| |
SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Release id #77865 : VW Kever
Pull your head out of the ass, and get those converted pics deleted from this database, before its all pure crap! |
|
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
95% of $anything is pure crap, whats your point?
you want release standards for demos/msx/gfx too ? good. make them, and we will think about it. but keep in mind they'll be applied to *everyone*, and yourself too. |
| |
TPM
Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 110 |
fake demos are crap too.. please, delete them ;) |
| |
Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
Haha, touché! :-D |
| |
CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
I'm for removing of that pussy! ;-/ Also the DTV version, which is nicer but still crappy. :!
Roman |
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
so I can upload converted gayporn/stilleproject/goatse SHIT ? I'm doubt noone will stand up and stop that if I add one each day. :) the line must be drawn. if a picture looks like an obvious convert, workstages must be given, and kept deleted until it was prooved otherwise. |
| |
Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
yes.. keep provided workstages deleted! |
| |
grennouille
Registered: Jul 2008
Posts: 222 |
Good point Oswald. |
| |
Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2928 |
OMG! End of world, someone posted up a converted image!!!11 Get the workstage police in here, quick!
|
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:the line must be drawn. if a picture looks like an obvious convert, workstages must be given, and kept deleted until it was prooved otherwise.
that sounds like a rule which is kinda hard to apply in practise. for example, what about Stasi 2.0 ? and why? or maybe Twisting Machine, Smoking House or Greed ? (i guess many more examples of border cases could be found)
i'm all for removing shitty effortless conversions - but to me it looks much more difficult than it is/was for cracks to come up with decent rules that dont generate more drama than they solve.
|
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
I would be happy without any new rules, just use common sense and give the moderators a free hand so they'll just delete stuff like VW Kever, or Jeff's ass, and keep the stuff what GPZ has listed. |
| |
SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Quote: 95% of $anything is pure crap, whats your point?
you want release standards for demos/msx/gfx too ? good. make them, and we will think about it. but keep in mind they'll be applied to *everyone*, and yourself too.
Simple rules:
1) no converted pics
that's it. the rest is not possible to control. |
| |
Sander
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 496 |
Quote: Simple rules:
1) no converted pics
that's it. the rest is not possible to control.
Think of all the possible speculations/discussions that will emerge from this.. No, don't think that would work either. |
| |
CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
ok discussion seems to go to the hell (as usual) so I'm deleting the crap and the spin-off crap.
have a nice day,
roman |
| |
LOGAN
Account closed
Registered: Aug 2003
Posts: 71 |
Well maybe I'm rather looking ad a good image which is converted than a bad one which is not converted. What if I especially designed an image to be ported on PC, is that so bad? I know it has been done before.
But I guess converting because you can might be not that special. Still, its an (small) effort to make some releases and in these times there isn't as much released as say 20 years ago.
|
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:I would be happy without any new rules, just use common sense
that doesnt work. we wouldnt have needed all the rules for cracking if it did. giving someone a "free hand" and letting him decide by "common sense" is by far the worst of all options. and infact its kinda bizarre that YOU are the one suggesting it =P
Quote:Simple rules:
1) no converted pics
that's it. the rest is not possible to control.
and who tells if a picture is actually converted? and what counts as a conversion? i dont see this working either.
|
| |
A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: Simple rules:
1) no converted pics
that's it. the rest is not possible to control.
Not to defend these two releases, but devils advocate: Du gemeiner Mörder - Du bist Böse (screenshot is not right, btw.... but ignore that). Maybe shameless, but actual compopic which Rayden claimed at the time was hand pixelled on Amiga.
Failing that: Devils advocate #2: The flip disk picture in Fuck the Scene , done in a PC editor that is - essentially (it's a bit more complicated than that, but work with me here) - a hacked up gimp with a realtime convertor. (for the record, I also took the photo that was based on - does that count as creative input?)
