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Forums > CSDb Entries > Event id #3365 : Lovebyte 2024
2023-11-29 00:23
wacek

Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 518
Event id #3365 : Lovebyte 2024

Lovebyte is coming :)

As the C64 is still underrepresented in this sizecoding-dedicated demoparty (a little less last year with my humble efforts ;) ), please consider joining the competitions with your tiny entries :) It would be so awesome to witness more Commodore entries from seasoned, active coders! Our platform really gives a nice challenge when it comes to those tiny intros ;)
 
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2023-11-30 11:33
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 3003
Quoting wacek
One of my motivators is to challenge the domination of A8 in those compos. A lot of entries, but not so many new ideas and a lot of repetition from previous releases.
I hoped to learn a bit more about the rivalry thing. :)

But the main problem of those tiny things is that they rarely, if ever, qualify as "demo" in my book (and intros aren't intros if they precede nothing).
That is, at least 3 "scenes" (or parts or pages if you will) plus actual music.
There's usually just the one effect repeating ad infinitum, with some minimal noise (if there's any sound at all). =)
2023-11-30 14:03
wacek

Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 518
Quoting Krill
There's usually just the one effect repeating ad infinitum, with some minimal noise (if there's any sound at all). =)

Well, multiscene intros are possible in 1k. In 4k they are very common. For the sound - you did not bother to check the releases from last year, did you? I did 32b with sound, and 1k with regular SID track ;)
2023-11-30 14:37
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 3003
Quoting wacek
Well, multiscene intros are possible in 1k. In 4k they are very common. For the sound - you did not bother to check the releases from last year, did you? I did 32b with sound, and 1k with regular SID track ;)
I said "usually". And yeah, i did watch Lovebyte last year.

Didn't say proper demo is impossible for these tiny things, either.
4K isn't "tiny" in my book, though. 1K is borderline.
2023-11-30 15:28
Frostbyte

Registered: Aug 2003
Posts: 183
Quote: Quoting wacek
One of my motivators is to challenge the domination of A8 in those compos. A lot of entries, but not so many new ideas and a lot of repetition from previous releases.
I hoped to learn a bit more about the rivalry thing. :)

But the main problem of those tiny things is that they rarely, if ever, qualify as "demo" in my book (and intros aren't intros if they precede nothing).
That is, at least 3 "scenes" (or parts or pages if you will) plus actual music.
There's usually just the one effect repeating ad infinitum, with some minimal noise (if there's any sound at all). =)


My humble 2p: A demo is a DEMOnstration of skills (code, graphics, music, design, whatevs). A well executed tiny program, albeit with a single effect, is as valid of a demonstration of one's skills as a larger, more comprehensive demo. Hell, sometimes even more so, as cramming anything even remotely impressive to a few bytes if f***ing hard. Different kind of hard than building a two disk epic megademo, but hard nevertheless. Of course it is impressive when someone crams a multipart megademo into 1k or less, rather than a single part one, but that doesn't take away the single part ones' "demo" title. Multipartness (is that a word?) is just one of the variables of a demo amongst others.

Fully agree on intros though. It's a bit weird when small single part things are sometimes called intros if they are not introducing anything. :)

Re. C64 vs other platforms at Lovebyte, what I think Wacek is after is friendly rivalry. :) Mixed oldschool sizecoding compos have been typically dominated by other platforms, as C64 does have its weaknesses in this context, but there certainly would be enough skills on C64 scene to turn the tables if more of us would get into sizecoding.
2023-11-30 20:25
chatGPZ

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11442
Size restricted compos are not suited to compare systems though. I can see how that makes it not very interesting.
2023-11-30 22:58
Frostbyte

Registered: Aug 2003
Posts: 183
Quote: Size restricted compos are not suited to compare systems though. I can see how that makes it not very interesting.

Admittedly, platform-specific sizecoding compos are much more interesting (and fair) than multiplatform ones. Who knows, maybe aome day c64 will have ita own sizecoding party, or at least sizecoding compos at the usual parties. :)
2023-12-01 13:22
wacek

Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 518
Quoting Frostbyte
there certainly would be enough skills on C64 scene to turn the tables if more of us would get into sizecoding.

This. This is the whole purpose of my original post.

Quoting chatGPZ
Size restricted compos are not suited to compare systems though.

Why? If you take it seriously, maybe, but not if you're taking it as fun endeavor.

Quoting Frostbyte
Who knows, maybe aome day c64 will have ita own sizecoding party, or at least sizecoding compos at the usual parties. :)

First we would need 4k to become a standard feature at C64 parties, which we still do not have. And for everyone to make a distinction between "crack intro" and "intro" (instead of doing those we have endless discussions if 4k should be called an "intro" or not because reasons), I know discussing semantics is always requiring less than actually creating something ;)
2023-12-01 13:34
wacek

Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 518
*intro is improper name because not introducing anything, does not matter all other scenes are using it, we need to be special*
*not every trackmo has no dir and/or single soundtrack why should it be called trackmo*
*4k is not tiny, it's 4 times the size of 1k, therefore tiny is an incorrect term*

Semantic discussion is a bastard sister of procrastination ;)
2023-12-01 15:58
chatGPZ

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11442
Quote:
Why? If you take it seriously, maybe, but not if you're taking it as fun endeavor.

If comparing apples and oranges is what floats your boat - sure, go ahead :)
Quote:
First we would need 4k to become a standard feature at C64 parties, which we still do not have.

Many parties have this though. And very often the compo is cancelled, because of not enough entries. Ppl won't suddenly make more 4k demos(!) because there are more compos for it.
2023-12-01 17:06
ChristopherJam

Registered: Aug 2004
Posts: 1412
I mean, I'd love to see a c64 2k or 4k executable graphics compo. Even 8k could be interesting if anyone managed to shoehorn a FLI image in, with either an image cruncher or some drawing code and a model of some kind.

(and of course, really could have done with a 5k or 6k compo to enter Onscreen 5k into :D )
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