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Forums > C64 Coding > Spindle and Sparkle demos not launching
2024-10-29 21:01
mankeli

Registered: Oct 2010
Posts: 134
Spindle and Sparkle demos not launching

Can someone explain why demos using Sparkle or Spindle loaders can't be run from 1541U by selecting the launch file and using "mount & run"?

You got to use "Run Disk" for the whole image. 99.9999% of the C64 demos can be launched with mount & run, and somehow this only seems affect those aforementioned loaders.
 
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2024-11-01 12:52
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2960
Quoting Burglar
it does not load on a stock c64+1541 without cartridge due to the dirart and not having the boot prg as first file.
trying to load the prg will give file not found, unless you modify the filename with ? and *
Time to add that "disk image linting" to cc1541 we talked about recently. =)
2024-11-01 12:55
tlr

Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1779
Quote: Quoting Burglar
it does not load on a stock c64+1541 without cartridge due to the dirart and not having the boot prg as first file.
trying to load the prg will give file not found, unless you modify the filename with ? and *
Time to add that "disk image linting" to cc1541 we talked about recently. =)


Great idea!
2024-11-01 16:53
Martin Piper

Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 706
Quote: Quoting Martin Piper
I remember now, it was the transwarp example that issues a M-E with the partial just loaded file in the read buffer: Transwarp V0.84
Yes, that's part of the 2-blocks bootstrap fastload strapped in front to speed up booting the actual loader.
Was 1-block in early dev versions, but that turned out to be too slow for my purposes. =)
(You can always fall back to loading Transwarp itself via ,8+RUN not ,8,1 when autorun won't work for some reason.)

As for the problems described here, i like the concept of a multi-loader coming in a self-contained package in C-64 memory, that would function just fine when run immediately after drive reset, new disk etc. :)

Then again, no particular love for non-stock aftermarket hardware.


I really liked the way that bootstrap code started executing on the C64 then switched over to the fastload.
2024-11-02 12:04
mankeli

Registered: Oct 2010
Posts: 134
Quote: Quoting mankeli
This happens on U64 too. (Ultimate 64 Elite V1.43 - 3.11) Aerial Core for example doesn't work with mount & run, it needs run disk.

Areal Core has its own issues, it does not load on a stock c64+1541 without cartridge due to the dirart and not having the boot prg as first file.
trying to load the prg will give file not found, unless you modify the filename with ? and *


Oh, thanks for reporting!
Getting the dirart to even work was a huge pain ^^

But yeah atleast the problem got narrowed down to Basic LOAD leaving some state to 1541 which Spindle then depends on. As an another example Skybox doesn't work with mount and run either, and it probably has dirart as DEL Files.
2024-11-02 16:59
tlr

Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1779
Quoting mankeli
But yeah atleast the problem got narrowed down to Basic LOAD leaving some state to 1541 which Spindle then depends on.

As LordCrass identified, it's only the disk ID that is not set up. This could be fixed in the M-E bootstrap code such that a seek is done before the reads. I think that could fit.

For an inject run strategy to work with the current code, the 1541 needs to be configured with this disk ID as a minimum.
2024-11-02 17:22
WVL

Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 892
Wouldn't it be the job of 1541u/u64 to set up the drive correctly with the right ID set? This sounds fixable to me.

Then again, I know nothing about drive code and don't understand why the disk ID would matter anyway? And what is linting (is that the disk structure with one t/s pointing to the next t/s?).

The last time I did anything with that is when I made cd1541 to make the d64 for pearls for Pigs (because cc1541 didn't support 40 tracks back then). Or.. actually I think jackasser added 40 track just in time in cc1541 and I still made my own tool which I can't seem to compile anymore...

So what I wanted to say : if I can make my own d64 creation tool knowing almost nothing about d64 and drives, then others will have done so too. The result: d64's with lots of small problems. A tool to check a d64 would be helpful.
2024-11-02 20:34
Oswald

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5084
Quote: Quoting mankeli
But yeah atleast the problem got narrowed down to Basic LOAD leaving some state to 1541 which Spindle then depends on.

As LordCrass identified, it's only the disk ID that is not set up. This could be fixed in the M-E bootstrap code such that a seek is done before the reads. I think that could fit.

For an inject run strategy to work with the current code, the 1541 needs to be configured with this disk ID as a minimum.


I wouldnt fix code for non standard hardware. ultimate firmware has to be fixed.
2024-11-02 20:51
tlr

Registered: Sep 2003
Posts: 1779
Quote: I wouldnt fix code for non standard hardware. ultimate firmware has to be fixed.

This isn't really about the Ultimate, it's just a matter if you want to support just running the binary to have the demo load, regardless how you got the initial loader into memory.

AFAIK there's is already a different option to load disks like this on the Ultimate's. Need to handle those disks differently, that's all.
2024-11-02 23:37
Sparta

Registered: Feb 2017
Posts: 43
Issuing a JSR $d00e ("read BAM") at the beginning of the M-E bootstrap code restores the ZP variables and allows the bootstrap code to properly load the drive code even if the drive gets turned off and on between LOAD and RUN. This will be part of the soon-to-be released Sparkle 3.1. Not that I consider this a loader problem.
2024-11-03 03:24
Krill

Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2960
Quoting Sparta
Not that I consider this a loader problem.
It both is and isn't. :)

For years i'd had fallback code to work around some of the graver 1541U emulation bugs. A few people shook their heads and told me not to work around emu bugs, lest they never be fixed, but 1541U and friends have too much of a market share.

With some unrelated drivecode overhaul, these workarounds became unnecessary, but i decided to keep the nag message that still keeps popping up here and there in demo compos. (Firmware version N good, version N+1 bad again. Apparently there's some weird regression thing going on.)
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