My point being.... even without bringing in the "convert and clean up" stuff done in things like timanthes. So do you draw the line at "no converts that are not original artwork). But where is the line between "convert and clean" and "i am a convertor that just happens to be a human"?
If it's just "being a human conertor is hard", what about the coder implementing the digital one? Not that I like these releases, but then, I did enjoy data-land's stuff, and I just don't think it's that simple... |
| |
CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
Quote:Not to defend these two releases, but devils advocate: Du gemeiner Mörder - Du bist Böse (screenshot is not right, btw.... but ignore that). Maybe shameless, but actual compopic which Rayden claimed at the time was hand pixelled on Amiga
When it was released at party, in the compo it deserves to stay in the database and trashed and spitted on by the angry audience.
When it's just straight to CSDB upload ( I rather avoid using a word release here ) it must avoid looking like obvious convert at all costs. Otherwise it's very probabble that someone identifies the original and it get's deleted in the process..
Btw. I made that screenshot.. it's from "the best of party compos" gallery. |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
one thing that seems to actually be applicable is indeed "if it was released in a compo then it stays". however, thats an exception, not the rule =)
alih made some good points there imho. eg i made a converter myself, which i spent a lot of time and effort making. now if i convert some pic with it, and maybe it even looks nice, who decides wether it would stay or not, and based on what? does it matter what the original source of the picture was? is the motive relevant? or who made it? (i dont even want to imagine what drama potential is in "moderators use common sense and have free hand" combined with another "wrath design releases another flood of design experiments" =))
that said, personally i could live with another, much more radical rule: no standalone gfx and msx releases at all (except for compo releases). delete everything that doesnt resemble atleast a very basic demo and/or is made with some kind of demo creator/picture shower/psid64/etcblabla. and that mostly not to get rid of the effortless crap discussed here (because i seriously dont give a damn) - but to push all the other - at times very good - gfx and msx into actual demo productions. maybe even reviving good old "in between parties" releases :)
|
| |
A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: one thing that seems to actually be applicable is indeed "if it was released in a compo then it stays". however, thats an exception, not the rule =)
alih made some good points there imho. eg i made a converter myself, which i spent a lot of time and effort making. now if i convert some pic with it, and maybe it even looks nice, who decides wether it would stay or not, and based on what? does it matter what the original source of the picture was? is the motive relevant? or who made it? (i dont even want to imagine what drama potential is in "moderators use common sense and have free hand" combined with another "wrath design releases another flood of design experiments" =))
that said, personally i could live with another, much more radical rule: no standalone gfx and msx releases at all (except for compo releases). delete everything that doesnt resemble atleast a very basic demo and/or is made with some kind of demo creator/picture shower/psid64/etcblabla. and that mostly not to get rid of the effortless crap discussed here (because i seriously dont give a damn) - but to push all the other - at times very good - gfx and msx into actual demo productions. maybe even reviving good old "in between parties" releases :)
Dumb question: Why is ccde with no grpahics considered superior to graphics with no code? |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
because coders have a bigger schlong! |
| |
Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
I think we should think like this:
"Would it be uploaded / accepted to CSDb if it was released in 198x?"
If the answer is 'yes', it should be in CSDb.
Would Cyborg Pic or Girl Nr.4 be made without a single form of conversion...?
Or would we accept a picture like Graphics Integrator Picture today?
Why change the threshold today?
Quote:Dumb question: Why is ccde with no grpahics considered superior to graphics with no code?
Because you can't port a PC demo to C64 by only pulling it through a convertor. |
| |
LOGAN
Account closed
Registered: Aug 2003
Posts: 71 |
Disallowing Graphics and Music only 'uploads' without inclusion in a demo I feel like a wrong thing. |
| |
Hein
Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 954 |
Quote: ok discussion seems to go to the hell (as usual) so I'm deleting the crap and the spin-off crap.
have a nice day,
roman
Could not execute SQL query: "SELECT 1 FROM csdb_backup WHERE new_data='release77865' AND entry='' AND login_id=''"
speaking of bigger schlongs. |
| |
Hein
Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 954 |
I think even the most retarded release shouldn't be deleted, because essentially only a handfull of people take the time to add releases to this database. If the cool people just release more, no-one will even notice the crap releases, because they drop of the list on the homepage. |
| |
SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Ok have it your way.
