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The Shadow
Registered: Oct 2007
Posts: 304 |
Repeal Anonymous Voting
Anonymous voting allows cowards to abuse the voting system. People downvote like sneaky little bastards. If you are voting for a person, group or release and you feel that your particular vote is how you honestly feel then there is no reason to conceal your vote. Repealing anonymous voting would weed out a large portion of the downvoters. |
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Ed
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 173 |
Funny thing. The suggested "change" of the vote system sounds like a fixed presentation. It's like when the king and his sneaky advisors avoids confronting the discontent of the people or the hag with the mirror, "Mirror, mirror on the wall / Who in the land is fairest of all?"
Leave it as is and vote more.
One little hack and all the votes are visible, that is if some of you are interested in opening the backdoor to this place.
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bugjam
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 2583 |
After this thread has gone up and down, there finally came a suggestion that I feel honestly convinced to support 100%, and that is JCB's "Like" button. No possibility to downvote, it clearly mirrors the popularity, would be easy to implement (I assume), and it satisfies all the different directions shown here, which can never come together, judging from this debate so far.
We would also get rid of the "5-vote-treshold", and existing votes could be easily converted (e.g. every vote from 6 upwards equals a "Like").
Maybe even more people would vote, as it is easier and more convenient to just click a button, and that's it.
More complicated things like lists of what some specific user "likes" could come later, if at all.
I say go for it, so that peace returns, and we can concentrate again on what this website is really about: a place to conserve the C64 scene history, and a place to discuss things concerning the scene and the C64. I hate to see discussions get so heated here so that people turn away and do not support the true purpose of csdb anymore, which is the one thing we can all agree on, and which everybody values.
Give it a try, please!
C64 forever!!!
-Bugjam |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3051 |
This post will be lacking any constructive ideas, but I felt like finally letting out some thoughts connected with my presence on this page I had over the years.
First of all, I have conflict of interests.
Being mod here, I can't do anything about the fact that I see who anonymously downvoted me. Sometimes I understand why the certain person did it, (e.g. to get me lower in the list than himself or someone else), sometimes I don't. Those I don't understand quite fascinate me. Met the dude personally, he was a nice friendly person, but he (anonymoysly) thinks that as a musician I'm under average. I always considered myself to by kinda inconsiderate and slacker as a musician, but having that "assured" based on one or two votes hurts one's ego I can tell you. I'm sure if the system was totally anonymous there would be higher chance to get more negative votes on my musician profession, because around me in the rank there are some really good musicians. Who am I to dare to sit on the place close or above to them! ;-)
Being mod here, I can't do anything about the fact that I have been non-anonymously downvoted by person who thinks I'm asshole and deserve that. Apart from the fact that my stereotypes about behavioral patterns and ethics of German sceners are being reinforced.
On the surface and in some parts of my mind, I never cared about that, but some parts of me connected with fight for justice, and (never had problem to admit it) the part responsible for vanity and egoism can't be suppressed completely. Being in the position of mod unfortunately doesn't give much chances to do anything about of that. I can't afford to be called touchy, can't afford to be accused of abusing of my privileges. So there is kind of opposite forces which do make accepting of society a bit uncomfortable In larger scale expose (around the compos and parties I organized, where I experienced and saw a lot more "evil" inside us) this has driven me to mild state misanthropy.
You can make any solution to the voting system, it won't make everyone satisfied. Therefore for everyone around the creative scene it's best to take Andy Warhol's advice:
Don't pay any attention to what they write about you. Just measure it in inches.
The same can be applied on how one should look at voting system. They vote for you? Good. They recognize you.
There are other things one has to learn to accept. Fair votes for example. So your groupmate gave you 7 as organizer? You can't do anything about it. The most important thing is to not looking around you, doing your thing. Not to boast about past achievements but always do something you consider good, and... ... measure the response in inches. You know how good you are, and results of your work speak for you too. The votes are just couple of silly numbers and ranks only show the bubbles on the surface of the lake called scene. You can alway throw a big stone in water and see how much circles it makes.
Roman |
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Martin Piper
Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 718 |
Warhol isn't a good example because he was not in a position to do anything about the problem, whereas we are because making changes to the voting system is easily possible. All it needs is a small tweak. |
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Kristian
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 126 |
I vote (10 (anonymously)) for JCB's suggestion. |
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enthusi
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 677 |
See i.e. post #10 here:
http://noname.c64.org/csdb/forums/?roomid=7&topicid=71700&showa.. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11359 |
Quote:Groepaz: Indeed! 9.04 is quite nice... so a new category, an "up-voter" :P
and thats quite an important detail - just as much it is everones right to "up vote" whoever, it is everyones right to "down vote". if anything, not only getting rid of the downvoters, but also getting rid of the upvoters is equally important. so how you are going to fix that? =) |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3051 |
Martin, we can do something about that but in the process, we will lose something.
By making only non anonymous votes counted for some of us, not everyone will get fairer rank. Not all unfair downvoters are anonymous.
And even when I love the idea of having just "like". I found that evil, because it removes simple disagreement from the equation. For example if soemone don't agree with having Desert Dream (139 votes) in top 10 (place 9, One-Der has just 93 votes), because you consider it unfair to be above the original C64 productions, by not pressing like you can't express such disagreement. It brings the "necessity" to handle the disagreement that is reasoned and communicated openly. Not everyone want's to argue about such things though and also it won't beat the popularity vote. And btw. I love the demo and I don't have anything against it being 10, it was just example of how some other people can view things.
By this way you also lose the big part of feedback on less popular things. The ranks will be more influenced by popularity than actual evaluation of quality by voters. Of course not always the judgement of quality is fair, but at least there is some chance for exposure for releases or sceners that are voted 10 for 5 times and then downvoted by someone who thinks it doesn't deserve such a high mark.
In past I tried to fight against unfair voting. Better said, the voting I considered unfair from my point of view. But over those 9-10 years I realised that this society is too diversified and that I can't prevent myself from being biased. If I was author/owner of this system I wouldn't mind cleaning downvotes anywhere I considered it fair, even on my account, because my system, my rules, but here I'm just a guest and a part of it, I try to live with it and ignore the ocassional disenchanting feelings. Being completely ignored is probably much worse than having someone downvoting you because he hates you. ;-)
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Jon
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2005
Posts: 247 |
Perhaps a simpler solution might be to allow the user / submitter to enable or disable voting for an entry or "scene role"?
That way the submitter wields more control over their own entries and can decide whether public scrutiny is welcome or not. The current voting system can stay in place, more power is given to the user and the bi-monthly threads complaining about the voting system will disappear.
Just a thought.
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11359 |
if you dont want to know - just dont look at the result? |
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