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The Phantom
Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 360 |
Splits and Side-Border demos
Hey y'all...
I've recently found one of my projects, and it made me curious.
Are there any demos that use the side-borders AND have raster splits?
My old idea turned out to be quite tedious, so I stopped coding it. In seeing it again, I'm curious if anybody else has gone through the process, and really curious as to how they used the routines.
A link is provided under this. It shows I have my sprites in the side-borders AND has raster-splits (blue, purple, lt. blue and cyan). I have music playing, which you can't hear (obviously). That timing is displayed in the side-border (using that old inc $d020 dec $d020 trick). Also, you will be able to move forward or backward in the link, to view other pictures of other stuff. You can ignore that ;)
(those ARE wood carvings I made ;) )
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f245/festeezio/blah_zpsitjbot.. |
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Kickback
Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 97 |
Yea there are a couple. I think Bones did 1, Shadows did 1, and MegaStyle. Lookup those guys and you'll find them. |
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Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2980 |
1988 called, they want their effects back. |
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The Phantom
Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 360 |
Really Krill?
I thought I asked you to stop answering my phone when you clean my house?
Just know, I don't care how old the effect is. They can always be improved on, unlike your personality.
If you've nothing productive to say, and obviously can't stay on topic, then please, STFU. |
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Dane
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 423 |
You will find some splits and open side-border in Time Machine. |
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The Phantom
Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 360 |
@Dane - WOW... I forgot about that one... AWESOME...
Such a wonderful effect that is. 6 splits and 9 sprites in the side borders.. Incredible.. I only have 5 splits and would never have thought of a 9th sprite..
Thanks Dane :D |
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tlr
Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1790 |
Splits + border was quite common around 1988-1989 as I recall it. Didn't Horizon do lots of these? |
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JackAsser
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 2014 |
Quote: Really Krill?
I thought I asked you to stop answering my phone when you clean my house?
Just know, I don't care how old the effect is. They can always be improved on, unlike your personality.
If you've nothing productive to say, and obviously can't stay on topic, then please, STFU.
If you want to find an effect to improve I dare say you just picked the hardest one. Maybe more sprites over FLI is harder. Hey, now that you're on it, why not implement uflimax, nobody still haven't and I'm sure it's possible. :) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
booooring |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quoting tlrSplits + border was quite common around 1988-1989 as I recall it.
Yeah, there's probably hundreds of variations on the general theme from that time (getting well into the thousands if you're not looking for Y movement or using sprite stretching) like Krill basically said; just off the top of my head and probably only remembering favourites, there are examples from Fairlight (Rutig Banan is a personal favourite because it's got the "traditional" DYSP with splits and a couple of scrolls which play with other registers like sprite colour or X expansion), Upfront (Mixer), Asia (High-Tec(H)), Tronix (Tomorrows Mirror, No Limits at All or Weird Limits), Origo (Abortion or Coitus), Triad (No Booze), Censor (still love the screenshot of Wonderland III) and i don't even know where to start with Crest! =-) |
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Cresh
Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 354 |
Tits and Side-Border demos is what we demand. |
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The Phantom
Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 360 |
Fantastic!
Thanks Everyone.. I'm sure I'll have some fun looking at these productions, even if for nostalgic value.
Also, I wasn't really looking to improve on an old routine, my routine just sort of happened. I was curious if anybody had actually done splits with a border kill and man, seeing Time Machine again, with the DYSP, 9 sprites and 6 splits.. Makes me think WTF am I doing?!
And please consider I'm an NTSC coder. Most of the stuff PAL groups do hasn't been done over here and often, I appreciate a good challenge.
A GOOD for instance is my border sprite stretcher is "sort of" similar to NTSC II [ntsc] . They have a better, more fluid stretch, mine is practically double the size, and I haven't quite figured out a good balance with the stretch data.
I'm not looking to beat any records though, not at all. But if I do, it would be a first (for me), and probably only last a couple days before someone takes it back. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quoting CreshTits and Side-Border demos is what we demand.
What, do the tits have to be in the borders or just tits and sideborders on the same screen...?
Quoting The PhantomThanks Everyone.. I'm sure I'll have some fun looking at these productions, even if for nostalgic value.
Most of those demos are still pretty hardcore even if there are better examples after them.
Quoting The PhantomA GOOD for instance is my border sprite stretcher is "sort of" similar to NTSC II [ntsc] . They have a better, more fluid stretch, mine is practically double the size, and I haven't quite figured out a good balance with the stretch data.
Check Censor's PAL stuff because that's just a pared down version of the disk change part from Wonderland IX (and Wonderland X) which is probably about twice as tall...
Quoting The PhantomI'm not looking to beat any records though, not at all. But if I do, it would be a first (for me), and probably only last a couple days before someone takes it back.