I will release 1 converted porn pic every day from now on. |
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
hurray \o/ you could also make some porn collies like angels :) |
| |
AlexC
Registered: Jan 2008
Posts: 299 |
Personally I think that common sense is the only way to go. Adding releases like this:
*=$1000
inc $d020
inc $d021
jmp $1000
also doesn't make a lot of sense and they are already some useless "tools" quite similar to the code above in CSDB. As for gfx converts take a look at Avatar Future Knight release - I think that additional title screen adds a bit to it, even if this is just a converted picture. So from this release perspective this exactly one picture provided some value. I guess if it would not be posted to CSDB it would not be found and used in release for example.
|
| |
d0c
Registered: Apr 2006
Posts: 186 |
Quote: Ok have it your way.
I will release 1 converted porn pic every day from now on.
yes do that and we all can jump on your release, start a figth and call you names like lamer etc.... :P
but seriously i think these bully posting should stop rigth now, its a shame that these thing keep on going to release after release. the really sad thing that will happen in the end if this continue, is when people dont release becouse of fear of being pissed on and get their release deleted. all becouse of a few that have an "eleet" attitude problem.
i personally have no problem with the the vw kever release, it was nice even for a convert and a interesting picture.
quit the hating start enjoying your c64, it is after all what we are here for :) |
| |
A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: Ok have it your way.
I will release 1 converted porn pic every day from now on.
I'd love to have a "releases made just to be a douchebag get deleted" rule... i mean, sure, none of mine would be left, but I'd be pretty comfortable with that :) |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:I will release 1 converted porn pic every day from now on.
seeing how all the other stuff that you were going to do i guess i can safely say: no, that wont work either :o) |
| |
A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: yes do that and we all can jump on your release, start a figth and call you names like lamer etc.... :P
but seriously i think these bully posting should stop rigth now, its a shame that these thing keep on going to release after release. the really sad thing that will happen in the end if this continue, is when people dont release becouse of fear of being pissed on and get their release deleted. all becouse of a few that have an "eleet" attitude problem.
i personally have no problem with the the vw kever release, it was nice even for a convert and a interesting picture.
quit the hating start enjoying your c64, it is after all what we are here for :)
http://www.rumblo.com/cc/comics/cc-coolfrog.gif |
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
Quote: yes do that and we all can jump on your release, start a figth and call you names like lamer etc.... :P
but seriously i think these bully posting should stop rigth now, its a shame that these thing keep on going to release after release. the really sad thing that will happen in the end if this continue, is when people dont release becouse of fear of being pissed on and get their release deleted. all becouse of a few that have an "eleet" attitude problem.
i personally have no problem with the the vw kever release, it was nice even for a convert and a interesting picture.
quit the hating start enjoying your c64, it is after all what we are here for :)
"the really sad thing that will happen in the end if this continue, is when people dont release becouse of fear of being pissed on and get their release deleted. all becouse of a few that have an "eleet" attitude problem."
LOL. refusing zero nonvalue crap no effort convert SHITE is not elitism. Obviously even the author feels the general shame associated with such moves as there was no credit given. |
| |
SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
To the admins:
Why dont you make a poll, and let the users decide ? |
| |
CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
Oswald:Yep.
This is not "save the scene" database. It has some standards and it tries to stick to them. It's purpose is not to serve as a place for release of (our) crap, it's here for the purpose of collecting information about the scene.
