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ChristopherJam
Registered: Aug 2004
Posts: 1409 |
How did you get started?
I noticed a lot of reminiscing on PAL's "I want to code" thread, which was interesting to read, but pretty off topic so I'm starting a new topic over here :)
I, too, got my c64 coding off the ground with a copy of the Commodore 64 Programmer's Reference guide (pdfs of which can now be found at http://www.commodore.ca/manuals/c64_programmers_reference/c64-p.. ). Initially I was assembling by hand, and entering the code as BASIC DATA statements - I don't miss those days at all.
I switched to FASSEM as soon as I got hold of a copy (in 1986 IIRC), and did a lot of debugging of my own code and examining of others' using my brother's Final Cartridge, before eventually graduating to an Action Replay (don't ask me to remember which versions!) I particularly remember spending hours poring over a disassembly of Walker's music routine as extracted from Armalyte, and printed out on sheets of green and white paper.
My fastload coding bible was and still is Immers & Neufeld's "Inside Commodore DOS" - one of the few paper books I still refer to.
How did you guys get going?
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algorithm
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 705 |
Before the c64 my experience with opcodes was with this diy computer kit that only had 10 leds a beeper and a number display. I think it was one of them radioshack kits. Only had 128 bytes of ram if I recall correctly |
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Dane
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 423 |
Many are the coders who I have tormented with the eternal question:
"Yes, but how does it work?"
Eventually some things tend to stick. |
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JackAsser
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 2014 |
I started when I was 5 years old, with some simple basic stuff (I have the disks still lying around! :D). So, technically I don't even remember what it is like not to know how to code. Then I quickly moved on to Amiga Basic, then Amos basic (more available gfx commands). After that one year of pascal, then C in Dos (high school, coding doom-engines). Then moved on to Java when that was released. C++ got acquired along the way, dunno exactly when and how. Then came iOS with obj-c etc... Anyway, back in 2004 I moved back to the C64 and actually bothered to learn 6502-assembly and with the previous programming experience it was quite simple indeed! :D |
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NecroPolo
Registered: Jun 2009
Posts: 231 |
Interesting stories, thread was a good read :)
First of all, I don't qualify as a coder but I had some fun with C64 programming. It's like a lifelong mystery where I can explore little steps time from time without seeing the whole. In the mid '80s in the elementary school I did a lot of stuff in BASIC because I calculate really (I mean really) wrong on paper and I'm quite lazy when it comes to things that I don't care much anyway so I got most of my time consuming math and physics calculating homework done with my C64. I also had some machine code books but looking back, they all missed the right direction, left out some must-have keys to catch up, at least to me. I was always playing music with anything I got in the hands so I ended up using SID editors, it was effortless and clear from the start so I dug myself into it and forgot BASIC. Looking back I realise that BASIC and C64 composing experience directed me to my present profession, during the years as a studio engineer I was programming a lot of stuff from old bogged MIDI sequencers to broadcast processors quite easily without actually knowing how to program. Also, I was also interested in game music creation from the start but I had no contact and luck back in time because the house of the only quite competent game coder I knew burnt down with all the project sources we did together, only some memento SIDs remained. I thought it was time to quit and boxed the C64 for a long while.
