Log inRegister an accountBrowse CSDbHelp & documentationFacts & StatisticsThe forumsAvailable RSS-feeds on CSDbSupport CSDb Commodore 64 Scene Database
You are not logged in 
CSDb User Forums


Forums > CSDb Discussions > The obskure 1st release world!
2019-03-06 19:43
E$G

Registered: Dec 2007
Posts: 445
The obskure 1st release world!

Dear sceners & overall 1st release site & mags editors,
few days ago we went for a 1st release proposing and old game that we improved as we usually like to do:
Zig-Zag +2DG

Few hours later Hedning/GP u/l an old crack of the same game:
Zig-Zag

concerning to the rulez this automatically set our release as not to be 1st one.

No matter, we enjoyed the fun in do it and the positive feedback that most of time receive. But our target was not reached.

So please I like to know:
- is it correct that if an old crack pop up after the release that until that time wasn't available in the usual dbase vaults clean his value? I'm talking about mainly csdb &gb64.

- what is the exact/correct time that an old release can be resurrected to kill a 1st release - I said this because in my 12k double side old snail mail trade floppies I remember to have some of the 1st releases of last 6 years cracked by old group/sceners, but due to my lack of time probably will be buried with me!

- if there are no rulez about this yet, to finalize the perfection of 1st release system it will be nice to make suggestion about it.

I remember to the kind readers that there are some collection that are not shared yet or will remain pri-vate as request by the suppliers. Many unreleased side belong to Mason, Hedning, the transfer team and so on.
I don't point my finger to them because I know that free time suck and after the transfer a lot more must be spent to u/l in a decent way to our csdb.

Last but not least it will be useful to have a list of the dir contents to avoid waste of time.

This is my humble opinion of course. It could also happen that after the adrenaline rush when a new game is released most of 1st release group prefere this kind of risk.
Anyway I have great expectations about more clear rulez.

ThanX

E$G/ Hokuto Force
 
... 37 posts hidden. Click here to view all posts....
 
2019-03-09 23:44
spider-j

Registered: Oct 2004
Posts: 186
Quoting hedning
learn, and you might find it fun.

Hm. Don't know if I missed sth. the last time I tried (what has been a while ago I admit), but I couldn't figure out a way to upload from my C64. Using some weird PETSCII terminal emulation on my PC wasn't exactly what I'd describe as "fun".

Sorry for side discussion here.
2019-03-10 07:02
Hein

Registered: Apr 2004
Posts: 839
The obskure 1st release game, starring:
Programmer: It has to be exact.
Organizer: Let the people decide.
Artist: I'll decide, thank you.
Hoarder: These are all gems.
Lurker: You guys crack me up.
2019-03-10 18:03
Tim

Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 466
Happy (late) birthday Esg :)

I think everyone involved in first releases will have stepped into this trap once or twice.

No points seems fair, although shitty after hard work, I'm sure a release will still get honorable mentions from Propalist and VN though.

That said, perhaps Hedning and Jazzcat can define some rules as to what does or does not qualify for minus points.. As I'm not entirely sure how those are counted.

As for motivating charts, quality point system, etc. I think it's safe to say everyone cracking wants to see a modern version of gamers guide.. buuut no one wants to put in the hard effort of making that.
2019-03-10 21:01
Mason

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 426
Quote: Dear sceners & overall 1st release site & mags editors,
few days ago we went for a 1st release proposing and old game that we improved as we usually like to do:
Zig-Zag +2DG

Few hours later Hedning/GP u/l an old crack of the same game:
Zig-Zag

concerning to the rulez this automatically set our release as not to be 1st one.

No matter, we enjoyed the fun in do it and the positive feedback that most of time receive. But our target was not reached.

So please I like to know:
- is it correct that if an old crack pop up after the release that until that time wasn't available in the usual dbase vaults clean his value? I'm talking about mainly csdb &gb64.

- what is the exact/correct time that an old release can be resurrected to kill a 1st release - I said this because in my 12k double side old snail mail trade floppies I remember to have some of the 1st releases of last 6 years cracked by old group/sceners, but due to my lack of time probably will be buried with me!

- if there are no rulez about this yet, to finalize the perfection of 1st release system it will be nice to make suggestion about it.

I remember to the kind readers that there are some collection that are not shared yet or will remain pri-vate as request by the suppliers. Many unreleased side belong to Mason, Hedning, the transfer team and so on.
I don't point my finger to them because I know that free time suck and after the transfer a lot more must be spent to u/l in a decent way to our csdb.

Last but not least it will be useful to have a list of the dir contents to avoid waste of time.

This is my humble opinion of course. It could also happen that after the adrenaline rush when a new game is released most of 1st release group prefere this kind of risk.
Anyway I have great expectations about more clear rulez.

ThanX

E$G/ Hokuto Force


When I saw you guys released Thomas The Tank Engine's Fun With Words I told one of my great friends that I was almost sure I have seen a crack of it back then. Suddenly one day some weeks ago I saw it on a disk

Same with this game and a few others I still think they will show up someday:

Multi-Player Soccer Manager +MD

It's a bit of a gamble releasing those games as they might show up one day on a disk
2019-03-11 06:48
Jazzcat

Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 966
Quote: Quoting Jazzcat
TheRyk: Upload to the boards. This has existed before the internet became public and before many even chose their first handle. Follow it or don't.
Let's forget the ghosts of the past and focus on the future.


