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Twynn
Account closed
Registered: Nov 2005
Posts: 9 |
When were the first good players made?
Yesterday I was looking trough some old demos and some old sids and I was wondering when the first good music-players were made and by who?
And with good players I mean players who were able to produce some good sounds.
If I listen to some tunes from '85 from galway, I hear some good sounds (nice filters, pulsemodulation and allready arpeggio's) but at that time I guess they didn't know how to do drums.
It seemed to me that the better routines started to appear in the end of '87 / beginning of '88.
Ofcourse we had the maniacs of noise back then with a good routine (must be somewhere in the beginning of 88?), the futurecomposer (also from charles deenen) is a bit on the edge I guess. I never liked the sounds from that one that much.
I know JCH also had a player in 88 but before that he was already making music in laxity's player which made some good sounds. 20cc also started in '88, I guess johannes bjerregaard had his own routines at that time and also Jesper olsen had his routines?
But who was first en when? |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1163 |
Hubbard's routines from end of '86 (Sanxion) or from beginning/mid '87 (Nemesis The Warlock etc.) could do quite "good" sounds, including wavetable based drums, and well controlled & variable filter, pulsemod, vibrato. Before that (the classic tunes like Commando, IK, Monty etc.) I agree they weren't that good. |
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Hate Bush
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 469 |
Check this one:
http://gallium.prg.dtu.dk/HVSC/C64Music/SoedeSoft/Soede_Jeroen/..
If it had been really made in 1985, I guess this was the first "good player", with capabilities like decent drums etc. But honestly, I doubt that the date is correct here. |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1163 |
Even if that date isn't right, Soedesoft must've been one of the first to allow wavetable programming on non-drum instruments (like some bass with noise on first frame) |
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Twynn
Account closed
Registered: Nov 2005
Posts: 9 |
If those dates are right, they had real good sounds for that time. Sounds indeed a bit like modern routines. |
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THE TEA DRINKER
Registered: Jul 2005
Posts: 39 |
Quote: Even if that date isn't right, Soedesoft must've been one of the first to allow wavetable programming on non-drum instruments (like some bass with noise on first frame)
It's more simple to do (noise) in first frame, even on older Future Composers can do that atleast with a newer 8580 sound chip haven't check with the old 6581 SID chip, but Im pretty sure this tune is made with a Future Composer Clone version 1-5, but I could be wrong.
Quote:Randall:
Check this one:
http://gallium.prg.dtu.dk/HVSC/C64Music/SoedeSoft/Soede_Jeroen/..
Address could be remapped or moved to another memory address $3800 to $4f9f sounds like a remapping address of an old Future Composer V2.0 that normal use address $1800 (init) and $3806 for playing which is on FC Version 2 is $1806.
But anyway I'm not an expert in these. So to be sure about the year of this tune you need the game, intro or demo. |
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Soren
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 547 |
Not everything depends on how good a player is. Very often it depends on the talent of the composer. But ofcourse there are better and worse players.
Many people have asked me for my (now quite old) editor, because they think it's better than the JCH editor, but it really isn't. :-)
How ever my new system is going to be quite a lot better than my old one.. supporting some quite oldschool things and all the new things aswell, so there's a wider variety of possibilities.
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Bamu®
Account closed
Registered: May 2005
Posts: 1332 |
Yeah, it's allways nice to see players that can do true oldskool songs and new things :-) |
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THE TEA DRINKER
Registered: Jul 2005
Posts: 39 |
Maybe it's more about music style and how did the composer of the tune(s) in older days got the right idea to create that sound.
I will say Rob Hubbard was good in older days but there have been alot of great composers that also have made great wellknown tunes on C64. But I can still remember when I hear Sanxion Loader tune for the first time, I didn't know how to rip tunes so I was loading the game without playing it just for listening to that sound, that took me sometime but was fun.
BTW: Which editor did you make Jeff or have I miss something? |
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DRAX
Account closed
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 225 |
I would say that the first good players were centered around Galway and Hubbard around 1985-86. Especially Galway had a really developed filter and pulse that even sound better than much of the stuff done today. Johannes Bjerregaard started of using other routines (I think it was both We-music's and Rob's) but later on developed his own around 1987. Maniacs of Noise certainly was avargardish in their way of using the arpeggio table - that was also around 1987 (when Noisy Pillars / Scoop - was released). I am not sure about Jeroen Soede I tend to think of the dates in HVSC as incorrect - much of the arpeggio sounds actually seems heavily inspired by Matt Gray (when he had his own player) - which was around 1987-88 (probably closest to 1988). Yeah, I guess that's about it. Another musician who had a good sounding player quite early was Oliver Kläwer (who had a more modern sound). Guys like Tim Follin and Frank Endler also had neat sounds but they were of a different character - where the arpeggios were used differently more like the pre-MoN periode.
DRAX |
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SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Quote: Check this one:
http://gallium.prg.dtu.dk/HVSC/C64Music/SoedeSoft/Soede_Jeroen/..
If it had been really made in 1985, I guess this was the first "good player", with capabilities like decent drums etc. But honestly, I doubt that the date is correct here.
Yes, those Soedesoft dates are clearly wrong, but Soede has insisted to the HVSC team that they are correct.
As i was swapping back in the days, the first time I see Soede's player, was in mid 1988.
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