Over a decade after, I dug out all my old C64 stuff when I created a SID remix album an sent the bunch of my old SID tunes to iAN CooG and HVSC. He sent me a little player in machine code, 10 lines or so? I figured out how it works and I started to expand it. I started to read Puterman's and Richard's tutorials and started to understand some basic principles that were so clearly demonstrated there. It was like continuing an old adventure but now with a good map. I also learned to respect this machine even much more than before. Due to my terrible math and a somewhat too loose systematical thinking (that was proven to be a blessing for music creation/production anyway) I'll never be a coder as I can see in "matrix" only in music but for sure I'll have a lot of fun while doing anything on C64. I guess, having fun is the most important thing in it as this old machine is one of the few little corners of the world that is not fucked up. |
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Stone
Registered: Oct 2006
Posts: 172 |
When a classmate got a computer I was immediately hooked on the idea of programming. When I bought myself a book about some random programming language and started writing programs on graph paper, my parents probably realized that I was serious about it and got me a C64. I learned Basic, but it wasn't very satisfying and I knew that none of the games I had were written using Basic. They all had these mysterious SYS lines that nobody knew anything about, other than that behind it all there was "machine code". I found the Commodore 64 Reference Guide in a bookstore and together with figuring out how HESmon worked, that was the biggest Eureka! moment of my life. I learned a lot from cracking games in the early days, but figuring out how to do raster interrupts actually came from hacking a Danish Crackers intro: Danish Crackers Intro |
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PAL
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 292 |
Stein... love you! You are one of the best programmers on the c64 ever and nobody knows it!!!!! That is my eureka... you blew all with offence scroller on x that we did together and you know what.... it is the best demopart ever in the history of the c64! It is even better than my unitrax fetish parts you know... we did it, you coded it... I made it legendary with the shadows... you made it eternal with getting the shadows in there... they made it without shadows but it were all about the shadows... that made it the best ever...... bestest ever! Thank god for your parents! Without them the best demopart would never have seen the lights! |
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TWW
Registered: Jul 2009
Posts: 545 |
After "programming" my dads VCR to hell, one day when I came home from school in 1986 (10 years) a C-64 was lying in the living room. It was with a tape recorder and a double tape-game collection thingy with Rambo II, Kung Fu Master, Fighter Pilot & Things on a Spring (If I remember correctly).
Quickly discovered equal minded persons in the neighbourhood and started swapping turbo tapes. I even got a double tape-recorder to do the copying. I received a 1541 roughly half a year after this and started the same business with disks.
After a year of playing/swapping and a little poking around in Basic I got inspired by the intros and we also got hold of some demos.
I got hold of an EPYX fast loader (I think I borrowed it from Kjetil/direct Design) and started messing around with the monitor. Also had the monitor which loaded to $c000. Had no clue what I was doing but maanged eventually to steal a Raster Compare IRQ routine (people didn't like to share too much) which allowed me to play music and I could maange to display a char logo.
I then ordered myself a AR6 and the C64PRM which changed things completely. It wasn't before around the release of 'public domain' in 92 I started using Turbo Assembler. This simplyfied matters a lot.
in 96-97 I went to College and started working along side of it. So it wasn't untill around 2000 when I wound an assembled which allowed me to code on the PC and run the code in a n emulator (never looked back to Norway and didn't have any posibility to drag my HW around with me (Worked World Wide)).
But all the time I was always thinking about doing... Then when I discovered KickAssembler (Thanks Mads) I got a renewed interest and gathered the other lazy remnant of Creators and founded the group again. It's purly a "we do it when we like it" kinda club as RL issues are taking it's toll on all of us.
Today I feel I am sitting on a lot of knowledge but I am not afraid to ask and I especially don't give a fuck what people think (I'm too old for that shit).
Biggest problem is too many projects / too little time / loose interest once the main obstacle is cracked in something I want to do. So I do 1000 different things and never finnish any of them :-)
The worst part is that I am really proud of having been a tiny part of the sceene but weirdly enough, noone gets it when they ask what I like to do for a hobby 8-) |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11386 |
here is something to show your friends: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRkZcTg1JWU :) |
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Flex
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 111 |
what becomes to a man and a demopart... Was it really Stein and THAT SCROLLER....?? Now I'm ashamed I never offered the man a double before X2012!!!! :-) Stein knows what. Love you guys at Offence!!
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The Phantom
Registered: Jan 2004
Posts: 360 |
Awesome topic BTW....
I programmed a little on an atari 600xl, my first "real" computer. It's ok. I'm not ashamed ;)
My sister purchased a c64 for a few, A FEW, hundred and after a year with it, passed it to my younger brother (reeet-mon). He didn't do much with it, I think he ran a bbs on C64, but for the life of me, I couldn't tell you what it was. He eventually went Amiga and passed his c64 on to me in late 1987.
I purchased the pricey koala pad and went at it. Released a few picture demos, and was asked to join MMI (metal maniacs Inc.) I drew a bit for that group, released a few items (which I would love to find BTW).
Eventually, changed MMI to FOE and here I sit. Old, complains a lot, hardly drinks, always high and still, STILL, I prefer drawing on c64. It's gotten a little easier with the plethora of editors and I still use old school tools, like Centauri or OCP, still like packing with ECA,, but use exomizer (SP?) at times.
Today? I've quite a few projects in the works. A demo, some artwork demo, a nufli dragon that'll probably never get finished. These days, I code probably a demo part a year.
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