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2004-01-03 01:05

Secret Man / The real Elite
Account closed

Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 137

Looking for Pictures of the Fat Count Zero !

I have some time and i decided to make a book with ugly people.So take a look in your collections and send fat Pictures of Count Kilo to me.

Thanx in advance

Secret Man

... 322 posts hidden. Click here to view all posts....

2004-01-14 02:20

CreaMD

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3036

Quote: Stop. I hope that you are talking globally here. I haven't said that Radar is incompetant. For me his competance is out of question. I said that I can follow your views and opinions. And maybe out of your direction they look right. But see it out of Radar position and it surely has nothing to do with narcissm. I am very sure that he has a professional arrogance, which is nothing wrong in my opinion as he actually knows what he was and INFACT IS DOING. Radar has only one attitude against newskoolers and thats something I always criticize myself too. Back in time people had to do things with much lower possibilities as today. Many people of today forget this and criticize old items, instead of just taking it as a good work in its own manner. I guess there is a difference between using a highly advanced tool instead of trying to have your own tools to do something. So reduce the outstunning work of several GOLDEN cracking lables to a good version, but remind yourself that they are using tools and advanced techniques based on the evolution produced by old people. So where is the point you will be asking. It is as you said.. Scene is like a wall .. Every brick builds upon another brick. So at that point there is no place for saying "Look.. I have outstunned that old Radwar version of XYZ".. Because you cracked it from disk with your cart, packed it with some cross packing tools and Radwar did it with bare hands. And sure it appears to some of you that disliking oldie cracks is the ignorance of the eternally of yesterday. But what is so hard to accept that some people still follow their codex from the past? After all this isn't so bad as you may have described it.. Because the real evolution of all other scenes following the CBM 64 was driven by C64 people with that codex. So it can't be so wrong after all.

Of course you haven't said Radar is incompetent, you have said that he doesn't need to know anything about C64 anymore beacause he has had earned his reputation in past. Maybe you have used different words but I think I got the message right.

As far as games are concerned in my previous post to rada I tried to explain why I consider doing cracks of old games valuable. I never said that old cracks were bad I just tried to explain, why the goldie cracks are valuable. There is still the target audience for these releases and those people (even when most of them are just emulator using retro-gamers) appreciate these efforts. I might not be a hardcore C64 gamer to see the point in this activity. Advanced tools don't have anything to do with it they are just tools the result is important here.

Scene is like a wall. I can agree with that.

Outruning Radwar is not my bizness. I doubt the oldie crackers are interested in that kind of fame either. They just do what they like to do, doing the best version of the game. It's their hobby, if anyone has any question he should send that question to them.

You say that "it appears to some of you that disliking oldie cracks is the ignorance of the eternally of yesterday". I haven't noticed anyone disliking old cracks. Disliking of buggy cracks is something different, but it's a problem of target group - gamers (or retro gamers). They don't seem to respect the tradition and instead of appreciating the work of those who did the firstie they are always ask for the best version. In Gamebase64 collection it's creators kept only one version of the game which was (according to them) the best. I wouldn't blame them for that. They were trying to do the ultimate collection of C64 games dedicated to gamers not sceners. I know that Mason is doing the collection of all versions of the same game, and yes, I agree that it's a very good idea.

2004-01-14 03:13

sack
Account closed

Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 2

You know something? I think secret man would feel much better if he tried another hobby.

Sexual intercouse perhaps?

2004-01-14 15:09

The Overkiller
Account closed

Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342

Quote: Yup, it was rereleases, right? But you forgot to mention that what made me so upset was the fact that some of those releases were buggy. And anyway, what is a crack stripped of old intro, repacked (maybe trained) and equipped with new intro? By an old definition it is recrack, or isn't it?

I remember than one of your final arguments featured one person getting a life with his gf laving others splitting hairs over that subject. Really killing argument. By any chance I apologise for any harm I have caused.

Stripped old intros ? Never did it! They aren't recrack anyway, maybe bad releases but no recracks.
About the last argument maybe it could splitting hairs but consider that all the discussion gone into a mess, so I simply wrote a bulls**it because all the discussion starting to annoying. And with that "probably" stupid argument I finally dropped it.

