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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
need help!
I do at the moment a cover version (or maybe a Remix?) from (\VARIOUS\A-F\ADSR\Cane\Phobos.sid)
Yesterday I already converted all original instruments, except one on channel 3: It has ADSR 0040 with no Hard-restart, and waveform is Triangle
(starts at 00:02.17 min). Song-speed is 704 (Gt-tracker), like the original one.
I really can't understand how Cane made this fast pitch changes every frame and how he controlled them without making one big wavetable (several several 100 frames) that contains the complete pitches for nearly 8 seconds (before it loops)
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silpheed
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 3 |
I guess the first question is... Are you sure that you have the speed right.?
It sounds to me like it was done as individual notes in a sequence rather than an Arp table.
Judging by the release date of the tune, I think it is safe to assume that he didn't use GoatTracker. So my guess is that he was using a double (or triple?) speed player such as the one that JCH wrote.
Try doubling the speed of your GT tune. If it is already maxed then you may have encountered one of the limitations of GT.
I'm a SID / JCH newbie so I may be wrong here but seeing as nobody else took a swing at your Q, I thought I'd have a go.
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3075 |
Afaik. Cane was using a brilliant Grabowski player. That explains a lot ;-) That fast changing background in the beginning of the tune is (I'm just guessing) made with hardrestart switched off and gate on, maybe even some sliding is used? Or do you mean something else? |
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
@silpheed and @CreaMD
speed (GT/ 704) is 100% correct...
and he used a single-speed-player
I composed already 1.30 min and it sounds 99% identical.
Moreover I converted the "instrument" as two (big!!) wavetables (slide up, and down) - and it works ;-)
but im sure, Cane had a better way to create this sound.
Here, the wavetable (it takes 198 bytes) :-(
This is the only way I found in GT.
ADSR: 0040
wf Tr
11 Ac
11 Ba
11 80
11 80
11 C5
11 Bc
11 80
11 80
11 C8
11 Bd
11 80
11 80
11 C9
11 Bf
11 80
11 80
11 Cb
11 Bc
11 80
11 80
11 C8
11 Bd
11 80
11 80
11 C9
11 Bf
11 80
11 80
11 Cb
11 C1
11 80
11 80
11 Cd
11 Bd
11 80
11 80
11 C9
11 Bf
11 80
11 80
11 C9
11 Bf
11 80
11 80
11 Cb
11 C1
11 80
11 80
11 Cd
11 C4
11 80
11 80
11 D0
11 Bf
11 80
11 80
11 Cb
11 C1
11 80
11 80
11 Cd
11 C4
11 80
11 80
11 D0
11 C6
11 80
11 80
11 D2
11 C1
11 80
11 80
11 Cd
11 C4
11 80
11 80
11 Cd
11 C4
11 80
11 80
11 D0
11 C6
11 80
11 80
11 D2
11 C9
11 80
11 80
11 D5
11 C4
11 80
11 80
11 D0
11 C6
11 80
11 80
11 D1
11 C9
11 80
11 80
11 D5
11 Cb
11 80
11 80
11 D7
11 C6
11 80
11 80
11 D2
11 C9
11 80
11 80
11 D5
11 Cb
11 80
11 80
11 D7
11 Cd
11 80
11 80
11 D9
11 C9
11 80
11 80
11 D5
11 Cb
FF 00
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Turtle
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 70 |
hi nata,
just a quick thought to 'compress' the wavetable, although I'm sure that there's a different way to achieve the desired sound.
Just identify the identical
11 xx
11 yy
11 80
11 80
11 ff
parts and just make 'on the fly' instrument changes like
00 A-201000
01 ---02000
01 ---03000
01 ---02000
01 ---04000
01 ---01000
01 ---03000
01 ---05000
...
As the number of frames per step equals the steps of each wavetable (until ff) GT should use the new wavetable right at the start of the new step.
Anyway, it's just a quick thought ...
Turtle
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Hey, good Idea! |
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Turtle
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 70 |
Hmm, not really!!!
I just tried the first sequences and discovered that one has to loop the wavetable (i.e. FF 01 at the end).
But nevertheless I haven't had a deja vu according to Cane's tune. It's more something like ooouuuuhhhh!! (Hey, it's friday eve and a hard week lies behind me, so don't take my comments too serious).
Keep on trying,
Turtle
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
"C64 IDE HDD MUSIC-PLAYER v2.5" says, it is "GRABOWSKY 1"
Is this Graffity's DMC? Which version?
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Stryyker
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 469 |
Not DMC. Much different system. Grabowski had his own player. Some funky music made in it but not anywhere as user friendly as the DMC series. |
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Clarence
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 123 |
Afaik Cane and Dos used the Sosperec editor by Grabowsky.
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3075 |
Quote: Afaik Cane and Dos used the Sosperec editor by Grabowsky.
Exactly. Fabulous sound. |
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Quote: Afaik Cane and Dos used the Sosperec editor by Grabowsky.
Where can I download THE "Sosperec editor"?
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Clarence
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 123 |
Back then it was made only for Grf internal use and a few outsider musicians like the ADSR guys got for exclusive use. I remember it was even password protected. Dunno if it was released for the public since then.
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
:-( |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3075 |
Quote: :-(
I had it somewhere on my music discs, but I never used it. Learning new editor isn't easy. |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1046 |
I have the Sosperec editor, will upload it soon with password and post link here.
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: I have the Sosperec editor, will upload it soon with password and post link here.
Don't forget to add an Onslaught intro ;) |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1046 |
heheh.
http://c64.rulez.org/onslaught/c64misc/music/Sosperec_Depacker_..
Have to convert the editor itself, will do that tommorow. |
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
:-) |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1163 |
Probably it's no magic editor that makes you instantly supremely enlightened... my guess: cryptic interface, lots of hex data editing with strange side-effects. Still it'll be nice to see. |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1046 |
ok here it is, also with pack/depacker
Sosperec Editor V1.0 |
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Hmmm, there aren't any instructions.... :(
Fortunately now I solved the problem with the wavetable (Jammer helped me, yeahh!)
It is a simple wavetable...
wf tr
11 00
00 00
10 0C
FF 00
ADSR 008F
+ Harestart on,
Of course, instrument hasn't same settings like the orginal tune,
but I think it's interesting to see, how different players (GT & Sosperec...)
has to be progammed, to make the same SID-Sound |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1046 |
Well, this is not a public release, so normally no instructions.
Tools are often coded and made for one person, not for use by the masses.
Hope it is useful though, would be nice to see some people using different editors besides DMC, JCH, SDI and Sync.
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