Most of the records come from nearly thirty years of hammering from some of the brightest minds going, even getting in the same general area will take a fuckton of lateral thinking, experience, ibuprofen and caffeine. Unroll all the loops, use self mod all the way, precalc anything even vaguely time intensive and, when none of that gets you even halfway to what the best examples are doing, try figuring out a good way to cheat. |
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The Phantom
Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 360 |
I think Mr. Sex did some amazing border stuff too.
I have no idea what I'm doing, to be honest. I really, REALLY like splits and never thought I could get 5 with side borders opened. It grabbed my curiosities, so I thought I would ask.
I love how many new demos act like the borders don't exist. I've always loved that and I think I have a decent way to open borders, so long as it works.
I doubt I set any world record, but it'd be fun to push myself a little harder. I've done some crazy split stuff, never had a need to go into the borders, but now that I'm there, how far can I go?
That's my story and I'm sticking to it ;) |
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SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
go Triton Technology. 1988
inventors of it.
the DYSP sprite sinus.
once again your danish master invent before you are born :) |
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SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
erh, could be other..
anyway, a dysp from 88, with splits filling the screen.
yep, made long ago. |
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Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2980 |
Quoting The PhantomReally Krill?
I thought I asked you to stop answering my phone when you clean my house?
Just know, I don't care how old the effect is. They can always be improved on, unlike your personality.
If you've nothing productive to say, and obviously can't stay on topic, then please, STFU. No need to go ad hominem, that usually backfires quickly.
I just chose a somewhat aggressive way of answering part of your questions, saying that yes, these kinds of effect have been done to death by various people decades ago, basically without any room for improvement left. Figures, as they are comparatively simple. Also, what Groepaz said. |
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Copyfault
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 478 |
Quoting JackAsserIf you want to find an effect to improve I dare say you just picked the hardest one. Maybe more sprites over FLI is harder. Hey, now that you're on it, why not implement uflimax, nobody still haven't and I'm sure it's possible. :)
Depending on how UFLIMAX is defined I'd say that the code is already there for NTSC-machines - but nobody bothered to implement them into an NTSC demo yet.
Ofcourse I'm cheating a little if I write this... UFLIMAX=6 Sprites over full 200 FLI-lines is only valid for PAL; for NTSC, this would automatically increase to 7 Sprites ;)
However, the 65 cycles per rasterline open up a wide range of raster-based effects which will be impossible to port onto a PAL machine, so I'm still wondering why the NTSC scene did not kick our PAL asses long time ago when it comes to raster-based effects... (e.g. by copying Ninjas "6" Sprites over FLI routine in Darwin, or my "5" Sprite over full 200 lines FLI in The Other Lines, or ...)
After all it's comparing apples and oranges as we're talking two different demo platforms here, though I might feel a bit sad if one day such a non-portable NTSC effect surfaces ;) |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quoting CopyfaultHowever, the 65 cycles per rasterline open up a wide range of raster-based effects which will be impossible to port onto a PAL machine, so I'm still wondering why the NTSC scene did not kick our PAL asses long time ago when it comes to raster-based effects...
i've always assumed it was because the NTSC sceners couldn't run the PAL demos to be part of the various ongoing "battles" between coders to improve and build on previously released routines...? |
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Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2980 |
Quoting CopyfaultI'm still wondering why the NTSC scene did not kick our PAL asses long time ago when it comes to raster-based effects... And i have always assumed that those who could do it (which don't seem many in the first place) just don't bother. |
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Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2980 |
T.M.R: But but, what about emulators? You can run PAL demos anywhere in the world with them, even without an actual C-64!11!! :) |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quoting KrillT.M.R: But but, what about emulators? You can run PAL demos anywhere in the world with them, even without an actual C-64!11!! :)
Yes that's possible now, but i reckon that the "shape" of the PAL and NTSC scenes were pretty much set in place during the 1980s when that wasn't an option; we had our "arms race" where the best coders were constantly trying to top what had been done previously and the techniques trickled down to the less able ones (like me!) but the NTSC guys didn't see more than a tiny fraction of that.
People could go back to those demos to learn the techniques and that's what The Phantom is apparently doing (but with an archive this size it's probably hard to know where to start) but we're all getting old and that fervour of youth which powered things in the 1980s is diminished. At least that's my excuse for only figuring out some of this stuff very recently and i'm sticking to it. =-) |
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Tao
Registered: Aug 2002
Posts: 115 |
I'm assuming there's an NTSC version of the C= 128 too? Since there are hardly any demos for the C= 128, maybe it would be a better platform for the NTSC sceners; they'd be on an even footing with the PAL sceners, since neither would have much experience with the platform :D
(I admit that the only reason for me to suggest this is that I'd love to see more demos for the C= 128 -- and 64 + REU, for that matter). |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Quoting TaoI'm assuming there's an NTSC version of the C= 128 too? Since there are hardly any demos for the C= 128, maybe it would be a better platform for the NTSC sceners; they'd be on an even footing with the PAL sceners, since neither would have much experience with the platform :D
Umm... Risen from Oblivion demonstrates a bit more experience from the PAL side of things? =-) |