2004-01-14 16:49

Oxbow

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 50

Quote: okay, i admit that the past of our scene still s something which is important to keep in our mind. if i was an 'elite-scener' who did good cracks and earned credits for his hard work i should have a less respect for the sceners today.

but i think that the scene today is a different one than the scene 10 years ago. as already been mentioned,the 'old scene' died long time ago. the scene has changed and for some people hurts this a lot.

i respect the old crackers/supliers/golden ones/whatever a lot but if they are only talking about the old scene and are only hacking and burning newcomers they should expect that those 'newcomers' will have their word back.

radar, with all respect, but if you're only talking nothing will come from your hands! ever thought about the fact that thanks to those newcomers there still IS a scene? there are still parties and you can visit them!! ;-)

if only 'active' people would speak up,
it would be freaky empty over here!

i do have respect for skilled people from
the past and the present. And I guess
Radar is one of them. But being an 'oldie'
is not enough. The one who started this
thread could not have done more to illustrate so!

Ragging, making an argument, was truly
important in the past. Clearly, you can
still tell today who was skilled and who
was not.

Westbam ragging is like Crossbow coding!

Respect!

2004-01-14 18:49

LocalH
Account closed

Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 10

/me gets popcorn

2004-01-14 20:46

Westbam
Account closed

Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 192

Quote: if only 'active' people would speak up,
it would be freaky empty over here!

i do have respect for skilled people from
the past and the present. And I guess
Radar is one of them. But being an 'oldie'
is not enough. The one who started this
thread could not have done more to illustrate so!

Ragging, making an argument, was truly
important in the past. Clearly, you can
still tell today who was skilled and who
was not.

Westbam ragging is like Crossbow coding!

Respect!

Thanks Oxbow,

I entered the BBS scene when Wild Wares (XDS), Wares Castle (I+T) and Telephone Anarchy (EXC/[L]) were rolling. So I got thaught to play that game by guys like Goldfish, Gene or Excell. They need to be credited aswell I suppose...

I guess it is obvious to everyone Secret Man ain´t aware of the game he´s trying to play...

However, it doesn´t really make a difference if you´re old school or new school. The skills do matter and the contribution you made to this great computer and pirate scene...

Westbam / Legend

2004-01-14 21:03

Count Zero

Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1834

Quote: the scene hasnt died. it just evolved in a way so that it takes more to earn respect than a big mouth and licking stamps.

One of the TRUE elites here speaking true (and what counts maybe even more: original) words ...

As for most of the other posts I have just crossed: I simply don't get it. Thx for supportive words from CreaMD, Middy, TDG and ppl that feel in a similar way than I do, but why at all you waste your time here in one of the longest threads I ever touched ?

Over to the rest:
A "lack of respect" is something I actually WISH for any wannabe oldschool elite to come by on e.g. IRC. Maybe that wakes you up in some sense. Millions of old rotten cracks don't matter much to me, but I deeply bow down to e.g. the creators of the JPG Viewer.
But I could *CRACK* Toki properly aswell, without having to check into the Legend Crack --- nice you mention it, btw --- in all the time since that release, I have not found a version on which the 2nd level is working. After the first level end enemy, [L]-Toki crashes on all copies I ever came across.
(My previous poster is Westbam --- mailto: count0@c64.org the d64 or zipdisk files please :))) )

Too bad, it's really bla bla bla all the way and there is no real talking being left. Just one reason for me to abandon forums und BBS'es. There hardly is good tech-talk or really interesting things. The OMG'ish craptalk style which on their repective levels is being followed by Radar and Secret Man here simply creates an atmosphere I dislike.

So to speak, the oldschool elites (it started at SH, for those who'd like to know) made me actually go away from my roots and revise my view about the people sticking to their own.
There is nothing wrong to be proud about your (group- and personal-) past --- just write it up once in truth, add all the releases you ever did, fix the flaws you did back then, add comments, funny notes and stories, publish it.

THAT's what counts much more than your remembrance talk about some old war/game/skills. This way you may even be able to earn back the respect you think you deserve and next to that possibly allow more synergetic effects than having your raggings archived in a database.

I could add many many more things I care and worry about, but won't do. Midift already recognized my last post was longish, but it was planned that way after having had to read crackin >100 posts or so. :)

I'd just like to ask many people around to THINK about WHAT and HOW they post it.
E.g. Secret Man did himself sure no good by slapping around people with raggish slang craptalk. But you earn what you seed, right ?

