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fermhg
Account closed
Registered: Oct 2002
Posts: 43 |
Who are the better programmers?
This is my question: Who are the better programmers? |
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Eyeth
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 98 |
Hello.
According to CSDb, the top coder is Crossbow, followed by Krill and Graham. AFAIK, all are active.
IMHO, I agree with the majority at CSDb. :)
Enjoy.
-Todd Elliott |
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 621 |
Quote: This is my question: Who are the better programmers?
Do you mean on the demo scene or game scene? |
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Graham
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 990 |
stupid question. the basic tool scene ofcourse. |
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fermhg
Account closed
Registered: Oct 2002
Posts: 43 |
I ask for all the types of programmers... |
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Testicle
Account closed
Registered: Sep 2002
Posts: 131 |
well, the list of "better" programmers is quite long, i think. and you have to distinguish between game- and demo-coders (or programmers).
as far as i know, the problem between these two terms "coder" and "programmer" was discussed at lemon.
by the way: why do you want to know this? and why do you ask at all, because you'll never get an objective answer, and you won't get it when you look at statistics, either.
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Stirf
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 26 |
best programmers, maybe program-language writers, besides these people coders only use a programming language |
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: best programmers, maybe program-language writers, besides these people coders only use a programming language
It took you 3 years to come up with an answer that doesn't make any sense?
Respect. |
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Radiant
Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 639 |
I could come up with an answer in any given time I guess, though I don't know much about sensemaking in general I do produce relevant posts from time to time. Ah, the wonders of living in a small town. |
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hannenz
Account closed
Registered: Nov 2002
Posts: 24 |
Quote: This is my question: Who are the better programmers?
simple question: it's me |
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Oswald
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 5094 |
this topic should be locked |
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Wildstar
Registered: Nov 2004
Posts: 50 |
Quote: well, the list of "better" programmers is quite long, i think. and you have to distinguish between game- and demo-coders (or programmers).
as far as i know, the problem between these two terms "coder" and "programmer" was discussed at lemon.
by the way: why do you want to know this? and why do you ask at all, because you'll never get an objective answer, and you won't get it when you look at statistics, either.
Have no idea which thread....
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JackAsser
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 2014 |
See the screen limit thread... |
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jailbird
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1578 |
Quote: this topic should be locked
>,-<-O Oswald
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: >,-<-O Oswald
LMFAO. |
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yago
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 333 |
Oh noo!
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Laxity
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 459 |
Better than who? |
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pernod
Account closed
Registered: Nov 2004
Posts: 25 |
I know over a thousand POKEs.
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: I know over a thousand POKEs.
Name them. I dare you! |
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
Quote: Name them. I dare you!
:D |
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Monte Carlos
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 359 |
i've read 100 tips and tricks in 46er magazin |
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: i've read 100 tips and tricks in 46er magazin
46er magazin? Is that like 'Dolce & Cabana' clothing, not quite like the original? |
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Scout
Registered: Dec 2002
Posts: 1570 |
Quote: 46er magazin? Is that like 'Dolce & Cabana' clothing, not quite like the original?
I guess he read the fake label version of 64er. |
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_V_
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 124 |
I guess for most of the scene coders, Xbow = God. He made such a truckload of cool, innovative routines which really pushed the old cpu to the limit. Impossible is a magic word for him - it makes him want to actually do it, and he always succeeds. However, his forte are rastertiming routines, which most people consider "oldskool" these days.
Enter Graham. He's my favourite because he was the first to realise "newskool" effects at big resolutions and speeds. The distorter in Parts still kills me =D, Dawnfall dropped several jaws upon its release (I'm still looking for mine), Oneder was a wonder and let's not forget all the Coma Lights he and TTS (another killer coder who went on to Amiga and beyond) created.
Those are the "arche-coders" as far as I'm concerned (I'm not talking about game coders, of which some were also really good). Which brings me to the "new generation":
Krill is extremely good at Graham's routines, and manages to take them a step further or come up with very interesting variations. Oswald has big, fast vectors through various optimisation tricks and made the most incredible Phong face ever seen in lots of colours. He's also not scared of the odd math effect. HCL is a great all-round coder - I've seen him do anything from oldskool to newskool and maths. Ninja, who I had the pleasure to meet at Breakpoint, made a few very nice pieces of code, no contest, and some sweet 256b routines. WVL, whose next demo is greatly anticipated. And, best of all - he's a physicist like me, so he actually is the very best coder out there ;) ;) ;). Cruzer, a very good coder from ways ago, comes back and keeps the goodness coming.