It's generally very bad idea to register here with the purpose of using this site as a release service. If you are proud of your stuff, make a site for that, upload it to ftp servers, send it in snail mail sendings, spread it on meetings, compete in competitions and eventually get into (put it) this database.
Don't mistake this place for "free blog" or "twitter" where anything is accepted, because the profile is yours. The user account is yours, you can discuss, or comment, vote, but the scener profile isn't "yours", it's "about you". You can release anything outside the CSDB, but noone assures everything gets here. And I don't think it should.
|
| |
Hein
Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 954 |
This always raises the question 'what is considered crap and who decides?'
possibly a 'nominate for deletion' functionality may give the power to the people, with a fair deal of criteria ofcourse (i.e. at least x nominations, a score of 4 or less etc.)
then we may get a sweet list of trash where we can undelete the crap in the same way.
but all this will probably cause other riots. |
| |
Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
On a side note, I find it odd that Oswald is complaining about wired GFX. Him being the one who put that wonderful converter function into P1 :-D
|
| |
enthusi
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 677 |
I have a (maybe provocative) idea that I declare superior to all alternatives from now on :)
- differenciate between UPLOAD and RELEASE.
- allow uploads such as converted pictures
- status RELEASE is only given to "things" that were in fact released at a Party!
Maybe that concept could even be used for other productions.
So if you want a glorious RELEASE, make sure it reaches a Party. Yet you can upload your current worktune, latest quick-n-dirty picture any time.
What do you guys think?
The Party staff will have to decide. This seems reasonable and will easyly reflect the Party too. Kickass Parties with lotsa top entries wont allow crap to be released. Smaller ones will have to.
edit:
since there is already a tag "released at" this could be done semi-automatically even. Instead of renaming releases into uploads the REAL releases could get some easy-to-spot TAG (some cooooool logo or so?) |
| |
Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
PS: I dont really think a "nominate for deletion" is such a great idea.
Just think of the drama we've got with downvoting. Now imagine what will happen if people can nominate something for deletion.
And dont get me started about common sense, there is no such thing among the users of this database. The only thing we've got in common here is our lunacy.
|
| |
Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
Enthusi, your idea is too complicated.
Personally, I feel an itch when people try to add complexity to the system to prevend incidents.
In general, additions will eventually lead to more problems.
I think it's less effort to just have this discussion once in a while and then decide 'incident based'. |
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
Quote: On a side note, I find it odd that Oswald is complaining about wired GFX. Him being the one who put that wonderful converter function into P1 :-D
off
gah :D thanks for the compliment. credit must be given to Mirage tho, the best color conversion method (you can select from a few) is based on his algorythm. anyway it was fun to code and finetune the converter, but had not in mind that it should be used for wiring&uploading, I just wanted to make a good one. it was a challenge :)
on |
| |
Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
How many pixels is one required to change in a converted picture for it not to be classified as a convert? 1? all?
What about colours?
Is hand pixeling from a photo a convertion? Is scanning and converting own photos acceptable? What if pixels got changed after converting?
Should we delete all sound sampled content too as this basically is also just a "convertion"?
Should all code containing code from codebase be stripped from the db as well?
Should code written in an assembler be stripped from the db, as this is also just a convertion?
If someone adds a lame ass scroll to that picture and releases it as a one-file demo, should we then strip the picture from the demo and keep the lame-ass scroll?
If this fictive lame ass demo was released BEFORE the picture, then I would agree that the picture as a standalone release would not be worth it's own entry, but then that opinion raises some entirely new concerns...
|
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
/irony on
what makes a cow a cow ?
how many genes must be the same of the cow to THE cow genes? How do we define THE cow genes for comparison, when we havent yet defined what genes are cow genes?
therefore we can never differentiate between cows and not cows.
/irony off |
| |
Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
If it looks like a cow, sounds like a cow and walks like a cow, it probably IS a cow... |
| |
Devia
Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 401 |
Quote: If it looks like a cow, sounds like a cow and walks like a cow, it probably IS a cow...
