[CSDb] - User Forums - Release id #237162 : Tribute to Vangelis

You are not logged in - nap

CSDb User Forums

Forums > CSDb Entries > Release id #237162 : Tribute to Vangelis

2023-12-15 00:38

Oswald

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5096

Release id #237162 : Tribute to Vangelis

@4gent,

1) feels you took those quotes out of context
2) I even said to 2 girls on the schoolyard when I was 9 that I'm never gonna have sex because its disgusting
3) Talent added so much of his own, that I consider it an original work, Vermeer traced outlines with pinhole camera, Talent used another work for reference I couldnt care less.

... 192 posts hidden. Click here to view all posts....

2023-12-15 13:45

4gentE

Registered: Mar 2021
Posts: 285

Cartman to Towelie: "You're a towel."
Towelie: "YOU're a towel!"

2023-12-15 13:45

Electric

Registered: May 2002
Posts: 39

Quoting Peacemaker

while you are here. when do you think to credit the original work of:

Lenin

Lenin
[/img]

What's wrong with this? Despite of the hopeful new norms we've been discussing here on how to add proper production notes along images? I suppose it's time we dig our past and start adding the missing production notes on the refs etc by ourselves. Maybe Talent can do that as well?

The work here looks like done by hand basing on a reference. A method common for the most PETSCII gfx.

What is childish is going after everyone that disagrees with you in the discussion, this as a targeted group effort. That is of course a way to silence people as we all know. I would still expect something more than smear campaigning from Censor.

FYI: I will try to keep my commenting as unpersonal as possible, hopefully in the topic (though I tend to meander).

Gladly welcoming other topic on 'all the converted and copied crap of our scene'. It will be one big discussion. Things that scene never went through. However, if you think this graphicwise, early 2000s are the times when everyone started to have the tools to work on actual 'easy' copies based on PS collages and stuff. Before that the lack of proper tools leaded to that conversions were still pretty easy to spot. So if you want to start digging, I would propose going after post millenium works. The rest is 50% Vallejos…

2023-12-15 13:49

4gentE

Registered: Mar 2021
Posts: 285

@Peacemaker:
When I pleaded with you not to stalk me, that includes not sending me PMs.
@everyone else :
Sorry for this interruption, carry on.

2023-12-15 13:50

Peacemaker

Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 275

" The work here looks like done by hand basing on a reference. A method common for the most PETSCII gfx."

no, it looks like the use of a petscii converter.

2023-12-15 13:50

Peacemaker

Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 275

Quoting 4gentE

@Peacemaker:
When I pleaded with you not to stalk me, that includes not sending me PMs.
@everyone else :
Sorry for this interruption, carry on.

yeah, i misclicked. i wanted to reply here but clicked on PM instead of QUOTE.. Shame on me, wont happen again. Dont feel stalked, brother ;)

2023-12-15 13:56

Flotsam

Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 84

Quote: lol. what a childish reaction of you. as if i would stalk you where? croatia (csdb says so) or ukraine (the etsy page says so) :D
all i did was a image reverse search and found that little wood masterpiece.

Why would you reverse search an iconic picture that everyone already knows. I'm guessing the recognizeability was the point on this one. It's totally irrelevant to the ongoing discussion. And speaking of it, I've been following it (the discussion) like most of the active scene is, intensily and there's been a lot of good in it, but also too much of trying to sideline the discussion with nonsense. This is such nonsense. Why this hostility and tries at personal counter-attacks? Why not instead try to communicate like adults do and focus on the matter? I understand you're trying to defend Talent, but this is not the right way to do it. This bullshit just prolongs the agony when it's already pretty clear that the pic is a direct conversion of some other artist's work with some additional manual pixeling. The red tint on the beard is not the only telltale sign of this.

See Aomeba's reply... he obviously has understood the point of all this and without anyone asking has come out and openly told how his process involves references and converting too. I have absolutely nothing against using references, using modern tools - I happily use all technologies available myself to produce crappy pics to accompany my tunes. Total respect to Aomeba for being open about it. All this time I've been hoping that Talent would also be open about how this pic came to be and then we would be done with this and live happily ever after and respect eachother. With that said: Maybe it's time to just drop the discussion on this particular pic / person and speak generally. The point has been made and hopefully after this credit will be given to whom deserve it, including the original artists outside the scene.

I'm not a graphics guy and no-one cares about what or how I do my stuff, but I promise to be a better scener from now on and in the future releases mention if I use conversion, AI, references, whatnot. Because... why not?

Sorry for the long and confusing rant. I'm like that. Hopefully no-one read it. Peace, all.

2023-12-15 13:58

4gentE

Registered: Mar 2021
Posts: 285

Quote:

no, it looks like the use of a petscii converter.

Of course, you would know better than Electric, you being such an expert, and him being a rookie. Anyway, please stop pulling away from the subject.

