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wreg
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 679 |
Comments on Sceners
i'd like to be able to enter just like i can on Releases
i wouldn't have to hack the comments into the trivia field if it existed ...
Joe |
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Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
Hey, I thought the EXACT same thing yesterday, when updating a few sceners.
Indeed, the trivia is the only place where you can leave additional information.
The problem with comments in a scener profile is that it might result in complete threads of communication or something.
A scener should at least be able to remove comments that others placed with his or her profile. |
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wreg
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 679 |
why should they be able to remove them?!
afaik csdb only allows this if its against the rules -> so only mods should be able to censor like all the other stuff |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11384 |
interistingly, i asked to implement that long ago...
and instead, stupid shit like tagclouds are beeing discussed.
:( |
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wreg
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 679 |
i really used the search! :-)
and yes, other things are discussed as well
let's see what perff implements next, as im still waiting for the watchlist feature... |
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Radiant
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 639 |
Tagclouds? That's just silly. Tags are shit, really.
However, a comment feature for individual sceners would be very weird, kind of a "rate my personality" feature in the case of active sceners... I doubt much good would come out of it. *envisions profile comment wars* |
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wreg
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 679 |
well, we dont need a 'personal opinion' in this case
but having a possibility to add 'facts' is needed |
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Perff
Administrator
Posts: 1679 |
So you want to be able to comment on sceners just like commenting on groups or events? (They resemble what I think you want more than commenting on releases)
There isn't some hidden additional wish below? ;)
Edit: What should this comment field be called? (After seeing Wregs latest post) |
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
I think this would only make place for endless bitchings. Dont. |
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Perff
Administrator
Posts: 1679 |
Actually this was also why we didn't make it in the first place. The table actually exists in the database, but not the code.
What type of info should these "comment"-fields be used for anyway?
As already mentions I don't think it should be used for 'personal oppinions' like "I like this guy because .." or "I hate this sucker..." This will only cause problems. |
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
Scener comments? Ouch, don't we have enough fighting going on already? I can see that sort of thing being used and abused for some not-very-nice things. Please don't add anything like that :/ |
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wreg
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 679 |
'additional information (no personal opinions please)'
perhaps something like that |
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Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Total nonsense, Comments and Votes on SID entries would be a lot more appreciated |
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
Quote: 'additional information (no personal opinions please)'
perhaps something like that
"additional information: he sucks!"
:D |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11384 |
Quote:
Scener comments? Ouch, don't we have enough fighting going on already? I can see that sort of thing being used and abused for some not-very-nice things.
this is already happening anyway. and i'd rather see that crap in a comment which i can just ignore than in the "trivia" field which really shouldnt contain random stuff like that. |
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Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
Ok, let's wrap it up and not add it.
Trivia will suffice for now.
I think the search/browse function needs some tweaking instead.
And what Stainless Steel said: comments on SIDs would be a nice feature too. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11384 |
comments on sids are redundant though. you can always comment on the music in the release it was used in. (yes that rules out .sid only releases, which is a good thing, imho) |
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
Quote:why should they be able to remove them?!
Wreg: isn't it enough to have your funny timbaland comparison in the comment to your actual release, do you really have to stick it in the trivia section of the person's profile too?
Did you come up with this idea just so you can tag the profile of every graphics type person who has released copies, dating back to the start of the scene? Every musician who has done a cover? Because that sounds like a lot of work to me. :/
Or is it just a general anti-Wrath/anti-Joe thing? |
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wreg
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 679 |
i am in discussion about that comment with ed already... yet no decision has been made from his side
---
ed mentioned this anti-wrath/-joe thing as well...
i cannot remember right now, and have no hard feelings
could you point me to a place where i mentioned/did something like that?? |
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
Quote:afaik csdb only allows this if its against the rules -> so only mods should be able to censor like all the other stuff
Who watches the watchmen?
As we've seen, some mods are capable of adding trivia to someone's profile without contacting the person first, comparing the person with Timbaland. I'm not sure I'd feel safe about proper and unfair censorship from the moderators based on that sort of conduct.
Keep the dirt to the releases, imho. And let people keep ownership of their own profile pages please.
And I just remember you were asking for a function to be added so you could filter out WD releases and not have to see them in the new releases box earlier, that's all. |
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Ed
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 173 |
Ok The trivia is removed from Joe. FINAL!
Also I think that any user should have a right to be able to edit his/her's own information, especially considering those still active and not unactive.