Most married guys would probably disagree.. :-P
|
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:Why dont you make a poll, and let the users decide ?
what kind of poll? do you think a poll makes answering this question easier or even more sane than discussing it? this is no yes or no question - most people agree already that we do not want the "crap" here. yet i haven't seen good and applicable proposals on who judges and based on what criteria yet.
Quote:So if you want a glorious RELEASE, make sure it reaches a Party. Yet you can upload your current worktune, latest quick-n-dirty picture any time.
What do you guys think?
The Party staff will have to decide. This seems reasonable and will easyly reflect the Party too. Kickass Parties with lotsa top entries wont allow crap to be released. Smaller ones will have to.
thats a very bad idea which i dont like at all. strong NO
- can you name a single c64 release that did not pass preselection on a party in the past years? thats completely unrealistic. there simply aren't enough c64 releases, even on big parties, to even bother about it. most parties are glad to get enough entries for a decent compo at all.
- handling it like this would discourage people from releasing in between parties. bad idea
Quote:PS: I dont really think a "nominate for deletion" is such a great idea.
Just think of the drama we've got with downvoting. Now imagine what will happen if people can nominate something for deletion.
same here. it would be the perfect weapon for people to piss off other people. and the loudest group of people would "win". and then drama =P
i have another provokative approach though: disallow everything that wasnt released elsewhere, ie really make csdb an archive site. that would atleast force people to put minimum effort into creating a shitty website for their crap. or something. |
| |
enthusi
Registered: May 2004
Posts: 677 |
or that...
Remove "at a Party" from my post and we're good ;) |
| |
Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Actually, I'm pretty happy with the way things are.
We've had our share of rounds on discussing releases like these. And it hasnt posed a big problem in the past.
If the majority of us agree on deleting something, then away with it.
Trying to force more rules upon us than necessary is counterproductive.
Myself for example. I tend to release my stuff (outside of party events) directly onto CSDb. If your new rules would apply,
I wouldnt be releasing anything outside of partys since I couldnt be arsed to go around and publish my stuff by other means than CSDb.
What's the point of this discussion anyway? We've got moderators taking care of shit like this.
And we've all become used to the repressive gestapo methods (INSERT DIRTY GRIN HERE) of the moderators, deleting things as they see fit.
|
| |
Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Quoting Oswaldso I can upload converted gayporn/stilleproject/goatse SHIT ?
As long as you code some kick-ass demo around it, I'm all for it :-D
Quoting Oswald againbut had not in mind that it should be used for wiring&uploading
Wierd, thats like Heckler & Koch arguing "But we didnt expect anyone would actually get killed by our weapons!" :-D
|
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:And we've all become used to the repressive gestapo methods (INSERT DIRTY GRIN HERE) of the moderators, deleting things as they see fit.
and i always have to laugh out loud when people first complain about the nazi gestapo moderators, and then turn around and say they dont want new rules, and want the moderators have "free hand" and do their decisions by "common sense". does not compute. |
| |
CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
And what is even worse.. some nazi gestapo moderators are oppressive bloody red communists from behind the iron curtain... ;-) |
| |
Hein
Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 954 |
Quote:same here. it would be the perfect weapon for people to piss off other people. and the loudest group of people would "win". and then drama =P
erm, yes, what's wrong with nominating EoD for deletion?
Quote:
i have another provokative approach though: disallow everything that wasnt released elsewhere, ie really make csdb an archive site. that would atleast force people to put minimum effort into creating a shitty website for their crap. or something.
do open dirs count as shitty websites too? |
| |
Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2928 |
For the record, it's not just the moderators here deleting stuff.
:)
|
| |
Hein
Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 954 |
wOOt, we can do that ourselves? |
| |
Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
Quote:Actually, I'm pretty happy with the way things are.
We've had our share of rounds on discussing releases like these. And it hasnt posed a big problem in the past.
If the majority of us agree on deleting something, then away with it.
