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2013-02-16 10:45

PAL

Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 271

demos

READ WITH CARE AND WITH OPEN MIND:

Based on Revolved and demos like that - really great demos... but...

It is truly a beauty of a demo you have created and the hours, work and cleverness behind it must be massive!!!... Can I go beyond the normal standards here? OK? Cool... I just want to ask the c64 scene something that I really think so much about... what are we? What are the scene? Where do we want to be or where do we want to go? What if we become the producers of the all loving and polished no to argue and nothing to complain about? what is the scene then... I think this demo show some super powers in making something run smooth and so seamingless and so splendid... but where is the hard-on? Where is the humor? Where is the fun and loving bits? Where is the contrasts? Where is the black and white? Where is the FUN? When should I smile with sound and when should I cry? I meen this demo is so cool and a great piece til revolved logo is on screen and then the next effect is also cool.... then a line makes a splitt and the demo is insane cool... but after that... what is it really? For me it is people trying to make something that everyone will think is really great. It is so well made this demo so I am on thin ground here and I see that because I see the demo over and over and over again and I just envy the transition power in here and the colors and the fades and all but to me it is really mostly that... the plasma over the char squares are great also.... then the portrait part with the rotating letters, beautiful.... but so without sole... then the best part of the demo comes the rotating stuff.... from here and in it is for me just smooth moves and really beutiful work... but what I really ask is: Is this it? Is that what we are aiming for? The sphere movers are ofcourse beautiful and so cool...everything is really splendid in the demo!!! That is why I try to write this post as true as possible... how many demos like this will it take to kill our scene? We are part of something that we love and we love it because we are part of something that is NOT mainstream... so why do we push the productions to be mainstream? I meen, this is a fantastic demo, it really is and congratulations for the win, I really meen that and I hope you all can read my text in a way that is not hate, not bad or not silly, because I really meen this... Are we not men with our edge anymore? If we want to do the all perfect stuff for all humans on the planet earth, are we then not on the wrong platform??... I want to say something, want you to smile, to cry and to die because it is silly or so hard to grasp... I do not want to make smooth powerpoints with a cool sid tune on top... The cool DANE tune saves this demo even more for me even the demo in itself is so great... but the greatness is not the best for me... can I say this without beeing the worst arse in the scene? In a way I know my powers in making demos and also I know that we can make the transitions and make all blend so great but that is just not fun to do so again super thanx for your time on that, how many demos more would you like to do that on? ...maybe I just am all wrong but to me it is about effects and making some insane things on this machine and not just press the gausian blur button in photoshop and make it be so that everyone likes it... what about make someone puke... make them hate your demo... make them love it... make them be filled with anger... make them cry out of emotions, just a text like my text in Another beginning with the man in the window, it is me, give from yourself, make us beleive, make the viewers be filled with moods in different orders... make a rollercoaster ride... you do not want to go to transition world, what we want is the contrasts that shake us up a bit? the different stuff? the black and white? For me it is so...

I really think our scene will die if we try to make more and more and more transition based demos, I really do think so... I really think it is getting a tad booooooring as fuck now too... AND the worst, one do fun stuff creating a routine, then one must do all that in such a great way after? It is like wasshing the car with a thoothbrush for me in a way... I just do not think it is any fun, do all you others out there love to sit and do fades and transitions more than the effects itself? Do you? because I want to know? Can we just make us be shocked more, feel love more, feel hate more, feel joy more.... Today it is so smooth and it is so nice and it is so cool but it is our death, just because we are so great at what we do so it gets boring in the long run... we have been in this scene for so long, let us try to talk about this? I know bepp and we are so great friends when it comes to demo creating and let us face it... we are the super democreators(we are the ones, we are the c64 scene and we are the strongest because I love jan, I love bob, I love mahoney... I love to mobb lars... and so on, they love me back in a way that I can feel in my life, it is totally great, we are family you see, we are the weird ones, the ones doing this, we are great!) still beating the life in something strange and do me a favour and not let me have a hard time here... I think it is the perfect demo to post this on because I, you and all know this is a insane great demo... you won and it is great... I salute you... Ask the coders, would it be cool to make the effects and not all the transitions? And will we break the hardware more than what we do... we need to do that... in my mind! I am just a fool, but you know what? I stand for me, I stand tall above normal, abnormal... and I ask... what do we do in order to make this scene really be something for us to have in the next 30 years too... we are the best in the world at what we do... Triad - you made a fantastic demo... I just want to use the time to make a disqussion about the lot...