There are many violations here guys. and Please Wreg. You where the one that wanted to make a special filter for WD only and now you are updating information on other people and demand user comments?
I think it is all too obvious what such things could be used for if not even more abuse. |
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wreg
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 679 |
<Post edited by wreg on 12/12-2007 19:03>
yes, joe pointed me to that as well
it was nothing personal just the flood of the old-releases which bugged me back then. could have been any group/scener
that is imo was a good point to bug perff about adding more filter possibilities
the sceners page was not locked, thats why i just added it
so this case has nothing to do with watchmen.
anyway, you all watch them, we have seen this before and it's good, no doubt about that
if there is a serious info added to a sceners page, the 'owner' (as you like to call it, though its wrong, he doesn't own this information, afair, it of no importance what i think here though, would have not influenced this situation...) should not be allowed to remove it, just because its inconvenient or anything in this direction, that should be restricted to mods and thats what i meant, dunno if it was unclear before
the release i found today (whether it be true or not, which should be the more important thing to invest) contains some nice info and i tried to place it anywhere it could be of interest, that was to me joe's page and the release page of the demo where 'the copy' was used.
*sigh*
i wish i would have never found this release or it would have been another group (imo) 'flooding' csdb with releases back then
i pretty much forgot about the filtering-incident long time ago...
i swear i did NOT search for a 'fuck joe/antic'-release :-))
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
Wreg, do you truly believe that people have no right to edit the information that is added to their profile?
Is this the general opinion among all the moderators, that every bit of slander and dirt should be added to someone's profile for the sake of preservation?
If so, could we please elect some new moderators plzkthx. |
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wreg
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 679 |
pls read post#3 again: it should only be removed if it is against the rules and if users have this possibility they would probably remove every inconvienient comment
i dont remember where i read that, but if my memory serves right, ppl should not be able to edit everything they dislike from their profile, we had then when some users demanded deletion of their users profile, its not their property...
else we will have big holes in this database of history, whatever was there, should be here as well
shouldnt make any difference of what i think about this anyway, we have rules and we should obey to them
just because i have some other opions shouldn't disqualify me or anyone else beeing a mod!?
we (the users) can always try to change the rules (petitions anyone!?) ppl will have different opinions on that, for sure, but imho you shouldnt pick mods out of the ones which shared the common opinion :) |
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
A profile doesn't really need more info than this:
the handle and links to releases where that person was credited.
Anything beyond that information...it should be up to the person behind that handle how much information is published.
For preservation purposes, the releases are still there.
There really is no good reason to publish every piece of dirt you can dig up about someone on their profile. |
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Ed
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 173 |
I also vote for a serious reconsideration of some of the moderators and the ways some things have been handling here.
you should leave your post tonight, dear WREG.
The release, as you put it "have found" has been known for quite a while at least for some of us that have been around, but thanks for "finding it" and putting it up here.
The analogue you did to Timbaland seemed very up to date, but far fetched in many ways. It was not even close to something like the
Timbaland story back in the day and besides with that type of mentality we have dousin thieves on csdb to watch, but you had to pick JOE didn't you?
It is all too obvious.
Things have changed over the years, and like many we worked our ass off during the years, made tons of releases,
made tons of new trivia's to write about. Moved to new places, changed our gender, changed our work & changed our looks.
But if all this ends up with some one else editing my information, my trivia, my photo and come up with the ideas of
commenting me, my brother, my fellow friends (even commenting the groups seem to have large flaws and
should have been kept out in the first place!) then it stinks. Yes, it is really that simple.
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
I meant to write handle, *group(s)*, and releases, of course. |
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Ed
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 173 |
I think there is no such thing as a moderator switching
back and forth from moderator over to user mode.
As a moderator you have a responsibility, and it includes
your "own behaviour", it implies editing, weird and foul language and abuse.
/Eddie aka -if I had the time, and technical possibilities
I would take u up on that offer, Trazan!
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
Also, it is very easy to sit there and say "people don't own their profiles" when you don't even have a profile here yourself, isn't it? |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11384 |
vanja has a poin there ... <3
however, as for who owns what information, read the rules. we already protect personal information more than we have to (and much more than most other scene sites, go figure).
but i also strongly disagree with putting "comments" (which reflect a personal opinion of some user) into the "trivia" section (which should reflect only factual information) of a profile or release. (and for that reason, i'd like to see comments beeing possible for sceners entries), |
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Ed
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 173 |
@Groepaz: hmm was not the comments possible already for the releases? :D
Further I think that the group comments should be removed and
everyone should have a larger P.M. Button. It would solve a lot of things.
well ehm. At least if we forget about the spam mail that can also happen on the PM.