As I said in message #40 in this thread, so I'm totally with you on this.
May I suggest we move on now? |
| |
Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Quoting MaceMay I suggest we move on now? I'd love to. But you know the rule. We can't stop until someone starts posting lolcat pictures and the thread gets closed down by the gestapo.
(Disclaimer : I'M BEING SARCASTIC. IT DOESNT NECESSARILY MEAN THAT I THINK THE MODS ARE A BUNCH OF OPRESSIVE ASSHOLES)
|
| |
Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
...there! |
| |
Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Now you've done it.
|
| |
MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1078 |
Don't get your panties in a bunch.
|
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:For the record, it's not just the moderators here deleting stuff.
indeed, the vast majority of deletions is done by the evil mob of trusted users /o\ |
| |
SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Buttsecks |
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
Quote: Quote:And we've all become used to the repressive gestapo methods (INSERT DIRTY GRIN HERE) of the moderators, deleting things as they see fit.
and i always have to laugh out loud when people first complain about the nazi gestapo moderators, and then turn around and say they dont want new rules, and want the moderators have "free hand" and do their decisions by "common sense". does not compute.
you dont want me to play the drama queen again, stop arousing me :) |
| |
JackAsser
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 2014 |
Delete the following demos please:
* Panta Rhei. The last image is composited on PC and converted using a custom written converter.
* Sphaeristerium. The animations are pure PC converts.
* LCP Memories. The twister gfx is generated and not hand pixeled. Also the font in the end-part is Comic Sans MS auto-converted.
* The Wild Bunch. The balls in the tunnel are generated and not hand pixeled. Also, the car animation in the end is a convert from flash.
* Amplifire. Auto-generated twister gfx.
Nah, I trust the mods to do their job and if some crap slip through their nets it's not the end of the world nor the end of CSDb.
:)
|
| |
Sander
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 496 |
Also, the car animation in the end is a convert from flash.
Hey, i did that by hand you know!
Now look at this: Obstacles. Converted and repixelled. (like it says on the prescreen) |
| |
Mix256
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2008
Posts: 26 |
Quoting JackAsserNah, I trust the mods to do their job and if some crap slip through their nets it's not the end of the world nor the end of CSDb.
Amen! |
| |
Sander
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 496 |
(i couldn't edit that previous post anymore..)
I wonder if the main annoyance is the latest releaselist on the homepage of CSDB? As that's the only place it surfaces, besides the RSS and comments. |
| |
Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Quoting SanderI wonder if the main annoyance is the latest releaselist on the homepage of CSDB? As that's the only place it surfaces, besides the RSS and comments. Like, someone's ego got pissed because his release was pushed out of view?
|
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
indeed, i dont get all the rage about "releases pushed down in the releaselist" either. if the latest releases are the crap they are - they still belong into the list just as much as any other release. |
| |
yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 333 |
I dont care if something is converted or not, but
Quote:
* LCP Memories. The twister gfx is generated and not hand pixeled. Also the font in the end-part is Comic Sans MS auto-converted.
Comic Sans MS ? I mean... Comic Sans MS???
|
| |
Sander
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 496 |
Quote: Quoting SanderI wonder if the main annoyance is the latest releaselist on the homepage of CSDB? As that's the only place it surfaces, besides the RSS and comments. Like, someone's ego got pissed because his release was pushed out of view?
Quoting StainlessLike, someone's ego got pissed because his release was pushed out of view?
Right yes. It's the only complaint i've heard about this sofar, besides pollution of the database. I'm not saying i share this feeling, but i could imagine it could piss off someone on some cases.
Quoting YagoComic Sans MS ? I mean... Comic Sans MS???
Seriously dissapointed too.. :( |
| |
Stainless Steel
Registered: Mar 2003
Posts: 966 |
Well, i can understand the issue with crap releases pushing a decent release
out of the latest release list view on the main page. I've had that issue myself before.