... those are some great coders I respect (and can come up with at the moment). Don't shoot me for forgetting a few (I left out the coders from my groups for the obvious reason, but I respect them all a lot as well). |
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Style
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 498 |
You forgot me. My 1x1 scroller is teh rular. Or at least it wouldve been had I not run out of rastertime halfway across the screen. |
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: You forgot me. My 1x1 scroller is teh rular. Or at least it wouldve been had I not run out of rastertime halfway across the screen.
You're credited with four releases that were written thirteen years ago. What's your excuse for even being here? Oh yea, Chrome is a forum sceners group :)
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Style
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 498 |
Didnt you leave?
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stash
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 343 |
wdr+secretman= ghost unit
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Wanderer
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2003
Posts: 478 |
Quote: Didnt you leave?
I found a few small programs of mine that needed uploading on an FTP site. Tonight I've deleted my beloved CCS64. So this will be my final login to CSDB. The password is set to be changed by my maintainer so only they can access it for the odd upload, etc.
Before I go though, I should really leave you with some food for thought. :D
The first thing I did when I came back to the C64 was immediately work on new material. When it came out, both you and Slarti McStalker criticized it where most others appreciated the effort. When I looked to see what you two were capable of doing, I saw NOTHING but a 13 year period of nothing. Beyond lame. What work I did see, was really weak coding though. So I suppose it's just as well that you insult other people's code with nothing to show for yourself :D Personally I think you're too afraid to even try.
Slarti once stated in a message that Chrome is Australia's only demo group. I disagree; Chrome isn't a demo group, it's a forum group. W00t! :)
As much fun as the two of you were to slap around (you did choose to attack me first), Slarti practically begged me the other day to stop. It was the icing on the cake and coincided nicely with my decision to stop programming too. It was like he reached the breaking point at the same time I chose to stop coding. Poor guy won't even bring my handle up any more like he used to, but I suspect once I leave he will do it in bouts for months to come :) Anything to ease the pain.
So try to put something out in the next 13 years okay Simon? That way if I find more time to code and decide to resume coding, I can compare it to something post-1993.
Cheers! And yes you may have the last word. |
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Style
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 498 |
God, still crying. You have no clue what we're up to - but Im not gonna bother defending myself to a dickweed.
Is this the last last last time youre leaving? Really? Really really?
Bye bye then
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
Quote: I found a few small programs of mine that needed uploading on an FTP site. Tonight I've deleted my beloved CCS64. So this will be my final login to CSDB. The password is set to be changed by my maintainer so only they can access it for the odd upload, etc.
Before I go though, I should really leave you with some food for thought. :D
The first thing I did when I came back to the C64 was immediately work on new material. When it came out, both you and Slarti McStalker criticized it where most others appreciated the effort. When I looked to see what you two were capable of doing, I saw NOTHING but a 13 year period of nothing. Beyond lame. What work I did see, was really weak coding though. So I suppose it's just as well that you insult other people's code with nothing to show for yourself :D Personally I think you're too afraid to even try.
Slarti once stated in a message that Chrome is Australia's only demo group. I disagree; Chrome isn't a demo group, it's a forum group. W00t! :)
As much fun as the two of you were to slap around (you did choose to attack me first), Slarti practically begged me the other day to stop. It was the icing on the cake and coincided nicely with my decision to stop programming too. It was like he reached the breaking point at the same time I chose to stop coding. Poor guy won't even bring my handle up any more like he used to, but I suspect once I leave he will do it in bouts for months to come :) Anything to ease the pain.
So try to put something out in the next 13 years okay Simon? That way if I find more time to code and decide to resume coding, I can compare it to something post-1993.
Cheers! And yes you may have the last word.
Um, your "maintainer"?
BTW, I didn't actually get in touch with you at all WDR, who knows what that's about.
Anyway, I don't think any of us have a last word for you, sorry.
C U Next Time
STA BLE |
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SIDWAVE
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2238 |
To answer the original question: I am the best programmer of all! |
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Style
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 498 |
Quote: To answer the original question: I am the best programmer of all!