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
Groepaz: if the rules say it is ok to add comparisons between timbaland and scener X to scener X' profile and that scener X can't do anything about it, then the rules need to be adjusted imho.
And a MODERATOR (who does NOT have a csdb profile and has aparently NEVER released anything for the C64 worthy of adding to this database, correct me if I am wrong please) adding such important information ("hey, JOE was the timbaland of 1992 woot") to the database is also ok according to the rules?
Is this what the database is about, recording all sorts of shit and mistakes from the past and putting it on the person's profile for all eternity? The releases are still there, and those who are interested in diving into the sewage to retrieve shit about people have an abundance of material to chose from, isn't that enough? Should every mistake a person has done be listed on their profile?
Keep it to the releases, imho, and stop smearing whatever feces you dig up over people's profiles. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11384 |
i totally agree with you vanja, my comment was in no way ment to protect anyone adding crap to some profile. i just wanted to point at the rulez, which define what info is "owned" by an individual scener, and which is considered public. |
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Ed
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 173 |
@Vanja: totally agree. Disc magazines where used to report all kinds of stuff and some times even demos
where made to write bollocks and send some love letters. There are by the way some recent love letters that
might be found from some cracker that used to work from some cracker group, by the way.
I can see a problem here: The scroll-texts can contain crap stuff and it is still not late to make a scroll text.
A forum thread can contain crap stuff and it is never too late to write that, and so forth. and so on.
A comment of a release is one thing. And we have all witnessed over the few days what kind of BITCHING TOPIC
that it can turn out to be.
All in all it should be about finding proper releases, release-dates (and I still vote for CREATION-DATE)
And please. Respect all the active few left.
If all there is left is about making H A T E and NAG demos, then atleast go home and produce more demos!
(that last part was not seriously meant of course... )
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
Groepaz: But if you enable people to add comments to people's profiles, you open a pandora's box with all sorts of crap and grudges.
As this example with the Timbaland comment proves, you aparently can't expect moderators to be above that sort of behaviour either...so forgive me if I don't really feel safe about leaving it to the moderators to weed out the crap that doesn't belong on people's profiles.
Quote:If you find an entry in CSDb missing, which you know should be there, and think this is a mistake - or if you by accident deletes something yourself, you can contact the admin.
We keep backups of all deletions, and can restore records that are deleted.
There are some people dosn't want there scener-record to be in CSDb, or perhaps their releases, so if this is the case we will not restore the entry
Is this ^^ outdated information? If so maybe the FAQ should be updated. It looks from that text like the CSDb *does* take into consideration that not everyone wants to be part of it, which makes me wonder, why is it ok to delete all your info but not to claim ownership of your own profile? |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11384 |
Quote:
Groepaz: But if you enable people to add comments to people's profiles, you open a pandora's box with all sorts of crap and grudges.
it's not much different now, is it? =P
Quote:
Is this ^^ outdated information? If so maybe the FAQ should be updated. It looks from that text like the CSDb *does* take into consideration that not everyone wants to be part of it, which makes me wonder, why is it ok to delete all your info but not to claim ownership of your own profile?
this does indeed look like it slipped through when we updated the rules (the faq wasnt updated at this point) |
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yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 333 |
"As this example with the Timbaland comment proves, you aparently can't expect moderators to be above that sort of behaviour either."
Well, if a moderator behaves like this, he is not a moderator, at least not in the definition of the word moderator.
What good is a moderator, if he brings up trouble, instead of calming it down?
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Joe
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 229 |
"Submitted by wreg [PM] on 12 December 2007
according to Fuck Antic, joe was the timbaland in those days
perhaps someone here should change the graphics-credits :)"
@wreg:
Hm. Well obviously I made some logos in that demo as well, so the credits is still valid! Not for this specific piece though, which was a remake from another artist picture. It's a shame that this old release "fuck Antic" wasn't here all ready. But it seems like after yesterdays flaw (joke) of Mirage was so heavily discussed, I'd guess you guys wanted a new drama...
Well, this drama is around 15 years old by now, and I guess I've made several original things afterwards. And the specific file "fuck Antic" was ofcourse widely spread during that time. Heh! I even got it from several of my mail-contacts.
And in the case of the explanation from Depeh/Antic, you can search through the Explorer-magazines. I think there was a official statement about the mistake of using that remake (a personal test as I "grew" as artist, lending a bit here and there - this one wasn't meant to be released at all).