As long as a release is still "in sight" on the main page, it is more likely to attract people's interest.
Once it disappeares from there, it's out of most people's focus.
|
| |
Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
OMG, we have found yet another nit to pick...
We need more lolcatz!
...and cowbell. |
| |
Linus
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 639 |
zZz |
| |
Radiant
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 639 |
I sometimes get annoyed when there are too many crap releases in the latest releases list. At times I hesitate to link to CSDb when I in an online conversation mention there's still a vibrant C64 scene going, just because I know the "latest releases" list is full of converted pictures and other lame stuff. That's not exactly an impression of the state of the current C64 scene I'd want anybody to have.
What I consider crap however, someone else may not. I've seen several releases which people have written off as "crap", "shit" etc, which I myself found pretty good (or in some cases at least entertaining). Judging "effort put in" can be very hard as well. Better just let the productions speak for themselves.
And also, the "latest releases" list is just that: the latest releases. There's no point in lying about people not releasing shitty converts, if they do actually release shitty converts. Anyone releasing only shit and acting like a fucking lamer will be dealt with by the scene as usual. Anyone clearly abusing the database can be banned by the moderators.
Groepaz's suggestion about not allowing new releases directly unto CSDb has some merit though. |
| |
TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
If I send my new demo on a floppy to myself by snail mail, does that count as releasing? |
| |
SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
You can snail it to me! |
| |
yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 333 |
TDJ: Only if you send the stamps back
|
| |
MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1078 |
If crap showing up in the latest releases is the problem, it could easily be solved by showing a list of the five latest "hot" releases (five highest rated releases from the last 30 days or whatever).
|
| |
Sander
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 496 |
Quote: If crap showing up in the latest releases is the problem, it could easily be solved by showing a list of the five latest "hot" releases (five highest rated releases from the last 30 days or whatever).
Hey - that sounds familiar ;) |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
except when noone knows a release exists (perhaps by seeing it in the latest release list?) ... then noone will vote for it either =D |
| |
Mace
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 1799 |
 |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
don't you have some gerümpel to sort out? =D |
| |
MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1078 |
Quote: except when noone knows a release exists (perhaps by seeing it in the latest release list?) ... then noone will vote for it either =D
But since the latest releases will also be there, I don't see that as a problem.
It seems like a straightforward addition to the front page (a simple sql query and the same html formatting as is used on the latest releases), couldn't we just add it and see how it works out?
|
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
you'd have to convince perff i guess .... i personally couldnt care less really =P |
| |
CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
hot releases list could lead to some sort of attempts for manipulation. so if you ask me, I would rather live without it. |
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
Quote: hot releases list could lead to some sort of attempts for manipulation. so if you ask me, I would rather live without it.
the solution is simple, look at pouet:
latest releases:
latest added releases:
done. |
| |
hollowman
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 474 |
Pouet also has "Top of the month", which works quite well as there is enough traffic and voting to make it fair enough. |
| |
Sander
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 496 |
Not so coincidentally i did a quick sketch for this idea over a year ago: http://www.lieropterror.nl/csdb.jpg
|
| |
A Life in Hell
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 204 |
Quote: Not so coincidentally i did a quick sketch for this idea over a year ago: http://www.lieropterror.nl/csdb.jpg
I actually really like the look of that. want. if I ever go through with my idea of csdb-greasemonkey-script-of-doom, i'm so stealing that |
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
exactly, just like on pouet. presenting:
- latest releases (NOT latest _added_)
- top of the month (in sander style)
would direct attention to the new releases. It would add a lot to the scene. People would get more feedback, and would be more happy and more productive :)
( yes I know the csdb doesnt wants to be a release/scene portal, etc, but everyone uses it for that anyway :) |
| |
Stryyker
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 468 |
I snoozed for a few days and I missed the download in question.
To be honest I don't understand why people have issues with stuff they think is crappy or pointless.
