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PAL
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 292 |
want to code
OK dudes... I need to start coding. I am in the need to get up and running... I am a fool and an idiot but I know a lot about the c64 and I know how to but not in code. I need someone who can guide me to start to be a coder, that said it is not like I want to be feed with links... I want to start coding with you as a guide and my mentor!
My dream: is there someone who can put aside one hour a day or second day with me and that know how to make me understand the basics so that I can expand on my own? I know nothing in commands and such as of start we can assume.
I know it might sound stupid but are there anyone out there who could do this? with me?
I can pay back with logos, graphics, part ideas and such...
pal of offence |
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Martin Piper
Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 722 |
Quoting Groepaz
however, all this doesnt matter a lot when it comes to the original question. a beginner cant just blindly copy stuff, then he wont learn anything.
But it's very rarely blindly copying stuff though especially with the C64 scene where we don't have much of a concept of binary libs like a high level language compiler would do. In the C64 scene we mostly work with source modules and that code needs to be integrated into the project somewhat.
The only real exception to this would be things like music players that tend to be tied to the data in one big blob. Or maybe turbo loaders which tend to operate in isolation.
Anyway, integrating source code into a project generally speaking isn't blindly done because there is some visibility of the code and hence learning involved. For example zero page space or memory space needs to be defined. Or data passing to or from the routines needs to be studied because calling conventions for register or stack use tend not to be globally defined.
So that's why I think in general it's better for a beginner to take source code modules, learn to use them with their own glue code, then when their skills increase they can go back study them in more detail, perhaps improve them or write new modules similar from scratch.
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:But it's very rarely blindly copying stuff though especially with the C64 scene where we don't have much of a concept of binary libs like a high level language compiler would do.
you obviously completely missed how certain "coders" did (and some still do) work. you can find more than enough examples right here in the forum where certain ppl ask the most weird questions because their copypasted code doesnt really work as they thought.
and "routine disks" with binaries of commonly used things (a raster routine, a scroller, a memory copy, etc blabla - very often ripped from other peoples demos) were common back in the days too. it is what allowed lamers who cant even rip the shit to come up with a "demo" too =P |
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Radiant
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 639 |
Quote:Until someone actually works in the games industry they've very little idea about how things are really done.
As someone who works in the games industry I would like to add that I find that statement completely ridiculous. |
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Martin Piper
Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 722 |
Quote: Quote:Until someone actually works in the games industry they've very little idea about how things are really done.
As someone who works in the games industry I would like to add that I find that statement completely ridiculous.
Well what I meant was "Until someone actually works in the games industry they've very little idea about how things are really done [in the games industry]".
I mean lots of people outside of the games industry seem to have lots of weird ideas about how people did their work back in the old days. |
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algorithm
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 705 |
Yes a ridiculous statement that implies that who ever does not work in the games industry does not have a clue. No clue about coding? or no clue about how fragmented things can be working in the industry?:-) |
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algorithm
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 705 |
Ok. Just read your last post :-) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:I mean lots of people outside of the games industry seem to have lots of weird ideas about how people did their work back in the old days.
it pretty much boils down to "lots of people who were outside of the game industry back in the days..." though. and on top of this, lots of people who made covertape grade games back in the 80s mistake it for the "games industry". (if that counts, i was into the games industry back in the days too - and tons of sceners for that matter) |
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Martin Piper
Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 722 |
Quoting algorithmOk. Just read your last post :-)
Heh. Actually now I think about it some newbies even those in the industry seem to have weird ideas about how the old days were. Almost like we would have flipped switches or used punch cards or fired electrons from our fingertips.
I think after Imagine went kaput the industry started growing up. Games projects were really starting to be expensive longer projects. We had to have process for our product development else we lost pots of cash. |
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Martin Piper
Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 722 |
Quote: Quote:I mean lots of people outside of the games industry seem to have lots of weird ideas about how people did their work back in the old days.
it pretty much boils down to "lots of people who were outside of the game industry back in the days..." though. and on top of this, lots of people who made covertape grade games back in the 80s mistake it for the "games industry". (if that counts, i was into the games industry back in the days too - and tons of sceners for that matter)
Ahh yes darling old Tusari. It didn't start life as a cover tape game, it got shelved by the publisher along with lots of other games around that time due to the 16 bits. Selling to Zzap was one way to recoup some money.
That was a lesson in contracts and how to demand money up front for development costs. After getting a bit burned it put me in a good position to do things a bit more properly the next time at a larger more secure company. |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:It didn't start life as a cover tape game, it got shelved by the publisher along with lots of other games around that time due to the 16 bits.
and i said "cover tape grade" because i am referring to the general quality. (and you cant deny that if it had turrican qualities, there'd be no reason to shelve it because of 16bits)
there are lots and lots of that kind of games, made by people who certainly were not "in the industry" - but rather dreamt of it. hell an entire magazine industry lived from "publishing" that shite made by hobbyists.
Quote:That was a lesson in contracts and how to demand money up front for development costs.
hehe one other important thing i learned from manfred: "royalties" equal "no money" =) (unless you are VERY lucky) |
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