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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5086 |
History Fakers
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,126692-page,14-c,systems/arti..
c64 not even on the top 25 pcs of all time while trash like trs80 is on it.
appleII is the number one pc while pet was released earlier.
great.
thanks apple. I bloody hate you. |
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Style
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 498 |
Quote: A simpler test would have been to ask plenty of older generations how many had first used a C64. With its good sales for a long period it is a significant part of comuting history. Some people in various IT industries built a name for themselves with C64 from Xample, JT, Rob Hubbard, Charles Deenen, and there could be a massive list. It was the 8 bit computer used for games through to productivity. Even Linus Torvalds has mentioned it in interviews.
errr, that was a VIC-20 (his grandfather's), but point taken :D
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5086 |
Bordeaux, here in hungary c64's were used for everything back in the day :) fathers brought c64s from the company to home for weekends to have the kids a good play :)
btw some dumbass atari dude from the forum of pcworld:
"C64 has the same architecture as Atari computers, even like some enginners said, there is reverse engineering in some aspects. The list includes the first computer in the serie of innovation." |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
The Atari fan is wrong of course, nobody at Commodore said they'd gone as far as actually reverse engineering the Atari although they happily admitted to looking at all of the would-be competition and nicking the bits they liked for the C64. A lot of what is seen as borrowed from the 800 actually wasn't, since a couple of the more obvious influences on the C64 are the Apple ][ (graphics modes) and Commodore's own PET (text based screen) and both of these predate the Atari 800. This kind of borrowing was commonplace and [i]everybody[/i] was doing the same at that time; Atari were no more innocent of it than the others and it can and has been argued that the 800's graphics modes are similar to those of the Apple ][ and PET as well.
At Bordeaux: The gaming history really shouldn't make a difference, the Atari 800 was pitched pretty much purely at the gaming market to the point of Atari discouraging business software development whilst the C64 was originally pushed as a business machine in the same way the Amiga 1000 would later be - C.B.M. was, after all, Commodore Business Machines. |
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Ed
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 173 |
Hmmm
http://www.4to40.com/recordbook/index.asp?category=&counter=190 |
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Tim
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 467 |
@oswald
here in holland, especially around Eindhoven where I grew up, things were quite Philips dominated. So a lot of P2000 machines or the G7000 as a games machine and later the msx. Both gaming consoles were a lot of fun for gaming but eventually I fell in love with the c64 due to these cool pirates messages game broken by
:)
@tmr
Hmm.. im actually always wondered what would have happened to the quality of Atari software if there had been a huge scene like the c64 had. Quite sure that the hardware/software was never fully optimized on most of their systems simply because of not enough people inventing new routines, modes, etc.
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5086 |
atari hardware was too weak for good games, atleast in the usual eighties 2d platform/walkaround department. sprites were unusable, and gfxmodes cant use more colors than 4 in reasonable resolutions. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Five colours in most char modes and you can push that around a little bit if you use the sprites to underlay stuff Oswald, that's part of what makes the Atari hardware interesting... some of the recent stuff has done things that nobody realised were do-able and there's a nice looking platformer on the way as well...
It's a shame the Atari didn't get a large scene though, it could've done so much more like Bordeaux says - i reckon there's loads of stuff a really hot coder could come up with. |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
Oh well, Atari people always have the problem that they can't understand why C64 ruled and Atari XL did not. Usually they have crappy explanations like "Atari's marketing was lame" or "C64 was supported by companys and Atari was not".
Only lame excuses for the simple facts: C64 can display nicer graphics and have better music combined with far nicer sprites. If you look at Turrican you have a perfect example of this: That game has music the Atari could never do, combined with background graphics the Atari could never do in addition with dozens of big sprites the Atari could never do. It's as simple as that: For typical 80's games, the C64 is just much much better (despite the fact that the Atari "wins" on the specifications, i.e. more colors, more MHz and more sound voices).
The Atari was better in other departments: It had a faster CPU which helped on 3D games, but sadly 3D was never a realm were ANY 8 bit computer was good at, so this is nothing of a competition really. Only very few nice 3D games on 8 bit computers come to my mind... |
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1570 |
From the Introduction-pages of On the Edge - The Spectacular Rise & Fall of Commodore (http://www.commodorebook.com):
The history of early computers has tended to focus on Microsoft, IBM and Apple, snubbing contributions made by Commodore. "There is a lot of revisionism going on and I don't think it's fair," says Commodore 64 designer Robert Yannes. "People wanted to ignore Commodore."
An early-popularized story of the microcomputer revolution was Accidental Empires, by Robert X. Cringely (born Mark Stephens). The former Apple employee perpetuated a select view of the microcomputer revolution, a view that not everyone accepts as accurate.
...
PBS adapted Cringley's book as a popular TV series, Triumph of the Nerds (1996). The adaptation ignored Commodore completely.
...
When writers are not ignoring Commodore, they often get their facts wrong. In The Silicon Boys and their Valley of Dreams, David Kaplan descibes the Apple IPO in 1980 and then adds, "But Apple soon bred competition. Radio Shack and Commodore and even Atari, among others, started selling their own personal computers."
In truth, Commodore and Radio Shack began selling personal computers in 1977, and Atari followed in 1979.
---
8Bit Mayhem - The C64 Scenemusic Podcast
http://8bitmayhem.untergrund.net |
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Tim
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 467 |
@tmr
Recent stuff for Atari? Now that would be interesting to see.. any clue where to find that?
@graham
Oh yeah.. 3d games on 8bit.. :(
Stunt Car Racer does come to mind (http://c64s.com/game/1059/stunt_car_racer/) but I still remember the laughter of my amiga pals back in those days ringing in my head.. hehe.. I guess that was a decent attempt by Micropose at least. (Did it ever sell well on the c64?)
@scout
Actually been thinking of buying that book.. Have you by any chance read it? By reading the bits on their website I find it so hard to judge if it would be a good read or a disappointment for the $$$ it costs.
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