You have moved to the PC scene? :P
2019-03-11 09:51
hedning

Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 2034
Quote: You have moved to the PC scene? :P

:D +1
2019-03-11 22:59
Bacchus

Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 99
Drawback of CSDb discussions is that you cannot post GIFs of people eating popcorn ;-)

=> I think one part is really clear; if a game was cracked and released to the general public before then the firstie was claimed by that release. If the game is not on CSDb then, please mind that whereas they want to have a full history, it's not there yet. So just scanning CSDb will not cut it. It's *scene* first release - not *CSDb* first release.

=> You can still have arguments if the old crack didn't make today's standards. Most notably if the game isn't file copyable. Was the old crack proper? By that times standard possible, but not by today's standards.

=> It's really strange that CDSB has the firstie flag in the first place as this is the centrepiece of release scene controversy. If CSDb is not being involved in scene politics but still providing a field that is truly disputed, then it's forever difficult to stay out of politics. Especially when CSDb moderators change it. While claiming not to be part of politics. That is plain silly. Defies all logic.

=> Again, please mind, firstie on CSDb is basically only an opinion of the poster. Rather than delete it I would say "First release claimed" and then everybody can make their own mind and the lists can disregard the claim if they find it to be false. Or "First release as per xxx". Just "first release" is not a fact but a disputed opinion and databases really shouldn't contain disputed opinions.

=> Isn't the key effort now to make versions that beat the old version? What N0S and Rememeber are doing is contributing MUCH more to the spirit that the chase for firsties. The efforts to produce EasyFlash version drastically improve the playability even if they are not first.


/Pontus "Bacchus" Berg

PS: I'm not against the running for first, I'm against that being the only merit of a release. For me that's merely ONE aspect. AND, if the running for first, basing this is a totally ridiculous system of BBSes that are totally unreliable and where a objective timestamp is basically not possible I what disturbs me. I want competition on releases, be it EasyFlash, REU, Firsties, Shortest, supporting most drives or whichever dimension of release you favour, but first first the MUST be a real and solid way to determine an undisputed time for a release and BBSes are not part of that.

Having said that, I still think it's great if current commercial software is only spread amongst the BBSes. THAT'S the role I still fell the BBSes can fill. Just don't expect me to ever visit one ...
2019-03-11 23:41
TheRyk

Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 569


The argument "BBSes have been there before the Internet." Well, stone engraving has been around longer than floppy discs... I think, you see what I'm aiming at.
Quoting 'Jazzcat'
Follow it or don't.

I'd rather not
- unless:
Quoting 'Bacchus'
commercial software

Bacchus really has a point there. And this is good news as BBSes might have enough sense to exist because of that only reason, so no one needs to fear they die (though I must admit I would probably not cry as much as others if that was ever going to happen). Bacchus also nailed the current situation in general very well. I actually doubt that anything Bacchus states in that posting can be denied even by the biggest BBS fetishists.

[OffTopic] (as gamer's perspective does not matter in any charts)
At the end of the day, beside the questions
- who has the coolest intro,
- who was the fastest to upload on whatever media,
- who has the highest street scene credibility,
- who violated whatever fancy standards,
- who has got the longest schlong,
cracks are meant to be _played_.
As I once was a gamer and still actually play C64 games, even on real hardware (though not as often as I should), I assure you that all these questions have hardly ever played a role when I (as a gamer) had the choice to pick from a bunch of cracks of the same game by various groups.
[/off]
2019-03-12 00:51
Groepaz

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 9098
Quote:
who has got the longest schlong

case closed :)
2019-03-12 08:42
Claus_2015

Registered: Oct 2012
Posts: 30
Quote: You have moved to the PC scene? :P

You know that you are in a retro forum, when the PC scene is seen as "the future" \o/
Previous - 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 - Next
RefreshSubscribe to this thread:

You need to be logged in to post in the forum.

Search the forum:
Search   for   in  
All times are CET.
Search CSDb
Advanced
Users Online
iceladoftide
hedning/G★P
Knut Clausen/SHAPE/F..
AMB/Level 64
Mr. SID
Merlin/JAM
Marvin/DPS
JCH/Vibrants
Guests online: 39
Top Demos
1 Uncensored  (9.7)
2 Unboxed  (9.7)
3 Edge of Disgrace  (9.7)
4 Coma Light 13  (9.6)
5 Comaland 100%  (9.6)
6 Lunatico  (9.6)
7 The Shores of Reflec..  (9.6)
8 X Marks the Spot  (9.5)
9 Old Men in Used Cars  (9.5)
10 C=Bit 18  (9.5)
Top onefile Demos
1 Bad Boy  (9.7)
2 Smile to the Sky  (9.6)
3 Daah, Those Acid Pil..  (9.5)
4 Dawnfall V1.1  (9.4)
5 FMX Music Demo  (9.4)
6 Rewind  (9.4)
7 Crystal Gazer  (9.4)
8 Official X2018 Report  (9.4)
9 Arok 20 Invitation  (9.4)
10 Pandemoniac Part 2 o..  (9.4)
Top Groups
1 PriorArt  (9.7)
2 Oxyron  (9.5)
3 Booze Design  (9.4)
4 Censor Design  (9.3)
5 Performers  (9.3)
Top Original Suppliers
1 hedning  (9.8)
2 Derbyshire Ram  (9.4)
3 Irata  (9.2)
4 Fungus  (9.1)
5 Jazzcat  (9.1)

Home - Disclaimer
Copyright © No Name 2001-2019
Page generated in: 0.065 sec.