unnecessary typing.
2009-05-14 08:39
Scout

Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1570
Quote: add the more userfriendly command parser of AR too. fex. VICE wont let you type stuff like "T100020003000"... I bloody hate I cant write that. AR was so clever, spared you any unnecessary typing.

Yep.
And it's case/space sensitive too: for instance, D1000 and d1000 won't work. Only d 1000 works.
Very irritating.

But besides those tiny annoyances, ViceMon is still a very powerful tool.
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