In some ways it inspires me to make something that looks like it should be deleted. Wait for someone to complain. Once it is removed point out all the hidden parts and then bitch about why someone moaned about not liking it and others reacting by deleting it.
I decided to visit the main page for this site and it gave me some text something like: A site dedicated to gathering as much information as possible about the productions, the groups, the sceners and the events in the Commodore 64 scene.
If you don't like something just down vote it or better still ignore it. |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:Pouet also has "Top of the month", which works quite well as there is enough traffic and voting to make it fair enough.
you got it. |
| |
CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
Quote: Not so coincidentally i did a quick sketch for this idea over a year ago: http://www.lieropterror.nl/csdb.jpg
yeah yeah I remember, I love it, let's do it. perff how can I help you? I can do html + js.scripting you can genereate the stuff. ;-)
no matter how those top things will be chosen (but I would preffer if they'll be chosen by trusted users and mods ;-))) |
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
Quote: yeah yeah I remember, I love it, let's do it. perff how can I help you? I can do html + js.scripting you can genereate the stuff. ;-)
no matter how those top things will be chosen (but I would preffer if they'll be chosen by trusted users and mods ;-)))
- latest releases (NOT latest _added_)
- top of the month (in sander style)
this way. the latest releases will be on spotlight, so they get votes for getting a top of the month list in sander style.
I hope the last part was a joke. |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
61 releases
- 12 releases have less than 5 votes
- 31 releases have no votes at all
top list for this month (release,#of votes,rating)
Fortress of Narzod 15 9.5
Sunday the 15th 5 9.1
XRAY 22 8.9
My 4 Years Old Dream 19 8.8
Oldschool Story 15 8.3
( http://rafb.net/p/xGYx2A36.html )
... oh well. it looks almost reasonable, by coincidence i guess. i predict it will be much more "funny" when the ranking actually is related to frontpage exposure :)
Quote:(but I would preffer if they'll be chosen by trusted users and mods ;-)))
no, please not =P but what about this: ONLY show those "top releases" to those people who have already voted for every release released in that particular month =) it would surely make the votes less objective - but then again only those who rated the releases will see them. win-win =)
|
| |
Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
ok, I would really love to see this happen. even with the forced vote feature :) |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
i seriously like the forced voting idea... because it could actually be a good way to prevent that certain productions are upvoted by certain people just to get some frontpage exposure. AND it would increase the general amount of votes, making the whole voting thing a bit less pointless than it is right now :) |
| |
CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
Quote:I hope the last part was a joke.
no, I'm traditionalist. I like old style of doing media, editors and staff (if I got it right it's nowadays called "elites" by journalist scientists) ;-)
|
| |
CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3057 |
Quote:no, please not =P but what about this: ONLY show those "top releases" to those people who have already voted for every release released in that particular month =) it would surely make the votes less objective - but then again only those who rated the releases will see them. win-win =)
I tried similar thing in some photo gallery where people could vote, I wasn't very satisfied.. it's not very trasnparent this way. and actually top of the month is mostly about having the best stuff in the spotlight... not the best voted stuff.. if you understand what I mean. I don't think it's so hard to pick up the best stuff from every important cathegory. and btw. it could be called spotlight and it could be picked up per week basis. (if there is actually anythhing to pick, that is) |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
Quote:no, I'm traditionalist. I like old style of doing media, editors and staff (if I got it right it's nowadays called "elites" by journalist scientists) ;-)
for the records: i totally agree with this. i am a big friend of competent jury voting, and i dont believe in that web2.0 1000 monkeys crap. i just dont care enough in this case to be bothered with the additional work, and i think there are much more important things that need to be done here (look at the todo list =P) |
| |
SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
Groepaz: if you just added the category "converted graphics" it would be fine.. |
| |
chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
that wouldnt solve the problem discussed here at all, would it? and no, not even more whacked up cathegories please. |
