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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1932 |
Trilogic Expert Cartridge
Howdy hackers ... *g*
As stuff piles up here we are looking to update https://rr.pokefinder.org/wiki/Expert_Cartridge and while the category ( https://rr.pokefinder.org/wiki/Category:Expert_Cartridge ) has all kind of content already we found some pictures are definately missing.
https://rr.pokefinder.org/rrwiki/images/e/ec/Your_Commodore_Iss..
shows "The E.S.M." to be plugged between Expert and C64 to provide additional freezing logic.
Does anybody own "The E.S.M." and would mind to open it to produce photos? Or sell it to me? :)
Btw, around 1986 Expert was in the UK priced at:
28.95 - 31.95 Pound (no ESM)
37.50 Pound (including ESM)
7.95 Pound "The E.S.M." Addon
They also had an exchange program at some point, so getting back old carts and likely re-selling them sure was a nice biz model as well? :)
(Pounds * ~3,2 to get the german DM prices for that time :) )
Also looking for anything else not online yet (there) of course! :) |
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Knight Rider
Registered: Mar 2005
Posts: 131 |
Only these
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LordCrass
Registered: Apr 2023
Posts: 8 |
I think the lower-left picture on this page is the cart with the ESM attached:
https://www.c64copyprotection.com/the-expert-cartridge/ |
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HOL2001
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 97 |
Uploaded a bunch of pictures of my Expert Cartridge.
It is the C & K version. Dunno if there is any difference to the Trilogic version.
You can get them here:
https://krakenfiles.com/view/xI07osq1nh/file.html |
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Knight Rider
Registered: Mar 2005
Posts: 131 |
No idea what you've posted here Holger but in addition to opening loads of other spammy pages, it also tried to send sms to 18 numbers from my phone too
 |
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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1932 |
LordCrass - thanks for the pointer. Missed the image showing it. Thats the ESM AddOn obv.
HOL2001: Got the same C&K versions here. Thx for the images - pls delete now, so others dont use kraken anymore :) |
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HOL2001
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 97 |
Hi Mike,
dunno what's the problem here.
I don't get any spam/popups.
Maybe some Addblocker etc. might be useful at your side?
However, here is a link to the images for those who don't trust krakenfiles. :)
https://postimg.cc/gallery/bSFm9sP |
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Knight Rider
Registered: Mar 2005
Posts: 131 |
Yours is different to my C+K (mine has no ESM at all). My Trilogic with the button on the side with the label must be the 1st release ESM version with a hand soldered daughter board on the back. |
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Bacchus
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 156 |
I have a few but deep in the dungeon. Traveling and home late tonight, so if I remember it Ill so it...
/Bacchus |
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AlexC
Registered: Jan 2008
Posts: 299 |
I'll bump the topic by adding that there used to be a Expert user club publishing some disk, and those disks (or maybe it was just a single disk) would be very valuable too. I've been searching for those for quite some time. Probably they were available only in UK and since Expert had very strong competitor: Action Replay I guess this was very niche release and being spread as widely like cracks or demos. Who ever has those disk please stand up and share ;) |
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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1932 |
Luckily Draven (used to be active on Lemon64) gave us all his Expert related stuff before he died.
https://rr.pokefinder.org/wiki/Category:Expert_Cartridge has the Expertize issues up to number 14 that he collected. That issue says on the last page that they offer a "blank Expert O/S" for 3 pounds which would include enough documentation to puzzle your own Expert.
(It also says issue 15 would be large...)
That "blank Expert O/S" and its docs appear to be only thing missing - The pile of binaries we still have here are either text hacks or small changes on versions and "just" need sorting (sigh).
We are also looking for photos of opened "Trilogic" carts without ESM to compare against https://rr.pokefinder.org/wiki/File:Expert_Cartridge_with_and_w..
Suspecting that Trilogic either drilled their boards similar or there was another production run for the earlier Experts when ESM wasnt even planned maybe? |
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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1932 |
Sigh ... while sorting out on the available Expert software we found at least two more major points of interest.
The first decribes a USER port cartridge which supports the Expert Cartridge in the EXPANSION port and makes the 8k freeze cart a 64K freeze cart. We are SOOOO puzzled:
and
WHOEVER owns this (RAM pack, RAMBOX or RAMBO X) thing: SELL it to us, rip it apart to check schematics and firmware - SHOUT UP LOUD NOW!
