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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Handle id #15647 : B. Howarth
This is not a scener.
I repeat: this is not a scener.
Please don't add pros here, the database is convulted enough as it is.
Thank you. |
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Twoflower
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 434 |
What's stopping you from deleting it? Besides, somebody ought to tell Mace not to upload NON SCENE RELATED STUFF, LIKE UNCRACKED TEXT-ADVENTURES FROM THE EIGHTIES.
Even games released today is fringe material, especially in those cases where the author has very little contact with the scene. For an eighties text-adventure, the line is clear. It is very clear. |
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: This is not a scener.
I repeat: this is not a scener.
Please don't add pros here, the database is convulted enough as it is.
Thank you.
Hrm, I'm not a scener, yet I get an entry. What's up with that? |
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Style
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 498 |
hmmm, by what definition are you *not* a scener Alih?
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: What's stopping you from deleting it? Besides, somebody ought to tell Mace not to upload NON SCENE RELATED STUFF, LIKE UNCRACKED TEXT-ADVENTURES FROM THE EIGHTIES.
Even games released today is fringe material, especially in those cases where the author has very little contact with the scene. For an eighties text-adventure, the line is clear. It is very clear.
You answer your own question: I'm not deleting it because I want to make sure people understand what happened. If I deleted it, chances are somebody would say "but maybe that guy once wrote a scrolltext" or something like that ;) |
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A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: hmmm, by what definition are you *not* a scener Alih?
by the definition where i don't do scene stuff, don't make demos, don't go to parties, etc.
(don't bring up project. i learned on the train over that grant was fucking my mother on a regular basis. i was not myself by the time i got through the remaining 7 hours on the train with him. project97 does not exist.). |
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Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
Ok, so now I am a scener and I write a game and release it.
That would fit perfectly well in the CSDB, right?
How the hell can I know that this adventure isn't some scener produced freeware game? There's no publisher mentioned, no copyright etc. etc.
And @ TwoFlower: if someone ought to tell me, why don't _you_ just send me a PM? I'm here on a daily basis and almost daily on IRC.
No need to shout, ok? We're grown up adults with rather normally functioning brains and such... for the most part.
Besides all this: I didn't lock any of these entries, so it's fairly easy to delete and/or change it.
[edit]BTW, I entered <release id=46017> only after I saw that Zyron had already entered <release id=24227> (which wasn't deleted in the meantime).[/edit] |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
I'd like to define scene productions as "everything with at least a couple of moving and flashing thingies or rasterbars on a black background in it". The adventures you added don't really qualify for that Mace.
No hard feelings, but I'd also prefer if such stuff would not be added here, but instead be given to the Gamebase team.
And while we're at it, you could have at least credited the B. Howard for "code" in the two text adventures. In the end that's all these games contain, code. No (pixelled) graphics and no music. ;-) (edited) |
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Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
I understand your point, Steppe.
But there are some points of debate:
1) B. Howarth could as well have just made the adventure story or map and not code a single byte.
2) Games can very well be a part of the scene, even if they're shitty BASIC productions: I see my old stuff and the first steps towards who and what I am today and so they are part of my history as a scener.
3) We are taking this to a broader spectrum, while in fact we are discussing these two text adventures in particular and at the same time debate over the thin line between what _is_ and what _isn't_ suitable for CSDb.
I will delete *both* adventures and *both* creators in the meantime. If what TDJ says is true, namely that one of 'm wrote a scrolltext, the discoverer of that fact can add the chap again.
[edit]
In this respect I could even debate over the fact how much Rob Hubbard is a scener. He has only been added to the CSDb, so ppl can credit him for the music they used.
Ok, granted... he made a few demos and wrote some text. But it's the general idea I'm referring to. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
The writing of demos and taking part in the scene (through Compunet) makes Hubbard eligible; if someone has "discovered" the scene in the form it was in at that point and been involved in a scene production directly, there's a good indication they're a scener. Simply producing a demo out isn't an indication, but actively getting involved in the scene, chatting online (since Compunet had a chat system) or over the phone to other sceners and working with them (he produced music specifically for Stoat&Tim's Call of the Wild as well as his own Zoolook Moozook demo) is. =-)
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
Sure, I see your point Mace. It's not that your entries are completely off the line from your point of view.
And besides, I knew it was all Zyron's fault from the beginning! ;-) |
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Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
Let's conclude that due to the rather open nature of CSDb and not too well defined thin lines around the scene, we'll be having this kind of discussions about entries more often.
If you don't agree with an entry, change or delete it or PM the person who made it. In a civilised way. ;-)
And yeah, it was Zyron all the time! |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
i have no idea, but it's Zyron's fault!!1one |
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Zyron
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2381 |
I take full responsibility for everything non-scene related that's been added to CSDb. It was all part of my evil plan but now you've ruined it. It's TDJ's fault! Boooh.. |
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Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
Ok, it's TDJ's fault, but Zyron is to blame and Perff should fix it. |
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Twoflower
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 434 |
@Mace: Ok, there's no need to shout. It's just that this is the... umpteenth time this happens. For claritys sake - even if Brian Howarth was a scener in some way, the two text-adventures you added wouldn't be valid. They were either 1) commercial productions 2)public domain/shareware, non scene-related productions or 3) made by authors with no connection whatsoever with the scene and not made with the intent to be shared or focused on in. These games were made for the interactive fiction community on the C-64 back then.
But really, there should be some text describing what is suitable to add and not in this database, eventhough I personally believe the word "scene" is rather hard to misinterpret. |
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Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
...and so I deleted the entries. |
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
Amen.
(thread closed)
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