Calling me a Timbaland of that time is a rough remark, and since I noticed you edited my user I think I must agree with others that you stepped over the line. In the future please don't be so eager with the fingers... And if you search after drama, please have in mind that the drama might be played on your behalf.
I simply think this is utterly silly.
/James Svärd [Joe/Wrath Designs] |
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Joe
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 229 |
@wreg:
And besides...
What ever fantastic things did you do for our scene? Why can't I find you in the search-field (CSDb) in the first place? Are you even a c64-scener? Are you active and in what field, in what sense?
Or maybe I should raise the question to the rest of you participating this scene: Who is this guy and what did he do for us? Do we have a link of this prick?
Now, didn't I entertain a lot of you during the year with my strange things? And in one sense, might still? I hope my own 15+ years of scene-activity wasn't all too wasted. And this goes for Mirage/Focus as well: Isn't his art fantastic? And weren't your reactions the other day just too far fetched? Come on you guys, r e l a x
/James Svärd [Joe/Wrath Designs] |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
I also think that comments on sceners aren't good idea. I can imagine how that would end. Every (un)popular scener would get a lot of more-or-less "important and true facts" attached to their profiles and if moderators will eventually decide to sort that out someone will start to accuse them of restraining the free speech and all that crap.
No. No and once again No! ;-))
Besides. I don't want to have someone mentioning my pissing from the stairs at X-2001 in the comments under my profile ;-)). It !never happened!!! ;-) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11384 |
Quote:
Besides. I don't want to have someone mentioning my pissing from the stairs at X-2001 in the comments under my profile ;-)). It !never happened!!! ;-)
i'll put it in trivia then =) |
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Joe
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 229 |
@the C64-scene and CSDb Users:
How come most of you hide under alias, which doesn't even give links to persons real or imagined when I sort you out of the "Users online" and try to pick you out of the list? Are you even c64 sceners? Why do you hide? And why don't you sort things out so that we know who is who, and what is what?
Is this a public forum or not?
/James Svärd [Joe/Wrath Designs] |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
Quote: @the C64-scene and CSDb Users:
How come most of you hide under alias, which doesn't even give links to persons real or imagined when I sort you out of the "Users online" and try to pick you out of the list? Are you even c64 sceners? Why do you hide? And why don't you sort things out so that we know who is who, and what is what?
Is this a public forum or not?
/James Svärd [Joe/Wrath Designs]
I'm sure I'm not alone who have more problems to recognise abreviations of some WD members with less known initials than to recognise people behind the scener handles that some of the "users online" used for years.
And btw. there is a real name in the profiles of some of the handles that appears in the list of "users online". |
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Conrad
Registered: Nov 2006
Posts: 849 |
Some may be here for either nostalgic reasons, or that they just don't want to acquaint with us. |
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Joe
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 229 |
@CreaMD:
Well at least we sorted out that you could handle the "press the user online" tag linked to the proper user page?
There are several users online daily which doesnt even give result other than "not found". I could easily fix my name to Joe/WD again and the rest of the members as well so no need of complaints... And the rest was the result of a "handy man" earlier this year... (No names)
It's obviously more (apparently) annoying when the search result ends in "not found"? Especially with so called Moderators?
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11384 |
Quote:
It's obviously more (apparently) annoying when the search result ends in "not found"? Especially with so called Moderators?
again, i totally agree :) users that dont link their login to their profile SUCK. DIE! =P |
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stash
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 343 |
now this is data weeeeeeeeeeeeee \o/ |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
Ok ok. I agree with both of you guys. But unfortunatelly, in some cases CSDB users aren't sceners, and forcing them to create fake scener profiles just to make them appear more valid wouldn't help it. Maybe the CSDB user profile itself should be extended (and accessible) to decrease the anonymity of the unknown handles. |
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stash
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 343 |
solution for that problem would be
"force them to become sceners" |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11384 |
Quote:
But unfortunatelly, in some cases CSDB users aren't sceners
let's start with linking all scener's users to their entries then. |
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Joe
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 229 |
Yes it's obvious that CSDb should be run by C64 sceners only (preferably respected members, through the years (still active) or in the past renowned by their work (inactive)) and no fake users added whatsoever: At least not in the sense they where doing funny stuff (like releasing propaganda, war-demos, jokes or simply fake-fakes - which ofcourse as seen before could be linked to the proper user page, when found :)) Lets keep the c64 scene to the c64 scene and not invite filth from outdoors ;P And let those moderators and users link to their proper user page, so we know who is which when we click our handy fingers on the right hand side - or whatever browser/setting etc we have made. |
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yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 333 |
There should also be a Page, where the Moderators are presented, so that one can address them easily...