The other oddity we came across: Only a strangely changed 1.x "firmware" was to be found so far and NO TAPE software dumps apart from a 3.2 dump were found so far. VERY unlikely for a UK based product! Where are the other TAP dumps (with early likely unchanged softwares)?
PLEASE search your archives for early disks/tapes and your roof for strange carts! |
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AlexC
Registered: Jan 2008
Posts: 299 |
@CZ amazing find, never have heard or seen any of Rambo X, but I wonder how >=3.1 Expert cartridge supports it since I don't recall any mention of it either in docs or in software itself. Looking forward to any further info about it. |
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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1932 |
Still in the process of versioning and comparing softwares. Indeed there should be some major change somewhere to support this "thing."
At the very end of the v2.x manual there is another mention of the rampack. No photos or anything alike yet :(
Whoever wants to pass us donations anyhow - THATs nice :) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
That userport ram thing is seriously WTF indeed >_< |
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Colt45RPM
Registered: Feb 2019
Posts: 47 |
It says 'Patent Applied For'. Maybe a way to find some info? |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Nothing on google patents at least (searched for "Trilogic") ... does anyone have a name of a person that was involved? :) |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1790 |
John Twiddy? |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
no dice :( |
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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1932 |
Found a text about the "rambox" having been cancelled - more than half a year after those adverts :(
 from https://rr.pokefinder.org/wiki/File:Commodore-disk-user-issue-0.. |
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AlexC
Registered: Jan 2008
Posts: 299 |
That would explain why there were basically no traces of RamboX in form of hardware or software. Overall it is a sad news for me, since the idea could be cool while implementation could be interesting. It is always thrilling to uncover new hardware from the past for c64 after all those years.
Haven't heard about Phantom system before. Can anyone share some more details about it?
BTW: idea to extend Expert with battery would be brilliant IMHO. Programming it every time after power-off cycle has been time consuming. |
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Stryyker
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 468 |
https://github.com/COREi64/The-Phantom discusses it - speeds up 1541 |
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Knight Rider
Registered: Mar 2005
Posts: 131 |
I also asked icore64 to make a modern expert cartridge with battery backup too... he claims its on his list |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
That is almost trivial though, its a single static RAM chip on there - all you need is a battery and a diode (or two). |
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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1932 |
Nice to see The Phantom on github now.
As there wasnt a single person interested in taking over some Jiffy or other speeder parts those will have to wait a little longer for full packaging and wiki release.
Expert will be updated soonish however and it seems the only question left is: Why was the 3.2 Expert software the only one delivered on tape (as we found so far).
We would have expected e.g. the 1.x software with just a few blocks being spread as tapes as well. Instead we didnt even find 1.x original dumps (disks OR tapes) yet :(
PLEASE check your archives while we try to figure a proper way to present these MANY MANY software versions. ;) |
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Pugsy
Registered: Jul 2004
Posts: 6 |
Well I definitely had the John Twiddy version (2.10) on tape - which came with the cartridge. The expert programming screen is still burnt on my retinas from the number of times I had to reload it... |
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andym00
Registered: Jun 2009
Posts: 45 |
Quote: https://github.com/COREi64/The-Phantom discusses it - speeds up 1541
Had two Phantoms back in the day, they were very fast things indeed.. I gave one to The Jester and kept the other, which ultimately (familiar story) went to the dump when my parents emptied my junk in loft the sometime in the 90s.. |
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AlexC
Registered: Jan 2008
Posts: 299 |
Quote: https://github.com/COREi64/The-Phantom discusses it - speeds up 1541
Thanks for the link - very interesting stuff.
Brief inspection of included ROM disassembly (great work BTW) seems not to contain promised disk drive monitor. I also noticed that it seems some commands functionality is still unknown. |
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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1932 |
Wonder how much a Prophet would currently go for - a complete set ofc.
Then again there are so many setups nowadays - who needs another.
Pugsy - 2.x taps would be extremely loved as well! :)
ANYBODY else with Expert Cart tapes? Whenever you have no possibilites of dumping them, contact me pls! |