Quote:

yeah, i misclicked. i wanted to reply here but clicked on PM instead of QUOTE.. Shame on me, wont happen again. Dont feel stalked, brother ;)

OK, I get it, sorry for jumping at that man, I thought you were pulling my leg! ;)

Once again, sorry everybody for this meandering.

2023-12-15 14:00

Frostbyte

Registered: Aug 2003
Posts: 183

OK my Final final words: partially echoing Electric, here's a wild idea: How about if we, collaboratively and retroactively, update as many graphics releases as we can with references to the original work(s), giving credit to the original author(s). This is what has been done with e.g. HVSC since day one, if a tune's original version is uncovered (either by the artists themselves or observing listeners), and no one gets butthurt about it, as they shouldn't. Usage of refs can be really obvious like with that famous pic of Lenin (where that woodwork isn't original work either, btw), or less obvious like with some reasonably unknown 3D artists. It doesn't matter.

This would NOT be to disrespect the C64 artist, but to respect the original artist, and to me, is common courtesy.

@Oswald I agree with you that the reimagined portrait of Vangelis was not the best example to spark this discussion, as there are plenty of compo entries even from the past few years that use references but it isn't mentioned, and in a demo it isn't as big of a deal as it is for "entertainment purposes" mainly. However you probably understand that Talent's claims about the originality of the source portrait which was later proven to be not true ignited the already warmed up discussion. And for a good reason. I still hope you can see the bigger picture, and the importance of graphics scene maturing their behaviour in this regard, rather than thinking that this is just a personal attack on Talent when "everyone else does it too".

2023-12-15 14:20

The Sarge

Registered: Aug 2002
Posts: 49

I agree with Electric, Frostbyte, Flotsam and probably more. You are sincerely caring for our little scene and the pixel art. Explaining well thought out ideas and taking your time to write them here. <3

This is an important discussion. We spend so much time making the graphics and we want it to be genuine and also that we compete on fair and equal grounds.

Everyone has their own style, none are more right than the other, quite the opposite! I love we having the diversity. But this is not what this is about, or being envious or whatever.
We just need to do better and make our own take on things. Everyone gets inspiration from day to day stuff. It's impossible to do 100% unique stuff. You can't go around the whole day having your eyes closed.
Being open minded and looking at things gives you ideas, a lot of ideas. And it's great! Inspiration and letting your work give birth to new ideas is the best thing. As was shown in some way in the Wired Ninja Compo. So many new funny takes on the idea that I personally never had thought of. In the context of WIRE it worked very well.

2023-12-15 15:22

Clarence

Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 121

We did meet and had a brief conversation with Talent back in 2015 at one of the Bob's pub meetings in Budapest, he told he already had a big catalog of unreleased hobby pixelworks where he used only the c64 palette for the fun of it, just to see how would it look like, but without taking into account other c64 specific limitations.
Back then Bob (or I) could not convince him to give a few images to see how would it fit into different gfx mode restrictions, he said could not care to release them or see them displayed on a c64.
I'm glad Talent changed his mind recently, and the releases with his graphics show his work can be applied to c64 format impressively good. In short: he did not come out of nowhere with this unique dithering style in a few months.

And concerning the Vangelis image as Oswald said "Talent's picture didnt even entered any compo, its just a friggin illustration in a demo", exactly.

Almost any good demo has lack of art references/workstages for the illustrations used in them. It's not Talent's fault that people voted him into #1 position, and it's not an excuse to demand from him anything.

Previous - 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | ... | 21 - Next

Refresh

Subscribe to this thread:

You need to be logged in to post in the forum.

Search the forum:
Search for in
All times are CET.

Search CSDb

Advanced

Users Online

wil/VCC^CTG
psych
sln.pixelrat
Fred/Channel 4
Guests online: 101

Top Demos

1 Next Level  (9.7)
2 13:37  (9.7)
3 Mojo  (9.6)
4 Coma Light 13  (9.6)
5 Edge of Disgrace  (9.6)
6 What Is The Matrix 2  (9.6)
7 The Demo Coder  (9.6)
8 Uncensored  (9.6)
9 Comaland 100%  (9.6)
10 Sprite Bukkake 2  (9.6)

Top onefile Demos

1 Layers  (9.7)
2 Party Elk 2  (9.6)
3 Cubic Dream  (9.6)
4 Copper Booze  (9.6)
5 Dawnfall V1.1  (9.5)
6 Rainbow Connection  (9.5)
7 Morph  (9.5)
8 Barry Boomer - Trapp..  (9.5)
9 Libertongo  (9.5)
10 Onscreen 5k  (9.5)

Top Groups

1 Booze Design  (9.3)
2 Oxyron  (9.3)
3 Performers  (9.3)
4 Censor Design  (9.3)
5 Nostalgia  (9.3)

Top Swappers

1 Derbyshire Ram  (10)
2 Jerry  (9.8)
3 Violator  (9.7)
4 Acidchild  (9.7)
5 Cash  (9.7)

Page generated in: 0.098 sec.