Its kinda secret club atm, nobody knows who is moderator or how many are there.
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Mermaid
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 338 |
Yago: Help -> Introduction
Quote:Site moderators:
CreaMD, Zyron, Trazan, Wreg, Dishy, The Communist, Groepaz
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Conrad
Registered: Nov 2006
Posts: 849 |
i ofcourse have a lot of agreement with many good sceners here, but unfortunately i do not fully agree with tthe main subject of this thread. being an active forum poster is one thing, but speding all your time commenting of sceners that you may secretly not get on with, for whatever reason, is just a waste of your quality time of being actually productive. seeing knoeki release some quite reaosnable releases this day gone, is what i call being a c64 scener, no matter how good the release is. props to that!
aaah bollocks, it's xmas ffs!! im tired and drunk..
Quote:
Oswald:
I think this would only make place for endless bitchings. Dont.
indeed 200% or maybe more !! |
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Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Quoting Groepazcomments on sids are redundant though. you can always comment on the music in the release it was used in. (yes that rules out .sid only releases, which is a good thing, imho)
That can only come from a coder.
No sir, comments and votes on sids are not redundant.
I think being able to vote on a sid is a dire missed feature here on csdb.
And naturally, if I vote on something then I (AS ANYONE WHO ISNT A ANONYMOUS COWARD) want to leave a comment on the tune aswell, expressing my feelings about it.
You can Vote on everything and it's dog here, but SID's are totally being discriminated.
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
Quote: Quoting Groepazcomments on sids are redundant though. you can always comment on the music in the release it was used in. (yes that rules out .sid only releases, which is a good thing, imho)
That can only come from a coder.
No sir, comments and votes on sids are not redundant.
I think being able to vote on a sid is a dire missed feature here on csdb.
And naturally, if I vote on something then I (AS ANYONE WHO ISNT A ANONYMOUS COWARD) want to leave a comment on the tune aswell, expressing my feelings about it.
You can Vote on everything and it's dog here, but SID's are totally being discriminated.
I still (even in 2007) think that it is important to preffer EXECUTABLES before the data formats that need some tool to dis(play) them. Therefore I don't think that standalone SID files are dicriminated here.
Also as Groepaz said. The music mostly becomes recognised and appreciated thanx to various other things that surounds it or that comes with it. I dare to say that music is one of the most important things which makes games and demos stand-out and legendary.
roman |
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Britelite
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 51 |
Quote: Quoting Groepazcomments on sids are redundant though. you can always comment on the music in the release it was used in. (yes that rules out .sid only releases, which is a good thing, imho)
That can only come from a coder.
No sir, comments and votes on sids are not redundant.
I think being able to vote on a sid is a dire missed feature here on csdb.
And naturally, if I vote on something then I (AS ANYONE WHO ISNT A ANONYMOUS COWARD) want to leave a comment on the tune aswell, expressing my feelings about it.
You can Vote on everything and it's dog here, but SID's are totally being discriminated.
Yeah, and why are all the graphics and effects discriminated against?? I want to comment and vote for every single picture and effect in prods too!! |
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Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Quoting briteliteYeah, and why are all the graphics and effects discriminated against?? I want to comment and vote for every single picture and effect in prods too!!
ZOMGFX!!ONEELEVENHUNDRED11
You may wipe the foam from your mouth now.
I understand you felt the need to say something,
i didn't get the point of it though.
Sids allready have "pseudo" entries.
Effects although, do not.
Ofcourse you may request the same priviliges for effects and gfx, thats totally up to you.
The current situation is, SID's allready seem to have a "pseudo" entry. But without the posibility to vote or comment on it.
Thats a half ass job there, sorry.
PS: No, im not talking about the .SID issue here.
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Joe
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 229 |
And again, why don't we get those extra gb/mb's whatever so that talented new people deserve to get those screenshots updated? Haha, what a laugh this is.
James |
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Joe
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 229 |
*Nevermind:
Perff just solved the problem it seems. Enjoy:
Disturbing Klas
(just added a screendump) ;)
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Steppe
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 1510 |
Yeah (once more), voting and commenting on sids would rock. Would save our lazy HVSC asses to create that long planned Web2.0 HVSC which we'll never get done anyway. So why not just bundle efforts and do it here? |
