| |
NoiseEHC
Registered: Feb 2005
Posts: 51 |
World Record Database
Hi!
Is there anybody who knows if there is some kind of world record database? If there is none then are there people interested in creating one in a wiki? I am thinking about creating a paragraph of the effect description of "every" demo ever released (which have world records or new effects of course), and to group the effects into categories. For example "sprite multiplexers" would be a category, listing record numbers/years going up to Crest's 120/170 sprite records (each one a link to the respective demo).
Anybody interested?
Thanks,
Noise/EHC |
|
... 33 posts hidden. Click here to view all posts....
|
| |
Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2982 |
Quoting NoiseEHCQuoting Krill
You could also just ask on this forum for a list of similar things to what you have in mind, then decide if it's worth to try surpassing them. =)
Yeah, that is exactly what I want to avoid... ;) But why. Afraid that someone would pick up your idea and beat you before you even started?
Quoting NoiseEHCQuoting DiggerWhat I would like to see/create would be more like a lookup DB for demo effects. Exactly. However I would prefer a wiki format, as searching with google is much better usually...
Btw that is a nice site for +4. This works well only for a specific and rather outdated style of demo.
Also note how the effects in Rocket Science are somewhat messily lumped into rather broad drawers, and how only the free form notes give some detail. (And the "parameters" column is almost useless.)
Demos have long evolved past simple effect shows and record contests, with the better of them featuring elaborate hybrids and combinations of the basic "effects" of old. |
| |
NoiseEHC
Registered: Feb 2005
Posts: 51 |
Quoting KrillBut why. Afraid that someone would pick up your idea and beat you before you even started?
Because I would like that way better.
Quoting KrillDemos have long evolved past simple effect shows and record contests, with the better of them featuring elaborate hybrids and combinations of the basic "effects" of old.
Demos evolved in a way that now compos can be won by things which were called "filler" parts in the past. There are so many Powerpoint Presentations today that just having a list of real world records would be awesome... |
| |
Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2982 |
Quoting NoiseEHCBecause I would like that way better. "Okay."
Quoting NoiseEHCDemos evolved in a way that now compos can be won by things which were called "filler" parts in the past. Now you have piqued my interest. Care to elaborate? =) |
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5095 |
Quote: Quoting NoiseEHCBecause I would like that way better. "Okay."
Quoting NoiseEHCDemos evolved in a way that now compos can be won by things which were called "filler" parts in the past. Now you have piqued my interest. Care to elaborate? =)
thats a view in the oldschool scene, I heard from hungarians the term "powerpoint" demos :) |
| |
Mr SQL
Registered: Feb 2023
Posts: 137 |
This would be refreshing to see, maybe there could be a forum topic dedicated to it here, there are a lot of interesting techniques and new discoveries still to be made from pushing the old hardware.
I think the comment above related to many demos having similar filler techniques once a particular method is created like clones of one another. |
| |
Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2982 |
Quoting Oswaldthats a view in the oldschool scene, I heard from hungarians the term "powerpoint" demos :) Well i was hoping for some specific examples and perhaps some dissection to show why they suck. :) |
| |
NoiseEHC
Registered: Feb 2005
Posts: 51 |
Quoting Oswaldthats a view in the oldschool scene, I heard from hungarians the term "powerpoint" demos :)
Ebben semmi meglepő sincs, mert én találtam fel ezt a kifejezést... :) |
| |
NoiseEHC
Registered: Feb 2005
Posts: 51 |
Quoting KrillWell i was hoping for some specific examples and perhaps some dissection to show why they suck. :)
I think "suck" is a little bit too strong word here.
But essentially it is about that "demo" is an art form where code+graphics+music is presented in a perfect composition. And code was supposed to push the boundaries of what is possible in Impossible Land. Now that last thing - pushing boundaries - faded away in the last decades.
Now I personally do not have any problem with people who cannot create something new and just rehash the same old effects over and over again. I also have no problem PowerPoint Presentations winning demo compos, as people who vote have no idea what they are seeing, so it is somewhat expected. I also do not go to demo parties and so I am not forced to watch 4 disk sides of animations either... :) What I have a problem with is that this is presented as the "Right Thing (tm)". It is not.
For example in my latest megademo I spent a lot of time with the turn disk part, which is a rotating floppy drive animation. It took ages to make it, because it was 5 colors so d800 had to be animated as well, and in order to fit all phases into memory the bitmaps had to be mirrored while the animation was running. And there was a sprite multiplexer above the graphics, which kinda sucks to write. So I do understand that even making animations is hard, but on the other hand I would never make 10 such parts filling 4 disk sides and release it as a demo. Never. Ever. |
| |
Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2982 |
Quoting NoiseEHCBut essentially it is about that "demo" is an art form where code+graphics+music is presented in a perfect composition. And code was supposed to push the boundaries of what is possible in Impossible Land. Now that last thing - pushing boundaries - faded away in the last decades. I posit that it didn't fade away, it's just not as glaringly obvious any more as it used to be.
And the advances are getting smaller and smaller the closer we asymptotically approach some hard theoretical maximum.
No idea which demos you've watched recently, but i did see some envelopes pushed at X23 and other recent parties. =)
Quoting NoiseEHCNow I personally do not have any problem with people who cannot create something new and just rehash the same old effects over and over again. Inventing new types of effect is the pinnacle of demo coding, and happens so rarely that any coder achieving this has always been an outlier rather than the norm.
And breaking some "world record" (previously held by another implementation of the same concept) is by definition the exact opposite of inventing a new effect.
Quoting NoiseEHCI also have no problem PowerPoint Presentations winning demo compos, as people who vote have no idea what they are seeing, so it is somewhat expected. Or they just have different opinions and taste than you do.
But, care to name just one "PowerPoint demo" which then won against some "proper" code-porn demo?
Quoting NoiseEHCI also do not go to demo parties and so I am not forced to watch 4 disk sides of animations either... :) What I have a problem with is that this is presented as the "Right Thing (tm)". It is not. Neither is it presented as (the one and only) "Right Thing", nor is your hyperbole anywhere close to The Truth (except the 4 disk-sides part).
Quoting NoiseEHCSo I do understand that even making animations is hard, but on the other hand I would never make 10 such parts filling 4 disk sides and release it as a demo. Whatever floats your boat.
But animations in themselves are specific kinds of effect in their own right, and also lend themselves to comparison and record contests, if you're so inclined.
You can push boundaries in bitrate, update frame rate, resolution and other metrics. |
| |
NoiseEHC
Registered: Feb 2005
Posts: 51 |
Quoting KrillAnd the advances are getting smaller and smaller the closer we asymptotically approach some hard theoretical maximum.
You are sooooooo wrong about that... ;)
Just for the record: there is still some $d011 stuff have not been done.
Quoting Krill
And breaking some "world record" (previously held by another implementation of the same concept) is by definition the exact opposite of inventing a new effect.
Probably I could have been more clear: by "World Record" I mean not only something which has a numerical value which is increasing in every iteration, but all "World First" effect, which have not been done before. I thought that it was quite obvious. |
| Previous - 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 - Next |
