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Darkus
Registered: Apr 2007
Posts: 8 |
Coding for beginners
I`ve been searching the net for assembler guides and applications but I hoping someone can recommend the best guides and programs I should use for starting out - plus are there any issues with using emulators only ? Anyone who may answer these questions, please bare in mind I know very little about the C64 platform at this stage :) |
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 728 |
Fir5t you n33d 7o 134rn t0 5pe4k 1ike teh 1337 ha**0r5, otherwise you'll never be able to learn coding, no chance. Practice here in teh shit ph0rumz a few light-years, and then come back and learn coding.
And then when you become famous, remember who gave you all this good advice!! |
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Burglar
Registered: Dec 2004
Posts: 1101 |
Quote: These advices are all very good, but don't forget the most important thing - eat/drink lots of caffeinated stuff, otherwise you'll never have the drive you need to try, try and try again thousands of times over until you figure out how to do something decent.
dont forget weed! it'll give you really creative coding solutions that miraculously stop working the next day ;) |
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Cruzer
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1048 |
Quote:dont forget weed!
I wouldn't know about that, but alcohol in the right dose can be a help too...
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plagueis
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2007
Posts: 48 |
Hello all beginning 6510/6502 coders.
I had a c64 in the 80's and now recently purchased one again off of ebay. I always wanted to learn to code, back then, but I was younger and my attention span was never really there, plus, living in a small town I didn't have any local machine code mentors.
Now, after reading Puterman's excellent tutorial and many disk mags (such as Coder's World 1,2 and 3...and all the Attitudes), I have mastered quite a bit of the basics, and even have managed to create a one screen intro. I started about 3-4 months ago, using primarily the CCS64 emulator, and also Vice. I've mostly been using Turbo Illasm off of the "Coder's Orgasm V3" disk. I've also written quite a few routines (timed and $d011 raster bars, etc) using the monitor in Final Cartridge III, and Action Replay VI. I have those ROMs, plus I also have the hardware for Final Cartridge III. The only problem is, I haven't had the chance to test any of my code on the real hardware due to lack of a monitor (screen). I hope to remedy that soon.
So mainly I just made this post to share my experiences with other beginners. Cruser was absolutely correct about needing Caffeine to stay focused on figuring out new routines and effects, and stay on it until you get them working the way you want. I have made a lot of progress in only a few months after starting from scratch, but I have a long way to go.
So, Turbo Assembler for sure, only after a decent knowledge of coding in the monitor.
Action Replay VI or Final Cart. III
Read anything by Puterman (great tutorials...plus he doesn't always give you *all* the answers)
Read all 3 issues of Coder's World, then read them again.
Read Attitude 4,5,etc... |
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Radiant
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 639 |
Quote: vice monitor is ok for debugging, but for coding? nah.. Maybe TMR would like it :)
Coding in any monitor these days is masochism. The VICE monitor is excellent because it's such a fantastic gateway between the emulated C64 and the host machine. |
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assiduous
Account closed
Registered: Jun 2007
Posts: 343 |
Quote:Hoxs is much slower (the price you pay for better emulation) but it will emulate almost anything you throw at it.
And if it won't,report it to the author, he fixes anything you throw at him within a few days.
although hoxs64 is deadly accurate (ccs64 and vice are nothing close) i wouldn't trust it in all circumstances. if vice, ccs and hoxs display differently it's always a good idea to check on a real C64. In the great majority of cases Hoxs64 will prove to be accurate but not always. A few days ago I found a minor VIC bug affecting Hoxs64 and CCS64 and not present in VICE and it is now being fixed for the next release of Hoxs64. |
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 728 |
You read Puterman's tutorial!? Oups, we're about to see some rather weird stuff here soon ;). |
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The Shadow
Registered: Oct 2007
Posts: 304 |
Recently I bought a 64 from eBay myself. Doodling around on an emulator is fine. When it concerns the hardcore details, an actual 64 is a must. |
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plagueis
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2007
Posts: 48 |
Quote: You read Puterman's tutorial!? Oups, we're about to see some rather weird stuff here soon ;).
HCL,
Well, yeah...he certainly has some unique design elements in his demos...but his beginning coding tutorials are some of the best in my opinion. Lately I've kind of been obsessed with reading all the tutorials I can find and trying out as many of the routines as I can. Puterman's stuff is very well written, and has a great coverage of loops and the very basic essentials that you learn in the beginning. I also forgot to mention that I've learned a lot from Richard Bayliss' Assemble It tutorial.
Of course, I have been a C programmer (mostly in the UNIX environment) since the Mid '90s, so I was already familiar with hex, pointers, etc...and I've done a little Intel asm as well.
One thing that I would recommend is to download many old and new c64 demos and watch them. I do that a lot and try to figure out in my mind how the effects were accomplished and where the screen cuts are and everything. Think about the approximate raster time for each thing that is happening on the screen. I do that very often for inspiration. Of course, you can use your monitor (on the cart or emulator or whatever) to disassemble the routines and figure them out also.
/\/ecromancer |
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Martin Piper
Registered: Nov 2007
Posts: 722 |
Then once you figure out this assembler programming lark the next logical step is to go one step lower level and design your own TTL hardware and opcodes. :)
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