No! Tis me! f001!!!one!!!
Actually my vote goes to Xbow, with Graham a close second. Altho if Xbow doesnt pull his finger out and release something soon, he may lose the crown :)
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stash
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 343 |
finnaly this retard is gone.. be gone now |
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Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2980 |
_V_: Yes, i can only copy and improve Graham's routines, and Oswald can only do maths stuff, Xbow can only do raster stuff, and HCL owns us all.
Seriously, today i divide into coders who could code great routines of anything if they wanted to (most of those you named belong to that category, plus Jackasser), those who are very good in one or some special fields (only some of those you mentioned), and those who are improving and will maybe end up in one of the first categories. |
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Slartibartfast
Account closed
Registered: Jul 2002
Posts: 230 |
So wise. |
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HCL
Registered: Feb 2003
Posts: 728 |
..as if _V_ would know shit about coding ;). Myself, i'm not so interested in who is the *best* coder. I'm more demo-oriented, and then it's more a question of being able to cooperate with odd and strange people, like.. musicians and graphichans ;). You don't need to be the best of anything to make the best demos. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: |
The best coders are the ones who get stuff finished... =-) |
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Monte Carlos
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 359 |
i never get my stuff finished...
but hopefully time will come!
Monte |
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Style
Registered: Jun 2004
Posts: 498 |
You and me both pal. Ive got so much unreleased code Im thinking perhaps I should make something out of it all :) |
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_V_
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 124 |
Krill, HCL: Whoops, I must apologise for having a _personal opinion_. At no point did I claim that mentioned coders were only good in mentioned areas. It are simply the areas in which they created parts that had a great impact on me, personally, and which I still enjoy to watch to this day. The post was _not_ a general, objective, scientific overview of the c64 demo coding scene, it was a subjective shoutout to coders I respect (and the parts I respect them for).
But, if _that_ can be interpreted as a sort of insult (and apparently, it can), then know that I'd be more than happy to continue the profanities. Because those are _my_ two cents. |
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Krill
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 2980 |
_V_: Ah no insult taken :D I understood your point now. Go on :D |
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Bone
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2006
Posts: 5 |
Best demo coder is Mr.Mad from Wiseguy Industries 2015.
New Record+ is a good example
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
Quote: Best demo coder is Mr.Mad from Wiseguy Industries 2015.
New Record+ is a good example
Absolutely. Now gimme some of them xtc pills you've obviously been taking. |
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Danzig
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 440 |
The topic of this thread is soo... sooo.... *DUMB*
we have to take "evolution" into the approach to find a answer fitting to this question...
What I mean is, f.e. Lukullus/FCS did some fancy Border-Effects in the middle 80ties any coder today can code in 15 minutes,
but switch back 20 years ago and count the coders that could have done the same back then??? Just a few...
Or f.e. take into consideration the "age" a coder has reached,not physically but scenewise... coders hangin around for over 15 years or even longer.. In this comparison I guess Krill has gone very far in a short period of time.
In my very own opinion those coders who did most especially FOR the evolution are the "best" and therefore the "ANCIENT" ones deserve the spot.
So maybe we should just name those who brought the special "Chapters" of C64-coding to the maximum. (Math, VIC-Fx, etc.)
And they are far too many to name 'em all :)
And remember: This is just MY personal opinion...
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Wile Coyote
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2004
Posts: 646 |
If i had a gun held to my head and i had to pick one coder that is good interms of pushing the Commodore 64 to the limit in terms of making me think 'hows that done?' then i would have to go with Crossbow.
The very first ifli image i got to see was of Samfox, i think it was the 1st ifli on the Commodore 64. The image was possibly wired, as i don't think there was an ifli editor around at the time. Uzzy of Entropy was there speaking about the image and how there was zero raster time left and there was talk of, well i can't see ilfi's taking off and appearing in demos. Then some time after, Krestology apprives and we get to see ifli's scrolling up and down, stretch, sprites moving over the top, upper and lower borders open. Crossbow behind it all. Then after Crossbow does it, other coders manage it.
Other then Crossbow, Graham is very good too, and from what i can gather better then Crossbow in the 3D area, as that's Crossbows weakness.
The Samfox ifli, i don't know what the demo is called. I think it is just a single prg file. |