I want to be in the old peoplehome and do c64 demos... with transitions that will not hapen! With edge and striking moodsetters that might happen!

just me, PAL

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2013-02-16 21:17

algorithm

Registered: May 2002
Posts: 705

PAL. Each to their own. You are entitled to your opinion but to say I am wrong is rather wrong dont you think? If transitions are so time consuming for an individual than fair enough, but if it is not then why not use it? :-)

2013-02-16 21:22

PAL

Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 271

Wrong again... because if you see the demo groups doing the effort that I respect on that.... you will see that the demos are seldom and they do not release much... it is a fact, dude!

2013-02-16 21:23

Kristian

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 126

I haven't been involved in any demo-making since the mid 90's, so I am probably on thin ice here, but isn't some of the point with transitions to get rid of the dead boring loading- and decrunchingtimes and what not? How often do you see movies with a 30 seconds break between each scene? ...loading...

Press space is fine, I'm all for that, but transistions do more than just fade in and out parts... they take away some of the boring parts of a demo... the waiting.

To really compare it to movies I guess you would have to load the new part in the background so it could start immediately when the previous part is finished. That way I could do fine without transistions.

What bothers me a lot more than transistions is lack of consistency. I'd love to see more demos following a red line through the production.

2013-02-16 21:24

algorithm

Registered: May 2002
Posts: 705

Please read my previous post. If transitions take too much time for someone then fair enough. If they dont then use it:-). What is so wrong with that?

2013-02-16 21:35

PAL

Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 271

I want to be surprised! I think modern and in fashion demos are just smooth... I want someone to punch me in the face, then do the finger to the eye totally from nowhere, then after that he just stand over me and puke on me and then he lift me up and throw me in the bin, close the lid and then put a big stone on top... but he then do not stop, he lift a car up with his crane and let it smash me and then after that he just spray the whole erea with nucluar waste and let me rotten... I want that rather than the all I know what this will be and now move up and now some colors... mirror... powder my face and all... I am sorry I think we are getting lame... it is no edge in that it is mostly just really booring! AND NOTHING WITH OUR DEMOS! I just think if I see these transition demos without bigger effects more I will just think, hey... I am a beast, I want to be that... where can I bee that... gausian blur all you want... but please show the effect that will say... wow.... in the end I will find the smooth motion of transitions so booring... and after that you all will too... and then it is too late... it happened to amiga and the pc... let us be more... the all likes or love this is bad!

2013-02-16 21:44

raven
Account closed

Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 137

PAL, not releasing new stuff often has nothing to do with investing time in transitions, IMO.

To be honest, I cant understand how you manage to release so much stuff in such short periods of time.
Even if I used 100% of my (very little) spare time on the C64, I'll never reach a pace even close to this!

It sux, but we're not teenagers anymore with nothing to do except go to school & code demos.
I wish I could do that again, but such is life :)

2013-02-16 21:46

algorithm

Registered: May 2002
Posts: 705

Everyone has their opinion. I personally opt for the loading while displaying part then transition to the next. PAL has a point if it means that transition coding takes too much time, but if it does not then go for it. What do others think of this? And by no means am I critisising any demo that does not use this approach. Why be stuck to the press space for next part approach? Every coder has the right to do what they want. I like both aspects so dont take it as a bitching.

2013-02-16 21:48

Monte Carlos

Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 358

I think, there's something rumbling in the demo scene now. I mean that people think about how to make demos more artistic and experiment with that. There were other times not long ago, where the demos were less original. Also there were many cool comebacks like that of Censor Design (the last one) and today there are more groups active than in lets say 2004-2010. Maybe sometimes it's too much about smooth transitions and less focus on the real hard effects maybe sometimes its to codepron, but time will show how people find there balance.

2013-02-16 22:23

Count Zero

Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1926

*I* think our scene is not all demos! They are highly appreciated and all - still ...

"Scene" has cracks, intros, sids, graphics in totally weird formats, tools and originality at many "edges". Many of these never seen or mentioned on a _demo_...

Open your mind and focus on more than just the demo at end.

We want to play as well - code more games and protect them - just for me. The unprotected real oldschool stuff is handled by others anyhow and this rgcd cart stuff recently seen is just boring (to even look at - not judging their quality). :)

2013-02-16 22:31

spider-j

Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 498

I think I'd be the happiest man alive if I ever reach the point in my life to think about such 'problems'... :-)

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