Whoever dares to face me on personal talks or in a more interactive chat medium like IRC or ICQ, is free to do so. It usually turns out that whenever you switch to such a medium the harsh talk lowers a lot and people come to a reasonable and often enough constructive level.

l8r

Count Zero/CyberpunX/SCS*TRC

PS: should I blame this post on eating 2.5 hrs of my time which was planned for RR ? Yes, I should .... :)

2004-01-14 21:10

drake
Account closed

Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 207

oh sorry...

im not a legend nor elite
im not an oldschool scener at all and never did crack a single game!

all i know that being on a party, make part of a scene and ragging on a c64 is real fun ;-)
i never cared about any bad behaviour of any scener because someone tells me that i am a lamer or whatever. point is that midfit, radar, seret lady, count zero and scener xzy all are from an old scene. a scene newcomers never participated in. they perhaps know the names but never met those elite.

so, now you only can talk about past times and bring your old scenewars to life, okay...if thats the thing you want.

i share oxbows point of view when he says that making an argument was important in the past and it still is.
and maybe this is something i miss in todays scene.

btw: what do you oldskool-elite-scene-ppl think about the parties of today, the magazines and the software??? most of the time i only hear negative words and then followed by the magic words: 10, 15 years ago when we were in the scene...blabla...

-drake- east west asbest

2004-01-14 22:15

Westbam
Account closed

Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 192

Count Zero:

It had always been Legend policy to check up on our wares before we released them. Every single crack had been playtested completely before it got spread. I for myself played Toki through on the Legend version (of course I had trainers turned on, wouldn´t really want to waste more time than urgently needed...).

I am sure I have this ware (the imported NTSC fixed one aswell as the PAL version) and I will try to dig it up for you asap.

I also have to add that there was one single game we had to release on a 100% basis again. This title was Sleepwalker by Ocean. This crack had been messed up by apprentice member Darklord although *I* personally told him to back his crack up and make sure it works. He thought he was some god and didn´t. Result was the level decrunch would crash after Level One. A 100% version had been released immediately courtesy of Powerplant/Legend. Darklord had been removed from Legend roster right after as he wouldn´t want to reach up to our high quality standards...

Yours, Westbam / Legend

2004-01-14 22:24

chatGPZ

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11164

Quote: oh sorry...

im not a legend nor elite
im not an oldschool scener at all and never did crack a single game!

all i know that being on a party, make part of a scene and ragging on a c64 is real fun ;-)
i never cared about any bad behaviour of any scener because someone tells me that i am a lamer or whatever. point is that midfit, radar, seret lady, count zero and scener xzy all are from an old scene. a scene newcomers never participated in. they perhaps know the names but never met those elite.

so, now you only can talk about past times and bring your old scenewars to life, okay...if thats the thing you want.

i share oxbows point of view when he says that making an argument was important in the past and it still is.
and maybe this is something i miss in todays scene.

btw: what do you oldskool-elite-scene-ppl think about the parties of today, the magazines and the software??? most of the time i only hear negative words and then followed by the magic words: 10, 15 years ago when we were in the scene...blabla...

-drake- east west asbest

thing is (and now i won't make many friends along the so called oldschool elite) that most of these people probably couldnt do anything along the lines of todays quality "standards". its just easy to say that "back then" you ruled and today noone couldnt do anything because of the groundwork they layed. however even if this is partly true i doubt we wouldnt use open sideborders by now if 1001 hadnt showed us how to do it, and the same applies to any other topic along these tech issues.

bla, this whole discussion is just ridiculous, and nowhere as funny as the good old board ragging (mostly due to the fact that no clueless pricks would have access to the bbs at all).

and whoever wishes to muck about that what i said in my first sentence is not true => release a decent c64 related production, or *get lost*. noone carez about how much you rule in xbox (or whatever else) scene these days, atleast not here.

and 1337 emule skills are almost as interisting as your 1337 stamp licking skills from the past.

bah. just amazing how ppl suddenly pop up from nowhere just to show how little they managed to realise that the world changed and make a fool out of themselves. just imagine someone from the pdp9 scene had popped up in the 80s just to tell you how pathetic your childish game hacking is, and that you could only do it because of them doing all the hard punchcard work in the 70s. you laugh? yes indeed.

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